Of course women will be safer

[HardyKoala]

Following the Supreme Court ruling. I’m flummoxed by the amount of women I considered intelligent friends, posting rubbish about how women are actually no safer and this ruling is just anti-trans. I just don’t understand how intelligent women are coming to this conclusion.

The main argument seems to be that men will be men and will still rape and assault.

Of course they will.

But now, they can no longer just assert ‘I am a woman’ and automatically be able to enter women’s spaces unchallenged to do this. And this did happen, a few examples below.

They will no longer be able to enter women’s changing rooms and film teenage girls naked. They will no longer be able to enter the women’s toilets in Morrisons unchallenged and sexually assault a 10yr old girl. They will no longer be able to be housed in women’s prisons raping vulnerable women in the shower. This will all stop.

Yes, I do understand the negative impact on a few trans women and I feel for them, but why should ALL women put themselves and their daughters at risk for this tiny minority? I just don’t get it. If you’re campaigning for anything, campaign for 3rd spaces surely? But don’t campaign to allow any man the right to enter women’s spaces.

I have no issue with trans people in any way (I know a few) but I just can’t understand this argument that all women should be more at risk. Of course most trans women aren’t a threat. But men pretending to be women for access to women ARE a threat. And this ruling makes it harder for them to rape and assault us.

The amount of friends I’m seeing posting this rubbish has thrown me. I feel like I’m in an a weird alternate reality.

Patronising or what. And no I don't think you can sex a person from looking at them.

Do you actually for a start speak to everyone you meet in public toilet? I don't. I tend to want to get in and get out. I don't normally start a conversation with the person I'm washing my hands next too. Apparently you do and then decide you need to have a conversation with everyone else.

And why are you asking me about what I believe about single spaces? That isn't what I asked you.

I am up to at least 3 "I've met someone with both male and female reproductive organs". Sure you have Benjamin. They go to another school.

Isn’t the issue that if trans men (who present as men) now have to use the women’s loos then it actually makes it easier for predatory biological men to go into the women’s loos, they won’t even have to dress up or disguise themselves, they can just pretend they’re trans men?

And did they ever ask women and girls for consent for them to do so? No. They were actually never meant to be there.

Now we have a situation where there are many more of them and too many of them took advice from other male people (initially the doctors who did the surgeries in the 70s, or so I have read) and male centred organisations. There was never consent given by female people for this to happen.

Do you or do you not believe that female people should have single sex spaces that exclude all male people over the age of needing an adult's care?

Do you believe that female people should have single sex space that exclude male people or not?

Have you SEEN any of the news reels from the recent TRA protests?

There was not a single transwoman on those reels that had enough plastic surgery to pass. Heck, some hadn't even had any surgery at all and were still sporting their male patterned baldness, 5 o clock shadow, neck beards and wearing their crusty dusty jeans and t shirts from 15 years ago.

Yes, some transwomen can "pass", it's such a small small portion of what is claimed to already be a small portion of the population.

Those that can "pass" well the onus is on them. They're the ones being deceitful, no amount of surgery will make them not men, but they are all categorically delusional if they think they all pass.

I think that most trans men will continue to just quietly get on with their lives as best they can. As always.

They've nothing to fear from women, and the tra lot have never given a shiny shit about them.

aCatCalledFawkes

Nice abusive use of the laughing reaction emoji there.

What’s the disguise?

What scaremongering claptrap. Nothing has changed in the law. All will be as it was before this trans nonsense became mainstream. Nobody was asked to prove their sex then. It’s about having the right to single sex spaces and when that right is infringed, we can raise the alarm without the fear of being called bigots

For all those who cannot correctly sex most male people, either on sight, watching them move, or through other interaction, please don't believe that your inability is the norm.

And actually, it is irrelevant that you cannot if you personally don't care.

But to assume that others cannot because you cannot is simply false.

Women and children are remarkably good at identifying people who are male. There are endless studies demonstrating this. Blokes seem to lose this ability to some degree in adulthood - perhaps as it isn’t as important a survival skill.

One of the main things is gait. Because of the difference on hip shape (and therefore the angles the thighs to knees) men and women have a completely different gait pattern.

Even when all other things are blocked out except dots on joints in video footage women can differentiate between men and women walking with great accuracy.

Those hips do not lie!

And nor do the q-angles!

You really think women leaving a single sex space because there’s a male in there is the optimum outcome?
Really??

Trying to force things to be enshrined in law has backfired. Bearing in mind the numbers, transitioned transwomen treading lightly in female spaces might have gone under the radar?

What does that actually mean?

In what way? You didn’t exactly answer any of my points but by still pressed on with your own issues.

Transwomen do look like men because they ARE men.

Im sure the tantrumming narcissists will still enter women’s spaces like the entitled men that they are. The point is: I can complain and not get banned because I’m the bigot. The venue can ask them to leave. And if they throw the”I’m a real woman” Tantrum of Delusion, the venue can tell them to piss off and not worry about getting into hot water.

You’re not getting the point: nobody needs proof. We are safe in the knowledge the spaces ARE ours and that something will be done if the colonisers decide to barge their way in. The spaces they try and infiltrate where the need someone else to give them a pass to enter - such as women’s prisons, sports teams and DV shelters - however WILL require proof and they WILL be stopped from colonising those places too. Toilets are the thin end of the wedge

It means, if transwomen are men in disguise, what disguise is there?
Because they do look like men (apart from a tiny number who've transitioned medically pre puberty). So they aren't very well disguised. Ergo not in disguise.
When my DD was a toddler and put on a ducky towel and we said "where's DD" and she said "it's really me" and we said OH we didn't know it was you... We did.

I don’t think they are in disguise at all. I think they look like men. Because they are.

And god knows, living near the student area of a major city, I see plenty of them. Frequently with really terrible hair and some unfortunate clothing choices, but they are free to make absolute twerps of themselves in their student years, as I did with different fashion choices in mine.

I think this clarification of the law makes women much safer, @HardyKoala. Some places are required by law to have separate single sex toilets, changing rooms, hospital wards, prisons etc. No more males in them, thank god.

Sport for women would break the law to accept transwomen. Women’s prizes, shortlists, mentoring programmes are now for women and not for men with gender identities.

This is a big win - the rights that we’re stolen from women under the guise of inclusivity and Being Kind are ours once more.

About fucking time.

So ask me what you want to know. Leaving hidden laughing reaction emojis on serious posts is just abusive behaviour.

No it’s not. I made a load of points to you asking how you could tell if men had entered a woman’s space and all you did was ask if I agreed with them being there or not. I didn’t say I agreed with them being there I asked how you could tell?

• I don't believe for a minute that this won't embolden people to accuse women of being men if they aren't feminine enough more often than before.

i’ve seen this said a couple of times on here the last couple of days and I’m baffled as to why there’s apparently this fear. Is it younger people who can’t remember the situation in public toilets and other single sex spaces 8-10 years ago before trans women as a group felt entitled to enter female spaces and women were bullied into staying silent if they spotted a male in one?

If you’re concerned, I can assure you that this wasn’t a massive issue before women were told they can’t have safe single sex spaces, and there’s no reason to think we won’t go back to the same state of affairs.

Even if the odd biological woman is challenged, the minute she speaks it will be obvious she’s not male and it’s better that than for women and girls to be made unsafe because of the presence of males in what should be single sec spaces.

If we look at the stats on sex offending, 90% of assaults on women take place in mixed sex changing facilities, and only 10% in single sex spaces. Single sec spaces are massively safer for women. That can’t be argued.

Better a little embarrassment than a rape, right?

And that’s before we consider privacy and dignity issues.