To think Starmer is utterly reprehensible

[Thegreyhound]

I know everyone will disagree, that’s ok- But I just have to say that Starmer today seems to have sunk lower than I ever believed he would with his incendiary ‘island of strangers’ and ‘incalculable damage’ rhetoric.
I find it particularly shocking because he has calculated this and decided it’s worth it to throw immigrants under the bus and essentially give all the ground in the debate to Farage, Tommy Robinson and Enoch Powell types.
Policy can be altered without making statements that are designed to impact race relations and make life even more difficult for people who are just trying to get along and make a living here.
Starmer is vile. This country does indeed feel like an island of strangers these days but the strangers are not the immigrants :(

Are you Jewish? Because if not, you're being both condescending and uninformed

So if I am Jewish, I'm not uninformed?

And you’re backing Starmer’s island of strangers rhetoric still. You do know it echos Enoch Powell’s words

I’m not denying that it happens. But it’s a small % of overall migration.

People don’t dislike the Poles but the huge influx (far too many) was a reason for Brexit. If Poland hadn’t joined the EU no way would we have voted out of the EU. Also if Tony Blair put a cap on numbers which he was advised Brexit wouldn’t have happened either. I voted Brexit for immigration and would again and I’d vote Reform too. Why people open their eyes and stop the rubbish that we need loads of poor unskilled migrants to prop up businesses, whilst they claim benefits and take over 50% in our social housing stock in London alone to first generation immigrants which will increase. I don’t want lots of poor unskilled people here that get propped up by government support (regardless of colour). Rich, educated Arab with lots of money aren’t draining the system. I mean we’re not exactly getting the brightest and the best to immigrate like Australia we’re getting criminals and losers and paying for the privilege and if we complain are racist.

At least they're taking practical measures to sort the mess out rather than silly gimmicks like Rwanda.

It just doesn't go anyway near far enough.

How are they addressing the channel crossings?

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-20624857
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-20580545

I did delete a few sentences, saying I wasn't 100% sure on the figures then,
but here's 2 news links from 2012 saying Starbucks paid after a court case and 14 years of trading and not bothering. And only bc of pressure from public beginning four years before. Amazon was also involved in that court case.
from memory Costa was in the same bag.
That was in 2008. No I'm not Costas accountant and I would think since this court case and 15 years later they would
Pay. But back then, I wouldn't be surprised if they operated I a similar way. there's still a culture of corporations using offshore accounts (obviously?) That would would make hefty contributions to services.

It’s not funny when they want us to leave the EHCR and privatise the NHS. That is the biggest threat to this country.

Starmer has been quite vocal with the fact they’re focussing on the gangs, no?

So sorry, I meant emboldened by "the importation of a religious conflict that has nothing to do with us" which obviously has nothing to do with either Muslims or immigrants.

If you're going to state that "nobody" has a problem with Jewish or European immigrants you need to be prepared for quite a bit of challenge that a lot of people (including white people) have a problem with Jews full stop, that a lot of people were violently against EU immigration before Brexit (and Kemi Badenoch has just made a youth mobility scheme a red line in her "tests" for the EU negotiations) and a lot of people are pretty anti all immigrants.

TLDR: don't make silly sweeping statements if you can't bear to have their silliness pointed out.

Fair enough! I quite like having a semi-functioning care sector and the elderly and infirm not being condemned to squalor, plus having a good tax base and world class scientific research, so it's a no from me. 😁

Both sound good to me. The NHS is way past the point of fixing, due to years of mismanagement. Human rights OK but how many times do you see that being used as an excuse for crime?

^ this

UNLESS we get a grip on immigration and quickly across the continent with a system that works, and that is fully able to control immigration effectively we are absolutely fucked. And this is what the far left can not see.

We are going to sleep walk into a far right future, and all that entails.

We want a fair and safe country that lives by our democratic values, that encourages prosperity, the embodiment of equality and freedom. 99% of the nation want this, a nation where everyone is inspired to live well, and contribute productively.

Total immigration control is where this starts, a system that is transparent and effective should be the cornerstone of a well run and successful country. We are not a free for all, but a fair but firm country that is unafraid of enforcement.

Until this happens, we are running the very real risk of ending up with a very far right political movement across the whole of Europe. And then what?

Half the people living in my street are Muslim and it certainly isn’t a ghetto. I can think of some mainly white ghetto towns nearby where I wouldn’t want to live.

If you are Jewish, I think you're a bit confused, saying that anti semitism isn't an issue and positing your support of Israel as something that binds you with (other) Jews.

Far right for wanting a swing back away from extremism? Goodness, the term far right really does get used liberally.

People who would vote Reform almost certainly wouldn't vote Labour anyway.

Who do you think they’d vote for, Conservative? While it’s true a lot of ex Tory voters have moved to Reform, I think the same can be said of some of the old Labour voters - not the new, m/c liberal model Blair launched, but the original, w/c voters who live in the areas most affected day-to-day by immigration.

As someone up thread previously pointed out, ppl that benefit the most financially from inviting foreign workers in are the rich and big business owners. They don’t have their own communities affected or disrupted by longer waiting lists at doctors, fewer places at schools, fewer houses available and ppl living among them who haven’t been expected to integrate within the community or speak the same language to do so. You can see why there’s a large section of society who feel marginalised - they voted for Brexit. Nothings really changed for them and Reform are listening and telling them what they want to hear. Like Trump supporters they feel seen, after being ignored and called racists by ppl with no real skin in the game. They aren’t true conservative voters but probably voted when the Tories got a load of Labour seats last time - which shows they are desperate to be heard and are willing to vote for whoever promises to do that and take their concerns seriously. We obv all know Reform are the least trust worthy party out there right now but they are scaring the powers that be bc across Europe and in America the more fascist-like parties are gaining ground and threatening democracy.

Like what Starmer is doing with Trump - flattering his ego and playing the long game, this is probably the surgery he is adopting now in terms of the next election.

Torture and making homosexuality illegal are OK with you?

Spot on. It's not complicated to see why there's a problem.

@queenqueef25 No, youre wrong. Costa is a British company and has always paid tax. Starbuck (and Amazon etc) are multinational and can avoid paying tax in UK by (legally) shifting their profit centre to jurisdictions with a low tax policy like Luxembourg.

I've been reading both this morning. There is a clear gulf in both rhetoric and meaning between a statement that white people have been made strangers in their own country, and a statement that without shared language that there is a risk of becoming and island of strangers rather than a cohesive whole.

Not least that one is blatantly racist while the other is promoting cultural integration.

A Brexit vote was fairly inevitable because Europe was an issue that split the Tory party for decades. Cameron was vain enough to think that he was the PM who could finally resolve it, with disastrous consequences. Not much, if anything to do with Polish migrants, it went a lot further back than that.

Where I used to live it was like a United Nations convention of 1000's and hardly anyone speaking English. Became absolutely sick to death of feeling like the outsider in my home town of 25 years.
If the person who queried my UN reference previously with faux naviety reads this, she now knows what I'm refering to.
I don't care if anyone disagrees or hates me for it. It was a nice place that became a complete shit hole. Men hanging around leering and cat calling at women and girls. Violence increased so much too, it was always groups of men from various ethnic groups clashing in the town, knife crime increased. Never felt safe in town even during the day as things would sometimes kick of.
When I go back to visit family, I hate it as it seems worse now than it was 6 years ago.

That’s a fair few British police officers and social workers. Where should they be deported to?

Good luck with that. You may back Starmer no matter but those words are great for Reform.