What can labour do about immigration?

[CrispyEye]

Current poles showing Reform is way ahead of labour now. I’m so worried Reform will win the next general election if Labour don’t get a grip on this issue. And I say that as a Tory voter.

Realistically, what can Labour do, what should they be doing and do we think they will do it?

Agree with all of that. But it's not enough to say that this should be the standard for immigrants going forward, immigrants who have settled here not meeting this standard currently need to leave.

None of those countries have migration under control, it's a global problem with no easy solutions.

There are over 5000 unaccompanied children on one spanish island
www.reuters.com/world/europe/spains-canaries-rescuers-exhausted-new-migrant-routes-open-2024-11-21/#:~:text=Unaccompanied%20minors%20stay%20on%20El,through%20Europe's%20porous%20land%20borders.

Sorry, I can't decipher what the fuck you are on about, 'big bad' eh?! I wouldn't say Farage is 'big' how tall is he? If he is, 'bad' should we be voting him in? 😱

How do you get across to the public that immigration is not the problem? Indeed, with an aging population and low birth rate, we need immigration to boost the work force and pay taxes.

Most of the 'immigration issues' are of the Tories' own making - they have created a scapegoat to take people's eyes off the real issues. If they hadn't closed just about every legal asylum route, we wouldn't have so many illegals (who cannot work or claim benefits). Because the Tories halted processing immigration, you end up with a backlog of people in camps and hotels awaiting processing. Get these people processed. Get them working and contributing to the economy and let's see Britain prosper (oh and let's rejoin the EEA so we can have our freedom of movement back).

Are you okay? Calm down.

Yes, I think many of this feel this way, my DH said this as we don't want to live in Reform Britain!

You know when Reform voters are on the back foot on MN as they always trot out this faux concern for your welfare.

And we are importing other countries problems?
weekly anti Israel marches in London. India and Pakistan could be at war in the future.
Asking someone who is Muslim and don’t accept homosexuality to respect our culture is funny really.

Oh dear, you really are upset. you’ll be more more upset when Reform get some power. Also using the term Reform voter as some sort of insult isn’t quite flex you think it is.

As I say, people like you learned nothing from Brexit.

How does that stop the exploitation of the people coming over in boats? Who, because of the delay in processing, are costing us millions? And that's ignoring the physical danger they're in.

Yes, I will be very upset, you have that correct- Reform government is an awful prospect!

Please don't delude yourself that I'm learning anything from your posts.

What makes you think the people in receipt of universal credit/unemployed voted in large numbers in the local elections? Or indeed intend to vote Reform over one of the other parties. The turnout in local elections is usually around 30-40%.
Reform's Durham campaign website looks quite slick;

https://reformukdurham.org.uk/

Labour and our other so called left wing parties should be ashamed of themselves.

They singlehandedly created this vacuum for Reform to fill by consistently ignoring concerns on immigration and identity politics, which is realistically the only reason people are now looking to Reform.

They sacrificed the needs and wants of the majority for social kudos within their own narrow echo chambers

What makes you think they didn't? 1 in 5 is quite high.

"Reform's Durham campaign website looks quite slick" - we have different ideas of what slick looks like!

The thing I learned from Brexit is that large swathes of the electorate can quite easily be manipulated into voting against their own self interest if someone identifies a convenient scapegoat for all of their problems. Watching the rise of Trump in the US has further informed my understanding of how people can be persuaded to press the self-destruct button.

And I am upset, because I now see how quickly and easily a society can descend into chaos, with many of its citizens enthusiastically cheering on its decline. That isn't what I wanted for this country, and while I still cling to the hope that the decent people will outnumber the Reform crowd, I am slowly starting to lose hope because I have seen how easily people can be manipulated.

The bit that I'm not yet clear about is how long it will all take to unravel before people realise what a terrible mistake they have made, and how much irreparable damage will Reform manage to do in the meantime. Only time will tell, but perhaps we'll get a sense of this from watching what happens in the US.

The one thing that is positive is that we still have a long time before the next election. And if the MAGA crowd gradually become disenchanted with Trump as they see that things are getting worse for them , rather than better, then that may give enough people pause for thought about Reform. Only time will tell.

Labour have unraveled support in record time.

People generally moan about the current government whatever they do? Have you never watched Question Time or PMQs? It's full of telling govt members what they are doing wrong

And the local councillors don't have any sway on benefits etc. They deal with LOCAL issues

I think this is true.

Unfortunately, if Reform wins the next election, I'm afraid people will find that things can get a whole lot worse.

It's not the hard-line Reform voters they need to please. It's the disillusioned working class who've been shit on since Thatcher (economically), Blair (socially) and since the 2008 crash (socially and economically). The social changes have been enormous and it's the fruits of mass uncontrolled immigration.

These are the voters who have nowhere left to turn and think fuck it I'm voting Reform.

I think Starmer has made some improvements (along with policy gaffes) but if he can't control our borders it won't matter.

Starmer doesn’t help with PMQs. Every time a bullying non answer. No wonder support is plummeting.

Parties like Reform need an “other” to use. They use this “other” to sell their ideas to voters, it’s an easy shorthand. If it wasn’t immigrants, it would be someone else. “It’s not your fault you are in the situation you are in, it’s Xs fault”.

It’s an easy narrative, stops any amount of personal responsibility for poor life choices.. “it’s not your fault”. It’s also distraction tactic “it’s nothing to do with Capitalism, tax-avoiders, and Oligarchs.. it’s all down to those 100,000 asylum seekers”

It makes it almost impossible to show the benefits of migration (with an aging native demographic)

When the migrants aren’t there to blame anymore, it will be someone else. Reform can come up with lots of ideas, unfettered by the possibility that they will need to deliver.

I have no idea of immigration is too high, or not. It might be at the right level. I know that my Mums Care Home would cease to function without the African and East-European workers.

The job vacancies we currently have, shouod be filled by British people.. so why aren’t they? TBH, I think there are groups of inter-generational benefits claimant, who have no intention of ever working. I think we need to invest in Childcare, so parents can work without having to pay a fortune in nursery fees. More social housing, and rent control. We need to incentives companies to employ people with disabilities. I also (and this will be unpopular) need to have much more stringent criteria for benefits claimants

I’m never quite sure where I am politically- I’ll never vote Reform, due to the odious leadership, and cack-handed policies around DEI and SEND.

A big part of our malaise is a lack of will.

I disagree with much of her policies but Thatcher was an example of someone with the nerve and will to get things done and not take no for an answer. She's the sort of leader we need now.

I think you're right that some people are disillusioned and think "fuck it, I'll vote Reform". And I think those are the people who will come to deeply regret their vote at a later date...if, that is, they have the capacity to realise what they have done.

But it is not true if the co-hort of people that are arriving in the UK are costing the tax payer money and are a net loss to the exchequer as they have been over the last 8 years.
The cost of the "Boriswave," which refers to the potential influx of migrants granted Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR) While a precise figure is difficult to pinpoint, reports suggest a cost ranging from £234 billion to potentially £35 billion, depending on the number of migrants seeking ILR and the associated welfare costs.

Here's a more detailed breakdown:
Estimated Costs:
One report suggests a base case of 801,000 migrants seeking ILR could cost the taxpayer £234 billion. Another report, from an anonymous source, puts the total cost at £35 billion, with a separate estimate of £2.5 million per household.

Welfare Costs:
The primary concern is the potential for these migrants to claim benefits, leading to increased welfare spending. For example, in 2023, over one million foreign nationals received more than £7.5 billion in Universal Credit alone.

One household on UC with 5 members takes 5 taxpayers on average to support.