Dad using individual ladies loo to change baby – what’s the etiquette?

[horchatatresleches]

We were at a small cafe we hadn’t visited before – just me, DH, and our baby DS. When DS needed changing, DH went to check the facilities but came back quickly saying the baby change was in the ladies so I changed him but it got me wondering about what is the etiquette.

The setup was one of those where the mens and women loos are both single-occupancy, self-contained rooms that open off the same hallway – not communal spaces with stalls. So it’s not like he’d be walking into a room with other women inside and making anyone uncomfortable. I’ve been to similar cafes where both loos are labelled gender-neutral, which seems simpler. Personally, I wouldn’t bat an eye if I saw a dad coming out of that kind of loo with a baby, but DH felt uncomfortable using the ladies even though there was no one else around. He wasn’t sure what he’d have done if I hadn’t been there to help.

Is there an etiquette about dads using the ladies in this kind of setup if that’s where the baby change is?
YANBU - he’s fine to use the baby change
YABU - he shouldn’t go in the ladies there

Nope, same person that.you called a fool a little while ago.
There's only one fool here and it's not me.

So you genuinely believe that male babies shouldn't be allowed in with their mothers? 🤣 jesus wept

Do you genuinely believe that a male baby and as adult man are the same thing vis-a-vis single sex spaces?
Jesus wept 🤣.

Well, you’ll be pleased to see that another fool has come to join you.

If you let men in because they have a baby. Then that opens the floodgates to bad actors. You can't be sure of the intentions of any man who goes into the ladies safe space even if they do have a baby with them.

It’s a single occupancy room. There’s no one else in there

🤣 you're the one that said it is a space for females to change female babies only.
I believe they are the the same sex... so you now agree it's not a female only space, nice to see logic has prevailed

I don’t actually agree with this. It’s not really ideal but I think an adult male should never enter the communal women’s bathroom regardless of whether they have a child. This is different because it’s a single cubicle. When I was a child my dad brought me to the men’s changing rooms at the swimming pool I don’t really think there was an alternative.

You can't be sure of anyone, at anytime. But this hysteria about loos is really silly. Man borrows/steals baby to be able to go into loos and find women? Really? You really worry about such things on a day to day basis? This is a far beyond normal level of mistrust imo.

The man can wait outside the ladies toilet for his DD to come out just like I've waited outside mens toilets for DS to come out. There is never justification for a male over 7 to go into a women's toilet.

Into a self contained toilet?

No, I didn’t say that. Maybe have a read of the relevant legislation around single sex spaces which, I believe, makes provision for children of the opposite sex under the age of 8. Who you think are the same as adults.

I would regard that toilet sign as "Ladies or Baby Change" rather than "Ladies + Baby Change". In the same way that many toilets are labelled "Disabled or Baby Change". It means they are equipped for either use, you don't have to meet both criteria.

The cafe could simply label both spaces as Toilets, additionally showing which has space for a changing table. However, a small business may not want the expense of providing disposal for sanitary products in two toilets, so labels Ladies and Gents.

I would assume this is down to cost. If they have them serviced it just costs more to have two done rather than one. So somewhere thats trying to minimize costs (which most small businesses are) might think this a reasonable economy.

I find it odd that a small cafe would even have separate loos to start with. Far easier to have a couple of gender neutral loos.

For a girl of say 2 or 3 to navigate a female toilet all on her on, find a door, lock the door, wipe, flush? Seems impossible to me. But it’s not a clear cut situation and so there will be a difference of opinions.

ME..."it isn't a single sex space only for women to change female only babies."

YOU..."It is if it’s labelled It is if it’s labelled Ladies/women/female"

🤔

It’s not a great situation and there will of course be different opinions, very valid arguments for and against.

I’ve seen a set up where gents is a singular loo and ladies is a ladies/ accessible/ baby change. In thst instance I think it’s fine to use if you are a woman, need an accessible toilet or are changing a baby regardless of sex.

A pp said this -
I can't see the issue, it's clearly a toilet and a baby change area, it isn't a single sex space only for women to change female only babies

You replied with -
It is if it's labelled ladies/women/female.

Why are you denying saying when it is clearly there in black and white?

My husband would knock on the door and say ‘dad coming in to change a baby’ loudly and then just walk in. A man walking in with a baby to change is hardly a threatening thing to do. It’s not like the toilets are open like urinals.
Yes it should be in both but I’m not going to stop going to a cafe we like based on this. Even bloody mother are has changing tables only in the ladies back when my eldest was little.

I wouldn’t have any issue with this. We went to a wedding at the weekend and the baby change unit was on the wall in the middle of the corridor at the hotel venue so I had to change my baby in full view of anyone who walked past, which felt really intrusive but he was crying as he had a dirty nappy and the car was a 10 min walk away.

I would much rather a man used a single-occupancy toilet to change a baby than have to use that changing unit where anybody could have been looking. Even babies should be afforded some privacy!

Fucking hell. The sooner everywhere has to install unisex enclosed bathrooms (to include disabled and baby facilities) the better. It’s complete madness and it’s making people weird.

Not sure how it’ll work in bigger places like shopping centres, though.

That’s bizarre. Not only for the flustered parent and the wriggling baby, but for all the passers by who have to ensure shitty nappies in public. I’d say the hotel has got that wrong, but it probably stems from women kicking off about dads needing to change kids in the ladies loos.

Of course it’s fine for a dad to go wherever the child changing facilities are - the other way round I would absolutely.