AIBU to think there's an awful attitude on MN to cosmetic procedures?

[PeachSundae]

Morning all.
trying not to make this a taat. There is a current thread running about a woman who had 0.5 lip filler, and her husband isn't happy about it. The comments are filled with bitchy, nasty women tearing her down.
multiple women on here say that anyone with cosmetic procedures looks 'fake, like a blow up doll, like a prostitute, like a duck, trout pout' and the list goes on. The comments are abhorrent. Yes, there are some very bad / botched jobs out there. But so many posters say 'filler never looks good, you can always tell' etc etc. you wouldn't notice good filler, that's the point. You will evidently notice bad filler.

cosmetic prosecutes can be invaluable to people. I was diagnosed with an incurable cancer at 23, gruelling chemotherapy sapped every single bit of life out of my face. I aged overnight. I've had cosmetic work done to my face to try and get a bit of normality back, it's been a godsend for me. No amount of therapy or counselling would've done that. And some people don't want therapy or counselling! Some people aren't doing it to be vein, some are like me and doing it for my reasons. Also, so what if people are doing it for vanity! It's so nice to read the assumption that I look like a blow up doll, and that I look fake. Without even seeing my face and without knowing what I've been through.

AIBU to think this whole 'trout pout, every woman with filler looks like XYZ' is just horrible? The comments on the other thread are nothing short of bullying.

if you're one that judges so badly on what other people do, why? Why do you care? If you do judge, you are not on some sort of morale high ground because you're 'au natural.'

I’d wager that most people who think o negatively on Mumsnet can afford them – Mumsnet is a comparatively well off demographic of women.

I genuinely think it looks horrible. Yes, there will be people who have it done where it’s more subtle but in general I think it looks bad. That being said- I couldn’t care less if someone has it done- it’s just something I would never do. If someone is happy having it done, then I don’t understand why they would care what others think.

No. The idea of a cosmetic procedure did not pop into your head as a unique concept then. You heard about it, you heard about and saw what result it could deliver and you decided this would ‘fix’ the issue that you deemed to require fixing. This is being influenced to have it performed, by whatever means you became aware of it – and it’s as simple as that whether you believe yourself to be above it or not.

But your argument (upthread at least) isn’t whether some natural lips can look cosmetically filled, it’s whether cosmetically filled lips can be undetectable.

Sorry I do have to correct you on this OP.

Hyaluronic acid is a key compound in filler but it is not the only compound.

Filler doesn’t migrate because it’s “done badly”. Filler migrates because of the amount of filler, the type of filler and through circumstances completely beyond your control. Filler will always migrate. To greater and lesser extents but it always migrates. It doesn’t just disappear or disolve as people are led to believe.

Hyaluroinc acid fillers are the most likely to migrate because they are the least viscose. It is impossible for you to tell if your friend’s filler has migrated or will migrate in the coming decades unless she has a full body MRI scan very regularly. Migration isn’t usually visible.

Filler is being found in people’s lymph nodes now, blocking the lymphatic passage and having negative effects on the immune system and increasing the risk of certain cancers. It is also being found in strange areas of peoples bodies decades after being injected. In their necks, chest etc.

It greatly worries me that someone has been happy to inject someone with a cancer case as serious as yours without informing you of this and getting your specialist to sign off on the procedure. THIS is the kind of thing that concerns me about fillers and Botox. I couldn’t care less about what you look like, how natural you look, how big your lips are etc. That’s your business. But it’s clear to see from some responses here that the women getting fillers and Botox are not being fully informed on the procedures and the latest research into them.

I don't see the need to mock or belittle anyone but I think it's ok to be opposed to it and think it looks bad. There is also a really important feminist analysis around cosmetic surgery.

Yes, I think most mumsnetters can afford fillers if they want them.

I don’t know why some women feel the need to go as far as saying things about looking like sex dolls, prostitutes, trout etc, but I do think some of the women who do say those things genuinely don’t like that look, or the pressure the trend puts some women under. I really don’t think it’s about jealousy when fillers are affordable to probably most women on this site.

But you’re using ‘influenced’ in only one of its simplest form here.

Any concept out in the world can influence. Be that social media, journalism, seeing it on the street, advertisements, friends or colleagues talking about it. It all contributes.

You say that ‘normal people’ out in the world aren’t a factor in harmfully influencing. They are – because when there are enough of them it creates the appearance of a normality. And when that normality is being inched increasing narrower, as it is with current cosmetic trends, and then the procedures available now enable people to create that ‘normality’ with ever more precision – that’s harmful because it’s creating a society in which only homogeneity is acceptable, because it’s the only things that is seen.

You say that only parents are responsible for guiding their young folk, but we know that this is not true. We know that influences external to parents have a significant impact on young people.

Thank you!

But the everyday normal.folk is just as much of problem as celebrities, it makes it seem normal. Can you understand the wider cultural impact, can you understand decisions like this aren't made in a vacuum?

And I assure you it isn't because I can't afford it I don't have them. I dislike it because I don't want my 6 year old daughter seeing puffy filled faces everyday and assuming that is what she is supposed to look like

I echo the above. I think that it’s very sad that so many young women feel the need to all look the same and indulge in fillers/botox as a very young age.
What are the long term effects?
Also the lack of regulation is very concerning. There was a story in the news just last week about a practitioner being banned from administering liquid BBLs after causing serious harm to a number of women.
Is it some sort of subtle peer pressure? Too much social media influence.
Cosmetic treatments after trauma or illness are a completely different matter.

No. Do you think you are 100% right about everything in life or just about the decisions other women make?

Very well put.

In that photo to me your eyebrows and lips do not look natural. I’m guessing it’s just lipstick or gloss applied outside the natural line of your lips? I’m not judgemental, but I genuinely don’t understand it. However it seems huge numbers of women do the same as their normal everyday routine. I’ve never plucked my eyebrows, and I only wear makeup for special occasions. However, I do dye my hair to hide the grey, and I’m sure there are other women who don’t understand why I would do that. I am trying to find a way to go to a more natural grey, but it’s tricky to get past the growing it out stage.

We’re all different and I don’t like the idea of women putting other women down for their choices, we should be building each other up. I do genuinely worry about the pressure on young women to look a certain way though. When I see my students so busy worrying about keeping their appearance perfect all day it genuinely hinders their focus on their school work, we’ve got a problem in my opinion.

Im pretty sure the trend for very artificial plumped up faces has died off as people realiese it makes you look older and clearly fake. More natural looking tweakments seem more popular.

Besides which I havent seen any nasty replies to people commenting on them in Style and Beauty threads. When it comes to AIBU though its just a free for all, bitchfest in some cases. But then again it is basically the 'judge me' section so what would you expect!?

Exactly and it's deeply sad that so many women, especially young women feel the need to do this.

Plus I wonder how many men after cancer would feel the need to cosmetically alter their faces due to premature aging. I bet the answer is very few. That's not me saying that women are vain. The societal pressure even on women who've had a horrific disease is massive. And lest we forget, all of these procedures come with a risk element and cost money. It really is something that women should be free from, but we are still judged as objects not people.

No I don't do those things. The skin is also a barrier and first line defence for the immune system - there is a difference between applying something topically and injecting it.

As you asked, you have what I would describe as 'insta-face'. That isn't an insult, it just is what it is. I would never say something as crude as 'looks like a prostitute/blow up doll' but it is a very particular aesthetic: it isn't just the lips, it's also the eyebrows. I personally don't care for it, but as you say, it's your face and your life. We are all different. There are certain procedures that I have wanted to have done: when I was younger, I wanted a breast reduction in order to make me look more streamlined/like a ballet dancer. I personally dislike the Kardashian look and wanted to get as far away from it as possible (I am naturally fairly full figured, although slender, and also have naturally full lips) I think that there is a certain truth to the idea that we all want what we don't have.

But it's not other people's responsibility to fulfil your likes and dislikes with what you do and don't want your daughter to see.

I also agree with this, to be honest. My dislike of the certain look is just that, personal aesthetic dislike. I'm sure that plenty of people wouldn't like the way I style myself, either. It isn't really anything to do with anyone else.

I don't know if you read my previous responses, but the photo of me below was before I had any work done.

I was wearing makeup though.

It was really more the eyebrows! I just am not a fan of those brows. You are still very pretty, though, and I would never make a value judgement the way some people do.

But isn't that what this thread is about??

Yes the MN brigade HATE both Botox and lip filler! The funny thing is I bet they know loads of people in their circles who have had it done, but just don’t publicize it, they probably think they just look fabulous. Procedures done well shouldn’t be obviously noticeable. God forbid we do things for ourselves that make us feel great. I’m glad your treatments gave you your confidence back 😊

Well @PeachSundae your thread is spot on and some people have shown it to be the case. Strange how incredibly judgemental and mean some posters are. They will tell you they are happy with themselves but clearly they’re not.