To be unsure what neurotypical is anymore

[rainingitspouring2]

So this is not to antagonise or offend and maybe it could be because I am on the spectrum myself (but this has never been implied) but I am starting to question what being neurotypical looks like these days.

On social media so many of my suggested reels, posts etc are about neurodivergence and also articles in the media etc. Celebs revealing they have adhd or dyslexia. I have to say a lot of it is relatable to some degree to most people (that I know anyway). I have 2 young DS and so many of their friends have potential ADHD/ASD according to their parents. Or I notice traits in kids but their parents have never said anything (but I would just think they were a neurotypical kid if I didn't have so much awareness now) Even some the parents at the school gate are saying they have some neurodivergence too. So I am finding myself noticing potential traits in almost every individual I have close contact with.
I know people say with neurodivergence 'birds of a feather flock together' perhaps that is the case but I'm just loosing sight of what a neurotypical and what isn't.
I'd almost find it helpful if we had traits of neurotypicals outlined explicitly to see whether we aligne with that or not. I am getting quite confused.
Does anyone else feel the same or AIBU? Again not meaning to offend just looking to discuss

That's interesting Iv never heard anyone on here or in life say a number like my child has autism 3.

I think the autism levels may be an American thing? Level 1 = what was Aspergers (high masking, low support needs), right through to Level 3 which is profound Autism, very high support needs.

My (UK) diagnosis is 'Autism Spectrum Disorder without intellectual impairment'.

It's a difficult condition to work with and get people to fully understand, as it is so broad. And also suggests that you cannot really truly suffer if you are 'only' Level 1.

There is a common saying in the autistic community which is that if you have met one person with autism, you have met one person with autism.

Personally I have mixed views about the explosion of ND content creators, as on the one hand it raises much needed awareness, but on the other it can drastically minimise what it is really like to live with the condition and can gloss over the more distressing parts such as suicidal ideation, meltdowns.

No but we do have a care classification of high, medium, low so there is a framework. I’ve yet to meet someone with high needs who didn’t have autism and other diagnoses here.

Wow. I was a little apprehensive to post but this conversation has been really eye opening from so many different angels. Really enjoying this discussion and appreciate the respect we are all showing one another... I've learnt a lot today

The bar for clinical diagnosis of autism or ADHD or other neurodivergences is actually not low. It has to have a significant impact on a person's life - which is why even autistic people who have low support needs are disabled. And people who don't meet that threshold are neurotypical. That doesn't mean they will always find life easy, or will always feel like they fit in.

Everyone can identify traits in themselves that map onto neurodivergence. It's a much smaller group of people for whom these reach a level of "significant impact." Of course, some of those people won't have been diagnosed as children and for those people late diagnosis is so valuable. And people with low support needs still need diagnoses and support.

I try to explain this with me and my DH, who is AuDHD. I can be untidy and disorganised with stuff - I annoy myself by losing stuff more often than I'd like and wish I was naturally tidier. But he literally cannot grasp the idea that things should have places. If he puts something down, it's like it disappears. I don't love making unsolicited phonecalls, but he's sometimes so stressed and focused on the mechanics of the phonecall and the conversation that he can't process the information he's being told.

No it isn’t. In the US support needs are classified to 1,2 and 3 which is a bit pointless and unreliable as that can vary throughout life. Think my dc has been all 3 levels.

Neurotypical people experience adhd like symptoms when they have stressful events in their life, they will struggle with executive dysfunction; once the stress passes so does the ADHD like symptoms.

People with ADHD suffer with executive dysfunction consistently, the severity may fluctuate but the symptoms will always be present.

Because of posts on social media, everyone thinks they have ADHD due to the above, as they can relate to ADHD symptoms at some points in their life. If everyone was to be assessed a lot would not get the diagnosis.

This makes it difficult for people struggling to come forward with ADHD as “everyone has it”. It’s unfair, ADHD can cause significant damage in someone’s life if not managed.

I agree totally OP. My reply isn’t meant to shit on anyone who struggles but I want to sum up how it makes me feel as someone who’s neurodivergence has ruined my life completely.

The criteria for diagnosis and treatment of ADHD and autism is that the symptoms must have a significant impact on you being able to live your life day to day. If they do not, regardless of “where you are on the spectrum”, you do not get a diagnosis.

i have failed in school and college multiple times, lost far too many jobs to count due to my lack of attention to detail and ability to stay engaged and focussed. It’s so bad that I have tried to kill myself twice because no one could tell me what was wrong with me and I thought I was too stupid and mentally ill to live a normal life.

EVERYONE can show traits of ADHD, but not everyone has their life ruined by it constantly, however I think a lot of people with minor traits and who struggle slightly but actually cope perfectly well day to day watch these reels and decide they must also have ADHD as a fun quirk and something that gets them concessions at school and work. The issue with that is it totally diminishes just how bloody hard it can be for people who it really impacts because now “everyone has it”, it overwhelms the very services that are there to support the people who rely on it to function day to day so they are suffering while waiting for appointments and medication, and it complicates what can be encompassed within the spectrum of ADHD and autism which is actually much narrower than it’s made out to be (e.g. losing your keys occasionally and having to write lists while disliking one food item doesn’t even get you close to the spectrum, nevermind on it)

I can’t say that this doesn’t piss me off because it does. I spent years and years struggling through school while my peers swanned through life, only for some of them to now be harping on about how they are a “little bit OCD” or “poppies it’s my ADHD”. No it’s fucking not Sharon!

That said it is also completely open to interpretation and the general lay person like me, even with how badly it impacts me, isn’t qualified at all to make the distinction for others. The only people who should be interpreting whether “everyone” suddenly has ADHD are the people who are actually qualified to diagnose it.

A friend of mine (she has ADHD I have ASD) has a theory that 80% + of humans are ND, but the world is being run by a small number of psychopaths putting more and more pressure on us for a laugh to see when and how we break. She told me this over ten years ago, and I thought she was bonkers. Not so sure now.

I think this is a good analogy actually - everyone will have some traits, but for most people it doesn’t reach the threshold of a “disorder”. Just as everyone feels anxious some of the time, but that is not the same as having GAD or OCD.

Which explains why everyone does those online quizzes and thinks “oh that could apply to anyone” when they aren’t autistic.

15 - 20% of people are thought to be neurodivergent so it's not surprising that it feel like they're everywhere - that is 1 in 5 people.

I have a lot of ND in my close family, 3 relatives with dyslexia, one with ADHD, one with ASD and two with dyspraxia. I also have a number of older relatives that I believe went undiagnosed and have had very difficult lives involving drugs, alcoholism, long term unemployment and even suicide.

The example of losing keys that you mention is typical of someone with poor executive function. And a lot of people with ASD/ADHD struggle with executive function. No one is going to be diagnosed on that alone though.

I don't think it's possible to list traits of NT people because everyone is different. I don't think it would be possible to have a meaningful list that was in anyway helpful. People with ASD though often have a lot of red flags and their life is really impacted - ds spent every lunch time of his seven years at secondary school alone.

Or ironically, maybe a person with ADHD who has been coached to always put them in one place as soon as they get home!

I think the key thing is that go be diagnosed with a condition under the ND umbrella it needs to be having a significant impact upon functioning and have been present since early childhood. I do think a lot of people could be misdiagnosed as adults as trauma or stress can present as autism and/or ADHD with people struggling to function and people are being diagnosed without evidence of their childhood development.
Comparing ND to NT also doesn't work as ND conditions are so varied. An autistic person will have difference in social communication, a person with ADHD or dyslexia may not. A person with dyslexia will have difficulty with reading/writing, a person with ADHD or autism could be brilliant at reading and writing.
I'm not sure there really is 'Neurotypical' and I don't think lumping a number of conditions together as neurodiverse is helpful as they all have a different diagnostic criteria and need different types of support.

I think it really depends how much it affects your life.

I'm undiagnosed, but I've struggled socially my entire life. My sensory issues affect my day to day existence. My piss poor organisational abilities affect me daily. I lose things all the time. I've forgotten to pay bills. I go out wearing one sock. I struggle with chores. I get overwhelmed and end up in hysterics at work. I make spreadsheets about my latest obsession then drop it and never do it again. I have OCD, which I think is related to my neurodivergence.

Ofc we all lose things sometimes. We all get behind with chores. But for me it significantly impacts my life and well-being, which I think is the difference between NT and ND.

I agree. When people I know IRL are pursuing an ADHD diagnosis but they hold down steady jobs, have immaculate houses and are always super organised spinning a dozen plates at the same time. I just don’t get where the adhd is?

I believe it a relatively recent classification. Level 1, not very long ago, was Asperger's syndrome. Then it became 'high-functioning autism, and now it is called level 1 autism.

I was diagnosed as Asperger’s, which was classed as high-functioning.

I have an autism and adhd diagnosis and for both I had to demonstrate impaired functioning since childhood. Traits of adhd and autism are human traits but it is the severity and frequency that impacts us. Losing keys for example- I will have my keys then all of a sudden not have my keys and I don’t know where they suddenly went! This happens several times per week. Long term consequence of poor attention-losing keys but also struggled in school and never reached my potential as I switched off, couldn’t revise or retain information.

I can very clearly tell when I’m talking to someone who is NT and that is the majority of people. I can usually spot the ND ones too as they are the only ones who will talk to me twice!

Yes, I agree with this. My daughter is almost exactly like I was at her age, except she can’t cope with school (EBSR) - one significant difference is her school is about three times the size mine was.

She is diagnosed with ASD, and I sort of assume I must have it too - we are very similar. (And my mother!)

I think about 50% of my university friends have children with ASD with varying degrees of struggle from probably not living an independent life, to quirky and easily overwhelmed but mainly coping. In my daughter’s primary school friendship group we are now on 4/5 with disgnoses of ASD, ADHD. And I guess if I were the parent of the 5th child, I’d get them tested 😂 The stereotype of neurodivergent people finding each other really seems true in my life.

I wonder if I would have struggled and been diagnosed if I were growing up today?

I understand, I am ADHD one thing to understand, ADHD is from birth but I think the symptoms of ADHD are constant, here is the problem. All children can show some symptoms at some point, this is why I think its actually over diagnosed in children although that is changing and to be honest when anyone goes through mental health and adhd assessment now, consultants know exactly what to look for and ive been told can tell in minutes if they are dealing with an ADHD or Autistic individual or not. However, I also think its under diagnosed in adults to do with the same reason where adults just shrug it off as “just how I am”.

ADHD can have pros i guess but mostly, its a nightmare, it really is. Medication has worked for me, but I spent a long time in denial when after months of mental health assessments and statements from my father and other family members, the signs were there even from birth, constant crying as a baby, severe emotional deregulation as a child for example. It seems, unfortunately, trendy and I hate to use that term, to identify as neurodiverse and I can see how people self diagnose which adds to a feeling of everyone being somewhere on the spectrum. The reality is, they arent - but I do get why it feels that way.

No it isn’t. As I said in the US it is used to indicate levels of support needed with the recognition that this can change. 4 recent NHS diagnoses in my family, none have been levelled, thankfully as all would be very hard to decide a level for support needs.

This. Nailed it.

They really don’t, it’s threads like this that do. People that actually diagnose know full
well that there are high thresholds to meet to get a diagnosis and having one or two symptoms isn’t going to get you anything. It’s also known to be under diagnosed particularly in women and girls and better less male focused diagnostics alongside better information re female presentation is a good thing.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg5vp62dnnro.amp

They really don’t, it’s threads like this that do. People that actually diagnose know full
well that there are high thresholds to meet to get a diagnosis and having one or two symptoms isn’t going to get you anything. It’s also known to be under diagnosed particularly in women and girls and better less male focused diagnostics alongside better information re female presentation is a good thing.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg5vp62dnnro.amp

@Thursst0n whilst I am not disagreeing with you, do you not wonder at the extraordinary rise in all the ND diagnoses? In 2018 a study found that there were eight times as many new autism diagnoses in 2018 as in 1998 (Ginny Russell at UCL). Further up the thread I noted the BMJ reporting that there had been an increase of 18% in ADHD medications between 2019 and 2024.

Are all of those people really meeting all those thresholds? What were they all doing previously? What has changed so dramatically?