TRAs deface Millicent Fawcett statue

[Peony1897]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/04/19/transgender-activists-deface-millicent-fawcett-statue/

How dare they.

Very bizarre to see the leaders of the protests acting as if they're not completely top-down, like all trans activism. They actually think they're grassroots.

They are a disgrace

Yes and don't forget that statistically we are dealing with a lot of genuinely vulnerable people, especially in younger cohort. Those who are autistic, been in care or have suffered sexual assault make up a high proportion of young trans people.

I think James Dreyfus has put it well -

'What’s shocking about this particular video is not only the brazen assumption that one group has the entitled right to forcibly impinge upon another’s well established rights, but also the naked, grotesque, almost obligatory aggression, meted out with ZERO shame or self-reflection. There’s actual pride in their hatred on display here. The gleeful joy with which they spit their venom is alarming & deeply worrisome.

The social contract regarding women’s right to privacy, dignity & safety, that was once widely understood, respected & sacred, has been under attack for years now. Which, of course, is the ultimate endgame of Queer Theory & gender ideology…to destroy all boundaries.

This has created a new, ominous movement, quite different in nature & purpose, that has been actively nurtured, promoted, funded & lied to by so many nefarious institutions, lobbyists & politicians. Other groups have also jumped aboard, manipulating & using these youngsters like so much cattle.

There IS NO reasoning with them. Because dissent & enmity is what they want.

There IS NO rationalising with them. Because the rationality doesn’t exist.

Bottom line is, these kids have been taught that this behaviour is perfectly acceptable. That it is completely noble. That this is the only way to achieve what you demand. It’s like rewarding puppies for biting. And obviously & inevitably, they grow into dogs, whose bite has the potential to be lethal. This behaviour is now the rule, not the exception. And, frankly, that should terrify us all'

x.com/DreyfusJames/status/1914254540708237316

Schroedingers trans person.
Not mentally vulnerable at all and shouldn't be treated as such.
But also the most mentally vulnerable people in our society.

This is not a maintainable position.

Very well put, by one of the truly brave men.

James Dreyfus is a brave man. Very eloquently put.

For what it is worth. Within our family there is a child, X, who expresses themself as trans. I've never posted their story on here as it is not mine to tell. Nor do I refer to them, but I feel it's important that you know there are quite a few women posting here who have children or adult family members who are trans.

In our case, X, and siblings, are now together with people who love and care for them, following a sexually, mentally, and physically abusive childhood, including drug and alcohol abuse. I'm not saying that all children who say they are trans have been through this.

Like all children, they need the most tremendous support, a lot of love, and honesty, particularly in answering their questions in an age appropriate way. Sadly we can't undo their past, but try to make their future a better one.

I see many people in the so called trans movement who claim to be "on their side" but are there to exploit, make money, serve their own interests, or grift. They've been to the forefront this past week.

Men with hateful placards, the likes of Heather Herbert, Upton, Darlington "Rose", and certain mediocre lawyers using " trans" as their usp are not the role models I want for X. The list is long. What does a man shouting that he wants to take a shite on JKR's head do for X? Nothing but instill fear of a woman who has done X no harm.

This is what concerns me when I see the abuse directed at women on these rallies. I'm not the enemy here. I agree that society needs to change to accommodate us all. Taking away existing rights from one group and demonising them, whilst not campaigning for your own, is not the way.

Your last paragraph I completely agree with. I wish you well, it's a hard road for these children.

At the root of the issue for me is how do you believe/feel you are a woman "in your heart and brain" without experiencing ALL of the following as a possible reality for you: the fear of rape, the fear of being easily overpowered by violent men, the fear of pregnancy, abortion, periods, PMS, gynaecological phenomena, breasts (including your relationship to them, fear of breast cancer, breast cancer, mastectomy or the the idea of it), social pressure in terms of aesthetics (regarding curves, body hair removal, surgical enhancements, cosmetics), undermining in the family, school and workplace as a direct result of being female, lack of employment opportunities and equal pay, motherhood (physical changes, labour, breastfeeding, childbirth) but also non-motherhood (dealing with complicated feelings or social challenging around this), the mental load, the menopause, social conditioning towards kindness, self-censorship out of fear of physical reprisal.
Have I missed anything?

For me, all the above is what it means to be a woman as opposed to a man.

And I genuinely cannot understand how it would be possible to feel like a woman without having EVER been shaped by these factors.

Well that is certainly something we can agree on.

You do see don't you that a huge part of the concerns many women have IS for this vulnerable group of young people being used by Men's Rights activists, being encouraged to medically transition before they are old enough to even safely iron their own school uniforms.

These young people are being sent to the metaphorical and quite literal meat grinder to the benefit of predatory men who have discovered a new way to access the spaces of women and children

We don't hate transpeople. For many of us it's firstly about the protection of children.

The women's rights stuff is both entirely separate and absolutely entwined in that.

As someone who works with vulnerable people I know all too well how a small but significant minority of men will take any opportunity available to them to abuse vulnerable people.

Well yes, this has always been obvious. Two different groups arguing over what the word "woman" means.

The problem is that what TRAs and allies are demanding is not even consistent within their own claimed beliefs.

They simulateously demand:

• that female biology is not the fundamental, necessary and sufficient property of womanhood

• that resources and spaces that were put in place to meet the needs of people who do posess female biology morally now belong to people who are not biologically female based on this new definition even though they explicitly reject the very basis on which this things exist having anything to do with being a woman

• that people who are biologically female must accept the naked physical presence of and potentially intimate care from people who are not biologically female because they are presumed to share this "womanness", even though that definition of womanness explicitly rejects commonality based on the body

• that people who are biologically female are not allowed to say "ok, based on this new definition I'm not actually a "woman", however I am still undeniably female and have challanges

Do you see? The fundamental injustice TRAs are attempting to enact upon women isn't a different definition for "woman" (though undoubtably that is a huge issue in its own right), it is that we are not allowed to redefine ourselves as a result of it.

It is the incoherency of saying "a woman is not who you always thought she was" yet still expecting everything that was based on the old definition stay in place.

That tells us it is not our biology that makes us women but at the same time does not respect our right to say "Female biology is more significant to my life experiences and self understanding than this idea of gender, so if femaleness is not part of being a woman then I want to have spaces and language and rights that are based in being female rather than womanhood".

Because if "woman" is no longer tied to "female", there is no coherent reason for female needs, rights and privacy to be tied to the banner of "woman".

The two consistent positions are that womanhood continues to be specifically female, or that womanhood is not specifically female, in which case there is no reason that femaleness cannot be recognised and supported outside of womanhood.

That the latter is not considered acceptable by the Genderist movement tells you everything you need to know - it's not a coherent philosphical belief, it's simply a petulant land grab by people who want to have their cake and eat it, who are only concerned with their own accomodation and their entitled assumption that everyone else must fall into line and accept a new identity and the new allowable boundaries being imposed on to them.

The whole thing with the Tavistock backs that up, they were content to allow that shit show to continue as it was. Nobody who cares about children and young people support that kind of set up. Nobody who cares about children and young people develops a 'transition or suicide' mantra.

Similarly to when people you ‘know’ are far right racists and antisemites but have enough plausible deniability that you can’t prove it until the point they overplay their hand and sieg heil, although it’s awful, I’m kind of glad these misogynists have attacked the statue of a suffragette. I now know I’m not crazy. They really do hate women.

I think the TRAs have done a terrible disservice to the majority of transgender people who have been quietly going about their lives for many decades.

Trans isn’t a new fad invented to start Twitter wars. The vast majority of women including myself have never previously taken issue with transwomen.

However, something changed in more recent times and it took me a while to catch on to what was really going on.

When transwomen said they wanted to ‘identify’ as women I was like ‘cool, identify how you want, live and let live. When they were doing drag shows, again I wasn’t bothered. When they said they wanted to use women’s bathrooms, I was like ‘okay I guess, I’m in a cubicle and in any case how often will I be in a public toilet and see a trans woman’.

Then I started seeing criminals on the news with a full beard and Adam’s Apple being called ‘she’ and was like ‘what’s going on?’. Then they said TWAW and I was like ‘what does that mean, because I’m a woman and many of them have willys’. Then they told me I was a ‘Cis-woman’ who ‘chestfeeds’ and will be bullied and gaslit into ignoring my own eyes and agreeing that a man is a woman or else I could lose my job. I was like ‘what the fuck?!, these people are crazy’!.

I still couldn’t work out the true agenda. Now they have defaced the statue of a women who fought for women’s rights, I now see they are misogynistic male activists who were probably in Fathers for Justice only a few years ago. They want women’s rights rolled back and the way they tried to do it was try and blur the lines of sex. Well done to the women who clocked earlier and went to court.

Wonky Wednesday: Trans People and Sexual Orientation - National LGBTQ Task Force

'This leaves less than ¼, or 23%, of transgender survey respondents identifying as straight. Trans people who are straight—trans women who are only romantically and sexually interested in men and trans men who are only romantically and sexually interested in women.'

This is a huge part of the problem that people don't seem to talk about. These transwomen are often still sexually attracted to biological women, which is one of many reasons why we don't want them in our spaces.

But we are living in topsy turvy land here.

Trans women who are only attracted to men and trans men who are only attracted to women are homosexual, not heterosexual.

The “no one is asking you to” was in response to

It makes no difference to my humiliation and fear by what might or might not be going on inside his head at the time. How much disrespect must you have for women to think their reality should be predicated on the possible thoughts inside a man's head?

That’s right; no one was asking us to.

They were telling us to.

My mum was a tough nut to crack and always minimised it all as a storm in a tea cup but she finally gets it now. Well done lads, for doing what I couldn’t and peaking her.

I was half expecting that there would be Amnesty International branded signs, like the misogynistic wankers harassing rape survivors at Filia in Portsmouth.

They all thought the GRA was irrelevant and they could go wherever the fuck they wanted all the time.

I actually found your original post thoughtful and helpful, but also wondered if it was written with any awareness that the same could be said for GC women’s perspective, just substituting ‘reality’ for ‘beliefs’. It was sensible enough overall that I assumed so, but the reply above disappointed me.

A court has highlighted that they are entitled to their beliefs, but that they can’t refuse others the same and more besides. Recognising how distressing this may be for trans individuals must surely enable a similar recognition of how extraordinarily distressing it must have been for women to have needed the legal system to uphold, in the face of government opposition, their entitlement to perceive and speak of actual reality.

Thanks.

I guess my original thought is unchanged. Some of those parents are turning up to a general protest out of fear without deeper understanding. Some simply because they want to apply general pressure to get their way without considering the needs of others.

It seems many are mindlessly contributing to fear and hate, and it is not the feminists who are the ones contributing it to. They are just the scapegoats.

I am sure many of those who attended felt rather proud to be there. And still not one person took the people with the signs and the chants aside and said ‘enough! This is inappropriate’. Yet apparently women using correct language to describe people when in media, in writing etc, continues to be admonished and even vilified.

The lack of symmetry around this philosophical belief continues as ever.

This is an excellent article and well worth a read !

Very few mothers will not understand the deeply held beliefs that a child can be something else. I have met a cat and a wolf in the past 10 years.

I do know parents who would go on a rampage if the cat was not allowed its ears in the classroom.

And I think we're seeing the same thing here with a dose of a feeling of injustice because of the camouflage of gay rights.

This does not change the underlying reality. There was no cat or wolf in the classroom. No man turned into a woman or vice versa. And the protest completely ignores that women need a definition and rights as a sex class.

I am sorry -

I guess for a moment I was frustrated that I was trying in good faith to say, in response to a general invitation to explain what the protest is about if anyone could, "look, if you really do want to know why transpeople are upset, it's because in many cases they have a different belief system which leads them down a different thought process in this way" - not that I think in that way but that I am trying to explain that thought process - and within 2 minutes the very first response was "well I don't care, they have no right to barge in on women's spaces" (to paraphrase), which has been covered over and over in this thread, wasn't relevant to the point I was making, wasn't what I was arguing for at all. I wasn't saying "trans people think this and therefore they should have these rights to go in single sex spaces etc, their feelings should be more important than women", and it just felt like my intention was being misunderstood, again.

I personally am naturally GC and completely understand the viewpoint of women in needing and wanting privacy and dignity and the ability to define ourselves by our sex class.

There isn’t a conflict in terms of sex though
There are two sexes only.

Trans = gender

To label something unisex means male + female
Stonewall et all now need to campaign for gender neutral facilities ( shared ) or specific gender facilities ie for trans women and transmen

Given in public buildings women are always under provided we can only hope our facilities are not again sacrificed for others.