Where is the money going to come from to meet the UK people expectations?

[Pandersmum]

So assuming that:

• everyone who receives disability benefits needs them and may actually believe they should be entitled to more
• pensioner benefits are non negotiable and again many believe they should be greater than current
• working people (most) believe they are already taxed highly and believe they cannot be taxed any more without further impact to their feeling of unfairness and resentment of the system
• it is unreasonable to expect young people with ADHD or other similar ND disorders / mental health challenges to work, even if they have qualifications and therefore they must be financially supported by the state
• Mental health challenges are very real in any age of person and therefore they must be financially supported by the state and if in work, by their employers
• rent (whatever level) should be supported by the state because it is a basic right to have a home
• NHS treatment (& the best treatment) should be free be all, no matter how expensive it is or whatever their age because people pay their taxes
• businesses are businesses and are there to make profits for their owners - therefore they can choose which country they operate in / pay their taxes in - if they don’t like the UK tax system, they can move somewhere else
• ’in work benefits’ are necessary to support ‘low paid workers, often in essential jobs’ to gain similar amounts of financial remuneration to those on benefits
• high net worth individuals can move if they don’t like the UK tax system

So just where is the money going to come from to fund the UK population of financial expectation of what the state should provide?

It's basically only those who can't be bothered to plan whose estates end up paying it.

Or those who think their kids getting a tax free six figure windfall and 60% of the rest is enough.

Thanks for that @DrPrunesqualer. Those things haven't helped but I don't think they are the key factors which have made things increasingly hard for younger people.

Wages have been stagnant since the GFC and have fallen a lot in real terms for the majority. Only the very lucky have had real rises. This, combined with the success fiver governments since the late 80s and even worse from the early 90s, putting deliberate rockets under the housing market has meant that affordability of a basic necessity (housing) has simply become unaffordable to the majority, unless they have access to family money. This problem has been obvious for a very long time but has continued to be encouraged by governments regardless. High rents haven't helped and more recently, LLs have been taxed more but I think this mostly comes back to stagnant incomes relative to the cost of living. I agree re the issues with zero hour contracts. The 'gig economy' arose after we switched from a manufacturing economy to a heavily serviced based one (plus the City of London and a housing market). All those skilled and fairly skilled people who used to work in manufacturing based industries lost their livelihoods and ended up being taken advantage of my large firms providing low pay and low or now security. This was also an after effect of Thatcher's beating down the unions in the 80s.
I don't really agree with your working week comment. I think I mentioned 'deaths of despair' in the US and 'lying flat' in China. This isn't because the current younger generation is just lazy. It's obviously a response to their circumstances, some of which I have described above.

There are major underlying problems with the economy imo, which I won't go into, but these have been massively worsened by the policies of governments and bakers.

If you happen to have time, I would be interested in reading @HelloPossible's comments but I'm not busy to search at present. No worries if you are busy too! I hope some of this makes sense as writing in haste.

Yes. Too many people are motivated mainly by greed and selfishness though and don't think that inheriting up to a million tax free is enough!

It has to be a mix of things.

1. We need to stop using government money to support poorly functioning private companies. I think privatisation was a disaster for the UK.

1. We need to have honest conversations about what the NHS is for. It isn't a failure when people die. Whether it's appropriate to fund the most expensive drugs for the last few years of life. Whether some things should have some element of copay.

1. We need an honest conversation about social care.

1. We need to have a serious think about the triple lock etc

1. Social housing is in short supply, we need to make access fairer and less permanent. I know this is an unpopular view but it is an unfair system at present.

We can't have our cake and eat it. We don't want immigrants, so that means we need to pay more (higher pay) for things like social care. That means personally, when we access it. So chose what you want.

I also think taxing the very large companies would be great but I'm just not sure it'd be possible. The problem is that government doesn't own anything anymore. No infrastructure, no utilities etc. They have little power over multinational countries. Even "patriots" like James Dyson, one of the largest owners of UK land dump on the UK, introducing Brexit, not paying their employees properly, let alone taxes, and don't even live here. No real skin in the game.

It isn't as simple as just taxing wealth, and IHT won't touch the 30% of all land in this country owned by aristocracy. There are different tax rules for that. No one wants their gran to pay 40% IHT on her 1m property that she bought for 200k.

Oh and rejoin the EU and stop this ridiculous immigration crap. It's a sideshow. We're a tiny country with diminishing power (since we left the EU) and wealth. Our population expects a huge amount; Champagne services on beer money.

£1m is quite a lot for most people actually. Especially if it's largely composed of wealth that has not come from "hard work/success" because it has mostly come from a property appreciating in value.

And I'm well aware that stocks and investments are taxable. I'm also aware that dividends and capital gains are not taxed as heavily as the forms of income available to working people.

As I said earlier, rather than IHT I'd sooner charge CGT as if it were income when assets are liquidated. Would mop up more of this unearned wealth.

For some people with young children and in rental accommodation, working FT on salaries less than £40-45k per annum (which is a significant number of key workers) they would actually be off not working or have marginal gain for the 37.5 hours per week they are required to work. Working parents are tired and stressed for very little gain.
For non public sector workers the pension gains can also be quite marginal.

It's basically only those who can't be bothered to plan whose estates end up paying it.

My family are not trying to avoid paying IHT & haven't done anything to mitigate it.

@TankFlyBossW4lk If gran was married and had one home, there’s no IHT to pay on £1 million. It’s also inheritance that allows many to buy houses. Without it even more would need to rent. There’s no good answers here. Also shares should be in ISAs. You can attack savings but the state then becomes grabbing. Especially as they were not supposed to be increasing taxes. Also our ISAs are our savings for retirement? It’s a huge disincentive to save and personal saving is a good thing, not a bad thing. It provides funds for industry. They employ people. Taxing without thought regarding repercussions just doesn’t work.

The whole financial edifice is now a crock of fake funded crap and politicians and bankers know it but have to pretend they don't. Even Elon Musk has advocated for a Universal Basic Income.

Ideally people have jobs that are a good fit for their skill sets. We all know a ‘square peg in a round hole’ is not going to end well.
From personal experience, some ADHD traits are very valuable to some workplace roles. But some traits are very disruptive to the workplace.
People should be encouraged to try work though,

why not focus on govts starting up more public companies to compete with the private sector to employ more people ?

basically we need to retune capitalism

there in lies part the issue is its good for society to improve technology but at the same time the pool of workers needed gets shorter and shorter etc

We need to grow the economy and cut welfare costs. Simple!

You should be chancellor.

If you cut welfare, then the people on it spend less. People with the least money spend the the most of what they have.

We don't need more houses.

We need a two tier system where overseas investors pay double the value so housing stock goes to UK based people

I agree,we need to increase tax on passive and unearned income and capital gains. It’s counter intuitive that workers pay more taxes than investors and pensioners.

@Badbadbunny But you will have pensions and be old before you know it.

Savings stop people being reliant on the state. The money is invested in companies! Thats very necessary. We cannot rob people of their savings on top of everything else. Just wait until you are old and faced with losing so much! We pay taxes too and have done for 50 plus years. It’s really envy driving this. Jealousy that some have more. The money most of us have trickles down via investments, savings. and gifts. We pay for ourselves because we can. Surely we need more who can do this, not less? We need people to fund themselves and not rely on the state!

Some many geniuses whose talents are not being used!

We aren't going to any real growth in the UK now. We need to find the fairest way to deal with the current predicament. We need to have honest discussions. Clearly, many will fight this because the negative attributes of greed and selfishness have become laudable and because the social contract has broken. Even if a government did get voted in that wanted to make major changes in the direction of increasing efficiency and fairness within this unequal and divided society (highly unlikely), it would be almost pointless because they would certainly be voted out in 4 years time.

Exactly. We should be encouraging people to work hard and increase their salaries rather than speculate on stocks or crypto or invest in property. The current tax system is a total mess.
And just to prove my point about selfishness and greed, the post below yours appears which hits most numbers on the bingo card!

But I'm not you're right here. Pensioners pay exactly the same rates of tax as anyone else, save for NI contributions if they are still in paid work.

We are middle to high earners and considering leaving as well. The quality of life here is poor in comparison to the cost of things.

Good luck with that, I’d love to know where you think is so much better and is just going to let you trot in. Every where has issues and similar complaints.

Also I think the grass is always greener for some sections of society particularly those that have always had it good maybe to the cost of other sections of society. Many people experience life abroad and then realise actually we have life pretty good here in comparison to the many draw backs in other country whether that be because of crime, climate change, guns, support by the state, health, women’s rights etc. To most of the world the UK is paradise in comparison to what they have.One day you will be old, may struggle to find work, may not be able to pay health insurance, may need to support loved ones, may have family who become ill or become ill yourself etc. Then you will look at all we have and enjoy and think you know what we’re pretty lucky.