DH threw a tantrum and so I'm taking a pause

[SaraG3018]

Hi all... first time posting on here but no idea what to do.

DD #1 is almost 6 and DD #2 is 6 months. DH has been really stepping up with DD1, kind of taking a kid each, since I had my second DD. At the same time he's had a tricky period and work and I can see he's more stressed.

However, it's been taking its toll on his patience. I often found him growling or yelling at DD1... it felt like though he'd never fully yell at her it was always raised voices and irrelevant threats and punishments. Just the opposite of all gentle parenting guidelines. I've tried to sort this with creating written house rules we both agreed on to help DD1's behaviour, thereby removing the need for arguments or silly uses of no screen time etc. It's kind of working, e.g. you won't pick up your toys ok we'll take this one away. Point to this is just flagging he's been emotional lately and I've been a bit concerned about the effect on DD1.

ANYWAY last night my sister, who just had a baby, asked us both on our WhatsApp group who took which nights with DD2. I laughed and told her I always do all nights, to which she jokingly said wow that's not fair. DH responded with a full tantrum. Excerpts from the tantrum include him saying 'what is maternity leave for, doing f all, am I to give birth then sit around doing f all while he looks after DD1 goes to work does chores and now is expected to also look after DD2 at night, did our mother not teach us anything, why don't I just f'ing marry my sister's husband if he's so perfect'... he stomped about literally kicking toys across the room. Speaking in this way isn't normal for him but in the early days of marriage ten years ago I did have to calm these sorts of outbursts during arguments. I thought he had mellowed out.

I didn't say a word on response to ask this but have quietly booked myself and the girls a hotel for a couple nights. He's going to come home tomorrow to an empty nest.

SO my question. I feel like i can't stand for this type of emotional un-regulation.. but for the kids' sake... should I? AIBU? Despite tonight and the bad moods with DD1 overall he's a very thoughtful and loving father to them. Am I overreacting?

So he's owed an apology because she laughed but he's allowed to swear at OP and be aggressive with no apology needed?

It was a huge overreaction. Nothing justifies it.

So is shipping is family off to a hotel in secret. And yes, ridiculing the work of your spouse does require an apology. The world 'tantruming' is also ridiculing, and not at all getting to the crux of the issue. The whole marriage needs a crisis meeting and several heartfelt apologies from both sides.

@flyswats That article is badly written. I recommend reading the underlying legislation.

The part of the Child Abduction Act 1984 that relates to abduction by parents makes it an offence in certain cases where a parent is taking a child out of the United Kingdom:

"Offence of abduction of child by parent, etc.
(1)Subject to subsections (5) and (8) below, a person connected with a child under the age of sixteen commits an offence if he takes or sends the child out of the United Kingdom without the appropriate consent"

The part about a more general "tak[ing] or detain[ing]" of a child does not apply to the mother (or, if certain conditions are met, the father or limited others).

"Offence of abduction of child by other persons.
(1)Subject to subsection (3) below, a person, other than one mentioned in subsection (2) below commits an offence if, without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, he takes or detains a child under the age of sixteen—

(a)so as to remove him from the lawful control of any person having lawful control of the child; or

(b)so as to keep him out of the lawful control of any person entitled to lawful control of the child.

The persons are—

(a)where the father and mother of the child in question were married to, or civil partners of, each other at the time of his birth, the child’s father and mother;

(b)where the father and mother of the child in question were not married to, or civil partners of, each other at the time of his birth, the child’s mother; and [...]" (emphasis added by me).

No criminal behaviour by the OP by taking their children to a hotel for a couple of nights!

It was a tantrum. Toddlers kick toys around when they aren't happy, adults don't or they shouldn't.

OP acknowledged that it shouldn't be in secret so she will tell him before she goes. If she needs some space, I think that's fair enough.

I'm not mad and I still think it was a jokey comment on What's App and the DH completely over reacted.

No, adults shouldn't kick objects - but they will under duress, and OP is belittling that.

…and what of shouting at a 6 a year old enough to make her cry on a daily basis, having every evening and weekend off and showing little empathy for your wife who gave birth around 6 months ago having to have a hernia operation just before returning to work? We ok with that?

6yr olds will cry whenever they are reprimanded. Interesting how the OP first described it as 'he'd never fully yell at her it was always raised voices and irrelevant threats and punishments' to 'shouting daily and making her cry'.

And 'Speaking in this way isn't normal for him' – so if it's not normal then something exceptional is going on.

I know....🫨

Will they? Adults are more than old enough to take responsibility for their own actions without blaming someone else.

I've never heard of a man that kicks objects and swears at his wife but is otherwise a nice guy.

So you shout at your child every day making them cry? Yes that is abusive.

He's using aggression to scare you into not asking him to do his share.

Of course he should do some night waking, and of course he should parent your eldest without growling at her!

You sister is right, and he clearly knows it!

Your first post and second post don't match. Which one is the truth?

And absolutely don't just disappear with the children without warning him that would be very cruel unless he is abusive and you are worried for your/children safety. Are you?

Absolute twaddle.

When my DC were 6 they absolutely did not cry whenever they were reprimanded.

Astounding that you clearly have such a low and uninformed opinion of children 😮

You can’t know many couples with two little kids under a lot of strain then! My kids are 7, I’ve known an awful lot friends and family and colleagues in the very thick of it in the baby and little kid years during the last decade. This is not unheard of and doesn’t make either party a monster.

I have three little kids myself. I still stand by the fact that it isn't difficult to avoid kicking objects and swearing at someone you are supposed to love, not to mention growling at your own child often enough that it concerns your partner.

He clearly has an issue with aggression and it isn't something I'd be putting up with.

I'd be very concerned if I had a child so unhappy that they were crying daily.

It’s twaddle that 6yr olds cry when they are told off? OK, can’t help you there. Perhaps realise that different kids are different.

Regardless OP has gone from saying that her DH didn’t yell but raised his voice and implemented reprimands to ‘shouting every day’. Perhaps if there was a some coherency in the situation then posters might be able to get a clear picture and give meaningful advice.

OP said it was not normal for him. That’s not ‘an issue with aggression’ that’s an incident that needs addressing as it’s out of the ordinary.

OP also said that she had to calm some 'outbursts' during arguments 10 years ago and she thought he had 'mellowed' out. There's also the issue of how he is with DD which seems to be normal enough for OP to be concerned about.

Though 1 'incident' of aggression would be 1 too much for me.

I think the problem here is OP doesn't agree with 'telling off' their daughter in any way, and considers any raised voices as 'yelling' so intervenes (undermines) at that stage. She even says she is 100% gentle parenting guidance only, so it is no surprise that their daughter struggles to emotionally regulate when being reprimanded for bad behaviour if it is something she has never really dealt with before.

She also says that their daughter HAS behavioural problems, her DH is the one doing all of the childcare of their DD1, while she does all the childcare for DD2, so he is getting the brunt of dealing with that and obviously struggling with the gentle parenting 'house rules' that OP has now implemented.

I think it is hard to be fully on board with gentle parenting when you don't really agree with it and from his experience probably doesn't think that it works very well, especially if the other parent is undermining you at every step if you get it wrong, but then she also says what a great relationship he has with DD2 when left to his own devices, so it doesn't seem to be affecting their relationship at all.. it is OP that has the problem with their DD1 crying and "doesn't want her to ever cry", and doesn't want her DH to do anything which may result in their DD crying.

I don't actually see anything wrong with both parents having different parenting styles to be honest and respecting each other enough to support that. As long as the core principles are the same, how you deal with discipline should be an individual thing for whoever is in charge at the time, it's not a difficult or unfair concept for a child to grasp, they have different rules everywhere they go, they soon catch on.

If OP has a problem with conflict avoidance then I think she may need to look into why that is, conflict can't always be avoided and you should be teaching your children to deal with the real world, and deal with their emotions, not hide them or avoid them, or never have big emotions, it's unfair on them.

These are clearly two people parenting in two different ways and not agreeing and not talking about it.

Sorry, if you’ve never lost your patience as an adult, kicked something inanimate in frustration or raised your voice, especially under the strain of the younger years of kids, then you’re in the vast minority.

I've never kicked something in frustration or anger and DH hasn't either. I really don't think it's that unusual.

Raised voice? Of course.
Swearing about a frustrating situation/stress/bad day? Absolutely.
Swearing at each other? No and I wouldn't stand for it either.
Growling at a child enough that your partner is concerned? No.

Again, I really don't think any of that is unusual.

Sorry, where does it say that their daughter has behavioural problems?

Neither is it for some adults to do it under stress either! We’re all different. Labelling every reaction as abusive is ridiculous.

DH and I have both used swear words in arguments with each other. We’re adults as can handle adult language. Once I kicked the hoover when it spat out grit onto my new rug. Another time I threw a cushion onto the bed. No one is traumatised.