To cancel DD’s dance comp after what she said to her little brother?

[Blondra]

Bit of a long one, sorry in advance.

Had a nightmare of an afternoon. Was rushing around trying to get everything sorted for tomorrow, eldest (11, Yr 7) has a dance comp she’s been banging on about for weeks. Spent half my bloody life glueing gems to a crop top she INSISTED she had to have.

Anyway, little one (8) accidentally knocked over a glass of juice and it went all over said top. He was already in tears, bless him, before she absolutely LOST it and called him “a freak who ruins everything” right in front of me.

I told her she was being horrible and she needed to apologise. She rolled her eyes and said “he is though” then stormed upstairs slamming doors.

I was fuming and told her she’s not going to the comp now. Cue full meltdown, crying, saying I’ve ruined her life etc. Now she’s sulking in her room, hasn’t come down since.

Partner thinks I’ve gone too far and should’ve just sent her tomorrow and “had a word” but I’m sick of her attitude and the way she treats her brother. He’s not easy, no, but he’s her sibling and it’s not on.

AIBU to follow through and not let her go? Or have I made it worse now by cancelling it when she’s been looking forward to it for months?

I just want to do the right thing but feel like I can’t win sometimes.

The only person that needs to be punished is the son!!

I don’t think the OP deserves punishment, and nor does her daughter. But as the adult, OP should apologise to her daughter for her childish response. She is the adult and should be modelling appropriate behaviour.
You are in the minority here.

There’s only 3 years between them.
You sound like you baby the brother and expect a lot of maturity from the eldest.
She sounds stressed about the competition and general life. Perhaps AFTER the competition you could spend some quality time with her and work out if she’s actually enjoying the dance team stuff or if it’s causing too much angst.
Year 7 is hard, she needs your understanding and attention.

Emotionally abusing a child isn't better than physically abusing them...

My children are only punished for lying. Everything else is a mistake. Lying is definitely the worse thing they can do.

Children know the difference. They know when they are being unkind, and have to apologise. That is enough. They know when they break something, they just own up and tell me and it is fine. My son broke a neighbour's window and owned up right away. The neighbour was delighted, and didn't charge for the new window.

If they do something wrong, they know it is wrong and come and tell me. There is no punishment if they are sorry.

I have not known them deliberately hurt anyone either physically or mentally. Why would they? There is no need. They would not like to be grounded from the things they do.

Try it. It works with me.

Is there another reason to have a tantrum before an event?

The OP did everything she could to make the DD look nice in the competition. No one can get inside the mind of the DD as to why she threw the tantrum, but tantrum throwing has to have consequences and the OP chose that way to punish at the time.

Would grounding her DD for an even in a week's time have been kinder? Would it have been better to let DD pine and worry for a whole week, instead of instant grounding?

We don't know what goes on in reality. The OP wonders if she did the right thing. I say that if it seemed right at the time, then it probably was, however the OP felt afterwards.

Posters say she isn't being punished. I don't agree. One of the most hurtful things a mother can do is have to punish her children. Children have to learn the difference between right and wrong, and we have to teach them.

I think the OP showed that there are other ways of punishing than the violence many children have to face now. The cases which get in the news - Sara for example - are just the tip of the iceberg.

You really have it in for the daughter, I cannot understand it

I think a boy who had this happen to his football kit before a big match would have had exactly the same response if his younger sister had spilt juice on it

Children get excited and nervous for these events and anything that appears that it might disrupt them gets them agitated.

Well of course I am in the minority. The way children are brought up now makes me despair.

I ex[ect that little talk has been made. I think the OP was right to punish the behaviour. If an apology needs to be made it should be along the lines of : 'I am sorry I had to ground you, but what you did is unacceptable'.

Children are quite capable of learning that they will be punished for doing something unacceptable in the family. If every time we try to teach our children right from wrong we explain to them, they will accept the consequences and try to behave better.

It is punishment enough for the parent that they should find it necessary to punish. No one wants to upset their children without good reason.

You can show you are in charge as the parent in lots of ways without dishing out punishments.

One way is for the parent to say "I'm sorry he spilled the drink. I should have put the top safely away once I finished it /I should have made sure your brother didn't go near your top with the juice".

This will immediately de-escalate everyone. THEN you can speak calmly to the son about spilling the juice on the top and to the daughter about how she reacted.

And move on. No need to punish anyone.

The primary goals should be deescalation and regrouping.

My mother favoured my brother and I knew it. We never got on and we are not close.

You can dish out all the punishments you like but it just leaves the children angry or gleeful. It's not good for any of you long term.

Aim for harmony at all times, for regulated kids and parents, who think about the needs of others without being forced to.

How have I 'got it in for' anyone?

Do you allow your children to have tantrums? We do not know just how hysterical the DD was, but it was enough for the OP to consider her DD should not go to the competition. That is good enough for me.

I said in my post there were faults on four sides, that each could have done better in the situation. I see nothing wrong in that.

Nor do I see anything wrong in grounding the DD for losing her temper. We don't know the circumstances. Perhaps the OP feared a reprisal if the DD decided to do something to her DB, so grounded her to make absolutely sure no further aggression would happen.

Have you read the post? I’ll spell it out for you:
THE REASON WASN’T DUE TO LACK OF CONFIDENCE. DD WAS UPSET BECAUSE DS POURED JUICE ALL OVER HER FAVOURITE TOP
And because mum went mad at DD instead of DS, daughter was upset. It’s really not hard to grasp. And frankly, your offensive nonsense about any punishment being fine as long as it’s not physical would not hold up in court. I deal with emotional abuse cases all the time
and in many ways, they’re far more harrowing than physical ones and leave much deeper scars.
Go away. You’re wrong.

It is punishment enough for the parent that they should find it necessary to punish. No one wants to upset their children without good reason.
Rubbish, I think it's clear from ops actions and the excitement of some of this threads posters there's definitely some people that are quite happy to cause upset in their children!

this. I cannot believe that that OP has made an argument mentioning Sara (I assume) Sharriff arguing that what the OP did was ok because worse things happened to a different child in a different family for different reasons. I mean batshit or what?

My children are only punished for lying. Everything else is a mistake. Lying is definitely the worse thing they can do.

What a load of shit. If one of them hit another, would that be a mistake? And you wouldn't punish them for it if they said they did? By your logic one of them could torment another on a daily basis, but as long as they cheerfully admit that's what they're doing, no problem.

She got upset because her brother ruined her top

Are you deliberately being dense?

@llizzie

I can't quote the post but to be honest I wouldn't call the DD's behaviour a tantrum. She reacted to a situation which I feel she was entitled to. The OP didn't really seem to care that the garment she felt so aggrieved about gluing gems onto could have been ruined and that would have eliminated her DD from a competition and the DD perceived the lack of concern as well.

The OP herself has admitted that grounding her DD was over the top and I don't understand why you keep on pursuing the line that the DD deserved the grounding - her DM doesn't think so anymore

So yeah I do think you have it in for the DD

It would worry me to go over and over something that has been dealt with, like a court session and appeal if the sentence is too harsh.

As I said before, I punish mine for lying. Everything else is a mistake, apologised for, and forgiven.

If you have meetings to decide what punishments are appropriate for what misdemeanour, at least then the children know what to expect if they do wrong, so that there are no inquests/post mortems/appeal courts after the fact.

‘do I see anything wrong in grounding the DD for losing her temper. We don't know the circumstances. Perhaps the OP feared a reprisal if the DD decided to do something to her DB, so grounded her to make absolutely sure no further aggression would happen.’

’Aggression’! Blimey, the girl child called her brother a rude name after he (maybe by accident, maybe not , certainly not unprecedented) ruined a very important possession, which impacted on a major experience in her young life.

The Op ‘feared a reprisal’ , you mean, she might go and pour something sticky on his duvet? Which might cause the poor ‘little one’ who is EIGHT to cry a bit more?

you should go on a creative writing course, you are wasted arguing on MN.

I think the OP showed that there are other ways of punishing than the violence many children have to face now. The cases which get in the news - Sara for example - are just the tip of the iceberg.

OP may have used another way of punishment but it doesn't mean it was a less harmful method. It was an emotionally abusive method. Stop trying to use an absolutely horrific case of child abuse to justify your point incorrectly

Well of course I am in the minority. The way children are brought up now makes me despair.

You don't apparently punish your child for anything other than lying. That makes me despair.

You're being incredibly obtuse. The OP's daughter reacted angrily because she's been working hard on preparing for the competition for weeks, and her brother may have ruined her outfit, the day before she was due to compete. If someone ruins something important to you, particularly something you're hyper-focussed on, it's pretty normal to react with upset - and it's understandable that a pre-teen would struggle to manage that upset in the moment.

I'm with the OP's partner. DD should have been sent to her room to cool off (and the OP could have then taken a moment to work out if the outfit was salvageable). OP could then have a quiet word with DD, letting her know the plan for the outfit, acknowledge her upset, but let her know the namecalling is unacceptable and that she needs to apologize for it, but DS would first have to apologize for ruining the outfit.

If DD could navigate that adequately, I don't think a punishment is required. If, though, she continued to react angrily, then a grounding, or device ban, or some other punishment that doesn't include cancelling her participation in the tournament would be appropriate.

Making her apologize to DS in the moment was inflammatory.

@QuaintShaker

Thank you for a very reasoned post

I'm still hoping to hear that the DD did well in the competition, wish the OP would let us know

Annoying, and slow to understand? Not very nice, just because you don't agree with me, it is? Now if you called me facetious..........

You just like chewing over the nitty gritty and putting your own interpretation on it.

I said if that is what the OP considered punishment at the time - a grounding - I would not admonish her for that.

That she regrets it. Most mothers regret having to punish their children. It is natural. It doesn't mean the punishment was wrong, or that the child was right.

Perhaps it would help if someone thought up all the possible misdemeanours our children are likely to commit and suitable punishments to be meted out and published it as a guide to good parenting?

All parents would have to do then is to consult the book and follow the price of wrongdoing and everyone would have a model life: like they do in Stepford.

It would be a pity, because the list would have to be so long it could be hours before you actually found the right punishment appropriate for the deed, and give it hours later, instead of at the right time.

Have you read the post? I’ll spell it out for you:
THE REASON WASN’T DUE TO LACK OF CONFIDENCE. DD WAS UPSET BECAUSE DS POURED JUICE ALL OVER HER FAVOURITE TOP
And because mum went mad at DD instead of DS, daughter was upset. It’s really not hard to grasp. And frankly, your offensive nonsense about any punishment being fine as long as it’s not physical would not hold up in court. I deal with emotional abuse cases all the time
and in many ways, they’re far more harrowing than physical ones and leave much deeper scars.
Go away. You’re wrong.

Not sure why you’re trying to make this about your socio political views.
Do you believe DS should be punished? You said you only punish your children when they lie.
DS poured juice all over DD’s top...