Surviving life with a strong willed daughter

[heartsandtears]

Dd is 7 and as the title suggests she is very strong willed and as a result misses out on so much through consequences of this.
She will lose almost all promised treats and never gets any money, she loses out on play dates, screen time all while her siblings enjoy these things because she simply will not do as she’s told.
This morning for example I had promised to take her to McDonald’s after school because her sister was going home with a friend for dinner so we were going to have a treat together, she walked down the stairs in the school skirt I bought her for next winter which is currently too big, I asked her to put her dress on and she refused and I told her if she didn’t change into her school dress she wouldn’t be going to McDonalds so she decided she’d wear the too big skirt and not go to McDonald’s.
This won’t be because she doesn’t want to go it’s because she will not back down.
I want us to have a good relationship but I feel like she misses out on so much and everything seems to be a battle of wills and I just want to love her and enjoy things together but she just will not ever do as she’s told almost of a matter of principle and will eventually lose out on everything she’s looking forward to.
Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can get along with her and get her to do as she’s told?
She is so stubborn and wilful she’ll happily take any consequences as long as she gets her way.

I think the consequence for wearing the skirt is that the skirt gets put away somewhere she can’t access.

Not McDonalds

I think when other siblings are particularly well behaved, then any 'bad' behaviour by the other child is highlighted. It's not even bad behaviour sometimes, just different from the others.

Def pick your battles OP.

She's a middle child! I am one and I have one!

They are always full of character. Neither the respected older child nor the cute younger one. So gaining attention is the top priority.

As others have said, you were a bit quick to jump in with no McDonald's over the skirt. Let her go to school in it and feel an idiot - she will learn a lesson. But as soon as you make it a battle/threat she will dig her heels in. It's new skirt - children love the novelty of this and want to wear it straight away - never mind the logic of size!

We found it helped to get her on her own whenever possible. A chance to be herself rather than the middle one.

Good luck.

OP, after your argument, when things have calmed down, do you go and speak to your DD about what happened?

I have a very strong willed DD too and after a “set to” I will talk with her about why it happened. Why I punished her in a certain way and why she pushed back so much.
Sometimes, just a hug is needed and then things settle down again.

Behaviour is communication, so you need to find out what your DD is trying to communicate.

I don’t follow gentle parenting or restorative practice either- I believe the parents’ job is to parent, but strong willed girls especially have a need to be heard.

Really good post, @Christmasmorale
It can also be really hard to go against what you thought was logical or right for your own 'right' reasons because someone else has power you don't. I was a child who'd rather have taken the consequences. They seemed pointless, and it became a habit. The one I recall was having to stand in the hall next to a fireplace, face turned to the wall, instead of break/lessons. I genuinely didn't understand it, but as a daydreamer, I didn't consider it too bad a punishment at all.

Good post. What you're currently doing simply doesn't work, OP, so you need to try something else, even if it's different to what you do with your other children.

You need a list of things that are non negotiable so tidy your room, no food upstairs, clear away your supper dishes, clear away toys, be respectful and then whatever reward you choose so all are clear. Then you pick battles, so wearing a winter skirt on a hot day, you can say it's not a great idea but let her get on with-it, not doing homework ok then you take the consequences. I always had mum speak, so saying this is the mum in me talking, it is daft not to wear a coat but it is up to you but do not complain when you are wet and cold. Step back a bit.

I'm going to get into a big disagreement on here but I would use smacking after repeated refusal to do as she's told. I myself used it when parenting my children in England. Now they are all grown adults who have smashed school and uni and are having thriving careers.

Thats absolutely not ok with me. I might not be getting it right at the moment but I will not harm my child.

I’m not saying it is this, but might be worth a read about PDA pathological demand avoidance. Our daughter is being assessed soon so I’m not an expert but some of your comments ring true with us. Rewards and consequences have never worked with her. Low demand parenting, declarative language can help.

So if you have a disagreement with your DH, you do something he doesn't agree with or you refuse to do something .... you're ok with him giving you a slap or two?

So daughter refuses to change and you just walk up to her and slap her? Awful, can’t wait until this soon becomes illegal.

Sounds like you are both defiant.
Raising a strong willed child isn't easy, I have one. Breaking their spirit doesn't win any prizes.
I use the choice theory method, now DS 10, still strong willed, is a pleasure most of the time.
Pick your battles, you're the adult.
We need strong willed people in the world, someone has to raise them.

Honestly a child like this would probably hit back anyway if someone slaps her

So even if that was right (which I don't think it is) it wouldn't work

My strong-willed dd would argue the hind leg off a donkey if I let her. But you have to walk away and not let that happen. You will only engage if your dd expresses herself respectfully.

What she really wanted though, and why she was defiant in the first place, was that she wanted more autonomy and choice in decision-making and independence that it would be appropriate for a child of seven, or ten or 12 to have. They are usually bright these dc. Frustration drives the boundary-pushing. So what you have to do is keep giving them activities that are just slightly above their competence level and give them responsibility and choices but within the confines of home, a sport or activity. And choose your battles carefully.

You have to have a strong boundary and clamp down on anything life threatening, but other than that, it’s often not necessary to make them compliant for compliance’s sake.

Talk through the issues with them. Is that a good idea? If so why? Give them the power to make the decision once they are aware of the pros and cons. Say things like “I trust you to make an intelligent decision”. Let them suffer the consequences though when it goes wrong and don’t rescue them from that.

And most important of all, it’s very easy to take their non-compliance very personally and feel that they are doing it deliberately to cause you grief. And yes there may be an element of seeking power and one upmanship by winding you up, but usually their outside behaviour is a reflection of what’s going on internally. So step back slightly, pause, breathe, tell her you will get back to her if you have to, rather than make instant responses, slow it all down and be very objective in how you respond. Don’t stoke the fire by allowing yourself to feel hurt. Try and look at this dispassionately as a normal albeit demanding parenting phase that will improve with time. And get up every day wiping the slate clean and expecting positive things from them. Regular one on one interaction will help.

As a parent of a “strong-willed” daughter I get the frustration. It took me many years to realise that:

• natural, intended consequences are the best way for a child to learn
• pick your battles
• you cannot control your child, only guide them
• the only person you can control is yourself
• always talk about the behaviour you’re unhappy with, not the child (one child is not good and the other bad for example).
• nobody wins in a battle of wills
• make time to bond with them 1:1 (this should not be a reward, this should be a given)
• say yes more than no

you have two ‘compliant’ children (let’s not use good and bad) so it’s easier with them.

but that ability to stand their ground and speak their mind will stand them in good stead when they’re an adult.

take time out for yourself, look at parenting and anger management classes.

mine is now a successful and kind adult and we have a close relationship after several fraught years.

My third daughter was like this when she was younger, it was absolutely exhausting because sometimes you just want to say something and they do it rather than every single little thing being a battle. No bribe or threat ever worked with her, it was just "no, no, NO" to everything.

She's now 13 and much easier because she now realises why I ask her to do things for the most part. She is much more reasonable and even if she doesn't want to do something she usually just moans but then does it anyway. She has a very strong sense of justice/right and wrong and will absolutely stand up for anyone if she thinks they are being wronged. She'll go far I'm sure!

...she loses out on play dates

That's a bit worrying. She loses out on opportunities to be herself with friends, who don't have the baggage of relationships with her 2 sisters and their behaviour. Those opportunities are really valuable and will be something she cares about, so could develop more cooperation.

When my daughter was around 3, I was parked next to an expensive super car and my daughter was kicking off refusing one thing or another.

I then saw the owner of the car walking towards me and I thought ‘that’s all I need…him joining in worried about his car’. He came up to me calmly and said ‘her attitude that makes you frustrated today, will make you proud tomorrow…just try not to scratch my car in the meantime’ he then stepped back and waited for me to sort things out and waved me off when I finally got in the car.

my daughter is now nearly 14 and he was right. Raising a strong willed daughter is not easy but as others have mentioned, pick your battles and let them fail safely. Giving her responsibility and independence helped massively.

looking back, I was a strong willed child and was always made ‘playground supervisor’ or ‘anti bullying ambassador’ which I thrived on. My daughter was given similar responsibilities. I often wonder if teachers do that deliberately as they know how best handle the strong willed ones.

as a follow on…bribing never worked with her either!

I have a strong willed daughter (who would only wear what she wanted to wear as a toddler, and beyond, for example). I took the view that she would be a great and assertive adult and I didn’t want her to lose that by making her be a compliant child. I have tended to go with letting her live with the consequences of her own decisions (superhero costume in the winter = cold, but then less likely to do it again) plus we do lots of negotiation. Obviously, some things aren’t up for discussion but there often can be a compromise.

So in your example, if she wants to wear the skirt that’s too big she would find out for herself why that wasn’t a great idea if it fell down or whatever the issue was.

She’s now 14 and still great. She still tests boundaries from time to time (she recently took several inches off her school skirt and rehemmed it without telling or asking us) but is very independent and capable, with strong friendships.

The skirt example you should have picked your battles. If it was ridiculously big it would have fell down before she left the house so if it didn't really what was the harm?
It sounds like you are both stubborn and stuck in a cycle. What you are doing isn't working it might work with your other kids but they are different people and the danger is she grows up thinking she's the 'bad one'. I'd praise the good behaviour and ignore anything minor where she just wants her own way. It's interesting you say the room has to be tidy because her sister likes it tidy (lets face it most of us would). But this child doesn't so in her eyes you are siding with her sibling I'd let her keep her half how she wants say nothing and she will probably tidy it herself out of embarrassment if they have friends over

Consequences work better than punishments. The consequence of her wearing a too big skirt is that she’ll be uncomfortable for the day and have to keep adjusting it etc. Explain that to her and if she makes that choice anyway then let her get on with unless it’s a choice that will cause actual harm to her. I’d remove the too big skirt though and make sure she has couple options of suitable clothes and that way she still feels that she has control of her clothes etc without it causing issues.

I have had some really good advice so far. I will try and let things go a little bit but I do worry that my other 2 who do behave won’t be happy if they’ve been asked not to do something and not done it and she has done as she pleases with no consequence.
And what would you say a natural consequence for hitting her sister would be? Because picking battles is one thing but this needs to stop and is where most of her privileges get taken away but doesn’t actually prevent her in the future.

My strong willed DD is an amazing performer so we have just diverted her energy into that and she gets to shine on a stage and her more sensitive siblings than feel proud of her. She basically needs a challenge other than challenging those around her.