Are parents of 'Trans' children aware of the damage of full affirmation?

[Iloverosesandcarnations]

All children go through a stage of who am I? Confusion etc.

Am I a boy, a girl, do I fit it etc.

The social contagion of affirmation of 'I'm in the wrong body, so need to change it' it IMO so damaging.

Talking through, understanding that all children go through 'who am I'
rather than initial blind affirmation and ok.lrts change your name, clothing etc tell school rush into changes young BEFORE maturation, is so dangerous.

No they are not. And it is a totally contradictory concept.

People who adopt a gender identity are very clear which sex they were born but believe they feel like the opposite sex (despite having absolutely no knowledge of how it feels to be the opposite sex and by trans activist rules, as a pp claimed if you have no lived experience of something your opinions are not valid but who’s counting) and are keen to appear like a stereotypical version of the opposite sex so girls have a double mastectomy and grow facial hair and boys wear make up and grow their hair out.

People with DSDs have a wide range of medical symptoms ranging from almost none to issues with reproduction and in very rare circumstances like Imane Khelif’s family has claimed there is an ‘unexpected’ male puberty. Which is very obviously male. That is not trans.

As other pps have asked for your evidence on this and you have just obfuscated and failed to provide any, I’ll assume you are just repeating this made up nonsense with no actual knowledge.

How is it an oxymoron? I'm no expert, but surely intersex/whatever correct term is, isn't the same as being trans?

If you’re referring to my post I didn’t say that at all. I said that people with DSDs have asked for their medical condition not to be weaponised by the trans activists.

I suggest you take a break and start reading a bit more slowly and carefully - you might learn some actual facts.

One thing I’ve learnt during my time looking into all this is that trans activists are shameless when it comes to exploiting others for their own gain.

They claim that female cancer survivors who have had their breasts removed are at risk of being mistaken for a man in challenged in women’s changing rooms to try and bolster their arguments that men should be allowed in.

In one shocking example of narcissistic teenagers, a girl who identified as a boy made a TikTok about how outraged she was that her mum got a double mastectomy before she did. Her mum had cancer.

Trans activists have weaponised the medical condition of DSDs for years to try and undermine the sex binary - which actually is reinforced by the existence of DSDs as every one of them are either male or female and have symptoms specific to their sex.

It is repeated behaviour.

"are keen to appear like a stereotypical version of the opposite sex so girls have a double mastectomy and grow facial hair and boys wear make up and grow their hair out"

Generalisation. My DC wears no makeup - does stay clean shaven. And has had long hair since they were about 12. Mostly wears trousers and long sleeved t shirts. Probably open to accusations of not even making an effort (in a double standards kind of way).

Yes it’s a generalisation - I didn’t say they are all identical (although there is a ‘look’ that we can commonly observe).

As the use of hairstyles and clothing stereotypical of the opposite sex is one of the top items for the trans activists diagnostic tick list to convince the vulnerable that they are ‘trans’, I don’t think it’s feasible to now try and distance the concept from that.

I would be delighted if your DC has not gone down the road of taking cross sex hormones/surgery and putting their long term health and fertility at risk but by your description of ‘clean shaven’ I’m not sure that’s the case.

Out of interest, how does your DC signal a ‘trans’ status or their preferred perception to the casual observer?

They don't.
Well, they wear a bra and speak in a somewhat higher register.
They don't especially care how the casual observer perceives them or whether they are "read" as female. It's much more about their inner sense of self.

"Cohn concludes that it is important for those considering medical intervention to know that the likelihood of regret, detransition, and discontinuation is unknown and that regret and detransition can be traumatic. Cohn conveys the urgency of this concern by highlighting the rapidly growing numbers of youth pursing gender transition: in the US alone, more than 17,000 children aged 6–17 started puberty blockers or hormones from 2017 to 2021, and there were at least 56 genital surgeries and 776 double mastectomies in the 13–17 age range from 2019 to 2021."

This is not a valid argument. We live in a society and we have a socialised healthcare system. You do not have to have personally experienced something yourself in order for you to have an interest in it, whether that's racism, poverty, or the way in which we seek to treat vulnerable, mentally distressed children.

We know that long term use of puberty blockers and cross sex hormones cause chronic illness, disability and early death. All taxpayers will pay for the long term care which medically transitioned children will need as they enter a sick and disabled adulthood. And more importantly than money, many of us do not wish to live in a society in which we are encouraging mentally vulnerable children into medical harms.

I don't know about this. I'm a survivor of anorexia. One very vivid memory I have of that time is my GP telling me she had found a bed for me in hospital and I had to go that afternoon. I was at home, packing a bag, whilst staring at myself in the full length mirror. My grandmother was sat on the bed and I could see her behind me in the mirror. She was crying and asking me why I couldn't see how thin I was. I was also looking at myself in the mirror and all I could see was the remaining 'fat' bits. I could not understand what she was seeing because, at just under 6st, I could still see fat bits.

Sometimes vulnerable people have delusions that could harm them or destroy their lives. In these situations, it's damaging to believe them and affirm the delusion.

Very true.

"Sometimes vulnerable people have delusions that could harm them or destroy their lives. In these situations, it's damaging to believe them and affirm the delusion." The delusion that you can actually change sex is damaging people. They find out they are sold a lie.

@GiveMeSpanakopita I agree completely. And from what I see from my neurodiverse DD and her cohort, there is a lot of similarity between trans identifying and anorexia, also with self-harm (the route my DD took).
I wonder if this idea that no one can have a valid view on something unless they have some form of lived experience is yet another indication of how regressive some allegedly progressive views are, because does this come from a very individualistic, 'there's no such thing as society' kind of approach, ie an approach more traditionally aligned with the libertarian right than the 'left'.

I had an eating disorder for 15 years in total, it wasn't always full blown anorexia and it went through different phases and symptom clusters as these things do. But as you can imagine, I've spent a lot of time reading all the psychiatric and sociological research about eating disorders, trying to get a handle on something I lived intensely but barely understood on an intellectual level. So I think I'm pretty clued up on the subject.

Then when trans came in, a few things I would see ROGD girls say online struck a chord with me, so I read Lisa Littman and Abigail Shrier and Kathleen Stock and Helen Joyce etc etc. And I would say that the aetiologies and pathologies of female adolescent-onset anorexia are very, very similar to female ROGD. Different symptom clusters (although some overlap - hated of maturing breasts being a key one). But the aetiology and underlying psychological pathology is almost the same.

There's a very well known school of thought in psychiatry that whilst mental illnesses stay broadly the same throughout history, the outward symptom manifestations are culturally driven. So if you were a distressed adolescent female in early mediaeval France, you saw visions of the Virgin Mary and heard God speak to you telling you to fast. If you were a distressed adolescent female in early modern Bavaria, you had visions of Satan telling you to dance until you collapsed and died of exhaustion. If you were a distressed adolescent female in 1970s New York, you went on a strict diet and somehow forgot how to stop dieting. And now, if you're a distressed adolescent female in current year, you change your pronouns and ask for a mastectomy.

That's what I think.

@GiveMeSpanakopita
That is so interesting. Thank you for sharing.
One of the many reasons transactivism is so dangerous is its lumping together into a 'trans community' of vulnerable girls and middle-aged males.

Then when trans came in, a few things I would see ROGD girls say online struck a chord with me, so I read Lisa Littman and Abigail Shrier and Kathleen Stock and Helen Joyce etc etc. And I would say that the aetiologies and pathologies of female adolescent-onset anorexia are very, very similar to female ROGD. Different symptom clusters (although some overlap - hated of maturing breasts being a key one). But the aetiology and underlying psychological pathology is almost the same.
💯 agree.
I am a recovering anorexic. I have kept a steady weight for 20 years but if stressed I drop a half a stone putting me on the low bmi, my brain kicks into survival eating for my children.

My children are on the spectrum, DS is a sensory eater overwhelming appetite, overweight. DD rarely eats without being handed the food and reminded to keep eating, she doesn't get hungry.

DD is in an ASD class, where over 40% self ID, regularly name change, 2 have transitioned, the others are non binary. DD was non binary 13 to 15, thankfully she is using her birth name. 🙄

I worry a lot about a friend with a child who preferred stereotypically girl clothing as a 3 or 4 year old. She is VERY woke & immediately went to affirm. Child is now 8 and still presents as a girl, i sometimes think he is in a difficult spot, its been this way as long as he can remember, how does a child pull back from this?

They chose a school who also affirm. I worry for their DC a lot.

Well that's exactly the point made by Dr Cass, isn't it? Walking back from this kind of social transition is going to be very challenging,

Indeed. There are a couple of detransitioners who are on social media. Sinéad Watson and Ritchie Heron , off the top of my head. They are lovely and very articulate. There really should be a compensation scheme to help people like them. It took long enough to help the victims of Thalidomide mind you. I'm surprised there are not more lawsuits. That will probably happen first in the USA which is famously litigious.

Poor child.

Surely the sensible thing with children is neither to affirm/encourage ("you like wearing dresses, you're a girl!") or shut down ("you're a boy, you can't wear dresses") but acknowledge they are very young and have a lot of learning and growing to do, and even if they do say they want to be the opposite sex that may very well change. (And that it's also fine for boys to wear dresses and still be boys.)

You've forgotten the first rule of all things trans: if it's not entirely affirmative and celebratory beyond all sense, it's transphobe.

So the fact that a very few people are born without two fully-formed arms proves that the number of arms human beings are designed to have is on a spectrum, does it?

Intersex conditions are anomalies and do not prove anything other than that mutations occur.

Do you actually know what an oxymoron is? Because that certainly isn't one.

DSDs are congenital medical conditions. Being trans is not.

Totally this. However, the rush to affirm, in some schools, with some people, encouraged bynthe TRA and ideology supporters has been encouraged or even pushed. Children need time to develop.

Well firstly it means that people who have differences in the number, structure or length of their arms are included in society and allowed to live their lives in peace without harassment and exclusion. Secondly, no, the number of arms you have is not really analogous to the complexities of sex, gender, and societal gender constructs and assumptions. And thirdly, nobody defines their lived experience by the number of arms they have, and for that reason nobody throughout history has felt the need to identify with a different number of limbs.
Apart from that great analogy, you got me there, well done for that. Are you going to come up with that classic of 'what if I want to identify as a cat' next.