AIBU to be utterly baffled at how many people are falling for Reform after the Brexit mess?

[TheCoralShaker]

I’m not into any political party or ideology – honestly, they all seem like varying shades of grifters to me – but I just can't believe how many people are jumping on the Reform bandwagon like it's some magic fix.

After everything that happened with Brexit – the lies, the infighting, the broken promises, the economic fallout we’re still wading through – how are people still falling for this kind of simplistic, shouty politics? The "common sense" soundbites, the "tell it like it is" nonsense, the constant scapegoating of whatever group is most convenient that week... it's all so transparent.

I'm not saying any of the main parties are perfect (far from it), but Reform seems to be just a bunch of media-savvy populists spouting whatever will get the loudest headlines. What’s worrying is how many people lap it up without even questioning what’s actually being proposed, or whether it’s remotely feasible.

Where are the critical thinking skills? Why are people so easily seduced by these pantomime figures who tap into anger and offer no real substance? It’s like the more outrageous someone is, the more they’re celebrated, and never mind whether any of it makes sense.

I get that people are frustrated, disillusioned, sick of the status quo, so am I. But falling for another bunch of opportunists who thrive on division and offer nothing beyond slogans seems like doubling down on the same mistake.

AIBU to think that we should have learned by now? Or is this just how politics is going to be from now on, performative outrage and no actual plan?

It wasn't a vote FOR UKIP, Brexit nor Reform. It's a vote AGAINST the Tories and Labour and huge numbers of people are utterly fed up of the two main parties. It's why Libdems did so well under Nick Clegg - it was the same where people were voting for something different, something other than Tories and Labour. Just a shame that Clegg just turned out to be the same as them which is why they've crashed and burned ever since. People want change, they don't want the same old see-saw between one incompetent set of politicians to another incompetent set of politicians. We all know that Reform and Farage are incompetent too, but voting for Reform is a vain hope that the Tories and Labour will change their ways and actually start listening and understanding the electorate!

No idea. How do you suggest countering misinformation?

Very well said

Change is definitely afoot. Before the last locals, a thread like this would be full of ‘Reform voters are thick’ type comments but now it appears to be a little more balanced than it was. People who silently voted reform may feel emboldened by the gains they have made and be more likely to discuss their political standpoint which will often be more nuanced and sensible than the bleating “stop the boats” rhetoric

This is a nonsense post.

Firstly it assumes that all those calling Reform voters "thick" are Labour supporters despite the fact that Labour voters are a minority in the UK. You think Tory, Libdem, SNP, etc. voters aren't calling Reform voters thick?

Secondly anyone who thinks GB News is an actual news channel is a bit thick. As is anyone who talks seriously of Marxist globalists, Marxist popes. Or calls KS a "tyrant". They're thick as mince and blindly parroting a line that's been fed to them without knowing what the words mean.🙄

Thirdly anyone who casts their vote because a random on the internet called them "stupid" is stupid.🤷‍♀️

I also have no idea. If you tell people they're misinformed they say you're sneering at them.

Their target voters seem to be people wanting to turn back time to the former “good old days.” Farage’s latest comments on wanting to bring back coal mining to Wales shows a disconnect with current realities.

Well they're now lumped with their protest vote running their councils. I hope they're happy.

I'm in Kent. Reform holds pretty much all councillor seats now. They've basically cancelled our county council as they can't be bothered to fucking turn up to do what they were elected to do. Absolute shit show, and it hasn't come as a massive surprise to anyone. Do all the Reform voters even care?

It could work out that having a bunch of people elected with no experience even of opposition could be a breath of fresh air. Or it could be a shitshow.

Ha yep.

Yes there are global problems but the UK has deteriorated sharply when compared with similar economies -that happened during the tory years and because of tory policies, including Brexit. It baffles me that people are in denial about this.

I have to travel to Europe frequently and for most European countries the recession is a very distant memory. Their wages have been growing with the economy and they have new infrastructure and healthcare (free in some cases) that we in the UK can only dream of. Infrastructure in the UK is stuck in the 90s and is holding the country back so badly.

It's sad that the electorate can't see that we are in this situation because of the political choices of the tory party. It's sadder that labour has no ideas other than pandering to pensioners.

Who mentioned GBNews in this thread? I must have missed that.

just been reading some of the posts here, and it's the lack of engagement from the authorities which is causing the issue, then some people say we have to do it ourselves, thus escalating the problem - the problem isn't someone setting up an illegal shop and making a quick buck, it's the council/authorities who are sitting on their arse, getting free lunches, and dealing with that is a 'difficult' area, much easier to fine someone for 2 minutes over parking, or puts their bin out too early.
The reform people, and indeed any one track pony set don't see the bigger picture, they only see what affects them, the last thing this country needs is to gone down the current one way street of my way is right so f off, engage, communicate and try to establish dialogue.

@Lonelydave I agree that local services have greatly diminished. So many local authorities are going bankrupt or are teetering on the edge. Many are only able to deliver the statutory requirements, so they won't be doing anything above and beyond what is set out in the legal framework to deliver. Many of them were Tory controlled for a very long time, which meant that council tax remained low, which on the one hand for those of us paying council tax is great, but on the other hand means that revenues have decreased year on year and so there is no money left in the pot. There is an element here of "you get what you pay for" and we aren't paying for the services that we used to.

I'm not sure dialogue is much good without there being any money to actually fund the improvements.

Yes I agree it was the Tories but people see Tories and Labour as a uni party now and don't think Labour would have done much different. Brexit was part of the problem in that the Tories didn't really want to do it (most mps of all parties were remainers) and made a complete hash of it. To my mind lockdown policies were much more to blame for the mess we're in, furlough schemes were the most generous and alot of people got used to not working or wfh so productivity has fallen while state spending has stayed high. Sooner or later the electorate including pensioners are going to have to have to face financial realities and stand on their own two feet but there will probably be a financial crash of some kind before this happens.

My personal opinion is people have voted reform as a wake up call to the other parties, all of whom need to get butts into gear, stop infighting and get working together

Really not sure reform will get anywhere ina general election

Misterinformation?

It's selling off everything that wasn't nailed down and funnelling money to shareholders which has created a lot of economic problems, see trains, Thames water, utilities etc nothing invested in the service, deregulation so they can do whatever they want and fat cats getting rich.

We're a country run by the wealthy for the wealthy.

Based on what @Redflagsabounded has to say, I'm going to go with complete and utter shitshow.

@MargoLivebetter it isn't just about what the tory council did, all parties are responsible, we need mature and sensible people - if there is a good idea by labour carry it through, these people are elected to represent their constituents, not to further their own political career. That is the problem, someone at university heads up their union, then leaves, goes for local council, the head office go oh thats got potential - never once seen the real world.
Road works as an example, it is cheaper for companies to delay active repair works and then state them as an emergency, comes out of a central fund thingy. Madness, get the water/electric/gas companies and traffic light people etc.., together - work together - but because umpteen previous governments/councils think differently we end up with gridlock.
Bus fares - all come from the same central big pool - therefore you buy a ticket its accepted anywhere
None of this is rocket science - it's called joined up thinking.
If it is cheaper to import something from China with all the shipping costs and sell it here, then apply the logic here, organised supply chain etc
What we have is a separation of everything in to the tiniest parts, with everyone taking their little bit.
NHS - their drugs cost a fortune and then need to be thrown away after discharge - really ? why? Whos name is on this stupid bit - we will never know because no one is held accountable. Ranting again! Sorry!

I don’t understand how women can vote for Farage. He’s anti abortion.

He is also against DEI and women are the main recipients of DEI policies, it means our daughters have a chance of working in what is usually a male dominated job and there is more money spent to encourage girls into the STEM subjects. These will all go he doesn’t agree with DEI.

And thirdly the NHS he wants to privatise it similar to the US model where if you have a pre-existing condition (and looking at some of his followers on social media they do) those are excluded from care. And even if the lowest paid/on benefits don’t have to pay it will be the rest of us squeezed even more to pay for everyone else. I get private healthcare with my work but I don’t want to work forever.

Farage was also a huge supporter of Liz Truss and her trickle down economics which crashed the economy so that’s another reason not just limited to women. The poor will be poorer under Reform.

No need to apologise @Lonelydave . I agree that there is lots wrong and our political system doesn't help. It is adversarial and every five years one side is pitted against the other. Personally, I think that we need proportional representation so that we have to work on compromises and joined up thinking and long-term strategies and policies, rather than the mad swings back and forth. However, that means turkeys voting for Christmas, so that probably won't happen in my lifetime!

Isn't this the kind of thinking that allowed the UK to accidentally coast into Brexit though? The assumption that it'd never actually come to leaving the EU but that a good shake up and protest was called for?

I'm not anti the idea of distruptors across the board, but it's a dangerous game - nobody except his hard core supporters in the US really believed Trump would get in, did they - the first let alone the second time? That goes for other fringe extremists throughout history too...

I don’t understand why you’re confused tbh. I still think that Brexit was the correct decision in the long term. I would argue many on here decrying Brexit don’t actually understand the position.

On to the current rise of Reform, for many the massive increase in immigration, both legal and undocumented is destroying their community/way of life. People see their local and national culture being ignored in favour of an alien culture. People are coming here with no idea of the cultural expectations of the place they’re now living or just ignore it. Many people are coming from countries with very different views as to the position of women and the importance of religion. people are angry and feel threatened. If you went into the affected areas you would experience this.

it’s gone too far now for tinkering round the edges that the mainstream parties do.

Farage, whether you agree with him or not, is speaking the same language as those who are affected by the out of control immigration. We do need to stop focusing on helping incomers, we need to start focusing on British, home nations and local culture and traditions. People who want to live here need to show very real commitment to integration.

Until the immigration situation is sorted (and this is across the west where people are literally feeling under attack in their own homes) parties like Reform will continue to increase in popularity. I don’t agree with all their policies by any means. But to say you have no understanding of why they are so popular is to show a complete lack of understanding of the experience of many westerners , especially the poorest.