School's punishment of all boys in year 6

[htdt]

My son is in Year 6 and has done SATS this week, today was meant to be a fun day for them as they've finished all the papers.

But my son came back from school really upset as the teachers had separated the girls and boys and he says the girls got to do fun activities and given treats but the boys got told off and given a lesson on respect.

He's taken this badly and has said things like 'I must be bad because I'm a boy'.

It's such a shame because he's worked really hard and was otherwise enjoying SATS week, but now feels horrible about himself, the teachers who told them off and the girls getting rewarded when all the boys were punished.

I feel like I need to speak to the school next week and find out what's gone on and why. I also feel like making a complaint. But I'm not sure what they are going to do to make things better even if they did agree with me that it was not a great way to deal with some boy's bad behaviour and also very bad timing so should I just forget about it...?

No, girls cannot be sexist against girls; but do you really think that internalised misogyny is imaginary?

Have you never heard girls bullying other girls for liking 'boy things' or for not doing 'girl things'? It doesn't just stop at children, either, with the number of sexist men AND women with internalised misogyny who will tell women (only women; never men) that choosing not to wear makeup is somehow 'unprofessional' or that they look ill.

It's a very slippery slope to go down, assuming that everybody with a certain basic characteristic acts the same as everybody else with that characteristic.

Are you white? If so, I presume you must be a racist, then? Are you able-bodied? If so, I presume you are instinctively ableist? Are you straight? Then you must hate gays.

I didn't say it was lazy teaching, but it is poor and grossly unfair teaching. Also, where did you get the impression that OP confronted the TA? Everything that she has said on this thread suggests a fair, measured attitude. Are you suggesting that it is somehow wrong to ask why you or your child has been punished? Justice is open and transparent; otherwise it automatically is not justice.

I'm sorry, are you suggesting OP was contacted by the teacher, had it explained to her how her son's behaviour was sexist, had it detailed what he should do differently next time...and she's just forgotten?!!

This is very old fashioned thinking. Both my DDiL teach and they would be horrified at this approach.

As a white person yes I am complicit in system racism. And ableism.

No. I’m suggesting she has the version of a 10 year old and a TA.

I've quoted you here because I actually really agree with what you're saying should be the overall goal. That Primaries do have to address sexism and they need do it as early as they possibly can. This absolutely involves tackling passive sexism and herd mentality. There are two potential approaches to doing this, the untrained way and the trained way.

Untrained: Throw up your hands and round up all the boys. Since you don't have any earthly idea of what to do, they can police each other from now on. The nice quiet boys who want friendship and harmony will tell off the power mad boys who want a hierarchy. Put your feet up, no need to personally inform parents of individuals' behaviours; it will all come out in the wash. Clearly if they don't want this to happen again, they will tackle their peers.

Result: The nicer boys realise the teacher doesn't have their backs and won't differentiate them from the power mad boys. There will be no protection if they become bullied by such boys. The power mad boys are thrilled that the teacher has abdicated the throne. More power is available for them; Lord of the Flies conditions ensue.

Trained: When a distressed girl tells you the "boys" are upsetting them, you ask for details like names, actions and things said. You ask for students who were present to write down what happened, what part they played and then you compare stories. You punish the students who did any wrongdoing, explaining fully why they are being punished, and what to differently in future. You make the same explanations to parents ASAP. Everything is futile without their support. If there were any boys who were a bit passive or didn't alert staff, you remind them gently that you will always support them if they want to do this future and back it up by showing you are only punishing those who are actually guilty.

Result: Kids are actually brimming with natural justice and a sense of fairness. If they feel safe and supported, they will always do their best. Not perfectly, not straight away, but encourage it and it will happen.

In other words, the teacher never bothered speaking to OP?

This is also a very snobbish attitude to show towards the most well trained behaviour professionals most schools have.

The teacher didn’t speak to the OP about a version of events that aren’t established. We don’t know what happened or how this situation arose or indeed what the situation is.

Only it’s not. If they had said head I would have made the exact same comment because they probably didn’t either.

You’ve ignored another dynamic. That this is the result of persistent long term behaviour involving all the boys and not a one off incident. That potentially they’ve all been warned repeatedly that this will be the outcome if behaviour is not notably shifted.

This attitude in itself is pure sexism

OP said
’some boys told girls they can’t play football, My son doesn’t even play football’
So he doesn’t have an issue with who plays football.
OP also noted he has some good female friends

The punishment of a person who had nothing to do with an issue is wrong !

To equate this to something that’s going on at the moment regarding collective punishment
because that is what this is……!!
Its akin to saying all Palestinians should be punished for the actions of Hamas.

That’s a disgraceful attitude and as other teachers have noted on this thread is pure laziness on the schools part

Exactly @Jenrobin
You punish the guilty

Never the innocent!

It’s not a consequence and in any other situation in a court of law
No
You can’t !

Again, that is not what the OP was formally told. We don’t have the full story.

Well said 👏👏

The kids were offered treats and fun activities after finishing their Sats

All the boys were denied that
Only the girls got the treats and fun activities and of note this is something kids look forward to after the pressure of Sats

That is clearly a punishment

So how should we actively punish you for that, do you suggest?

What unconnected treats or privileges should we take away from you - or should we just take you in for stern re-education now and again, so that you can learn properly never to do again what you never did, or even tried to do, in the first place?

How can there not be enough information
Its exactly what OP said the boys didn’t do the activities or get the treats

How can that be anything other than what it is !

But we don't know for sure that the girls did get that? The only person who said that was OP son who wasn't there!! If it turns out that's true then of course it's a punishment.

Really unfair and I’d be complaining to the head. I would usually keep my mouth shut, but a collective punishment is bang out of order when no doubt it was a few individuals. Really unfair. It’s something I had to correct when my student teacher mentioned it. Collective responsibility, possibly a good idea, if other children challenge sexism, for example, but not collective punishment, ever.

Wow, thanks everyone for all the replies, this has turned into an interesting discussion.

I won't have any more info until Monday at the earliest but will update when I do.

I will just summarise as there were a few queries coming up over again.

I did not confront anyone, I was at reception, while my son was collecting his stuff from the classroom at the end of the day. I asked if either the head of year or deputy head were around for a quick chat. One of them had gone home, the other was in a meeting and the TA was walking past at this point and she approached me and asked if she could help. I asked if she knew anything about what had happened today and she told me, I said thanks, that's good to know, she then said my son hadn't been involved in any bad behaviour. My son came back and we said goodbye.

All I know about what the bad behaviour was, from my son and TA, is that some boys have been mean to girls and the example was around not letting girls join in with football. My son doesn't play football. He spends his time in another part of the playground and often plays with a mix of girls and boys.

All I know about the 'punishment' is that the boys and girls were split up, and told this was because the boys had been mean to the girls, and they did different activities all day. And the boys had a lesson on respect. My son also says that at the end of the day the girls had sweets and were finishing off ice creams in the classroom and the boys hadn't been given anything.

I do talk to my son about feminism and women's rights and explain to him that still even in this country women are often treated unfairly and in some countries girls are not even allowed to go to school. I do try to raise him to have respect for everyone and he does appear to be inclusive and I've not ever seen him do or say anything sexist or racist.

He doesn't have a phone, but a lot of the other children in his year do.

The teachers who were involved in this were all male, there's actually a lot of male teachers at my son's school and I think that's great, there's great female teachers there too, and I have generally thought this school is fantastic and my son has loved it there.

I will update when I have any more information...

isn’t he old enough to tell you what the reason was?

Well, he's said that they were told it was because the boys had been mean to the girls and didn't let them join in, my son thinks some boys do this as do some girls too, if it was this then it seems like an over reaction so I need to find out from the teacher's involved what actually has happened

Oh, also some people have queried why the 'good' boys didn't talk to the teachers and say this was unfair.

My son says some boys did question it, and were told to stop complaining and that if they carried on answering back then they'd miss break for a month