To say no to being a guarantor for SC mum?

[OhYesYouDid0]

Wondering what everyone's thoughts are on this.

My husband has children with his ex partner. I don't have a problem with his ex, we actually get on pretty well and she's a good mum. But I know she struggles with money and being sensible with it, I'm not judging but it's important context to this situation.

She asked recently if DH would meet her for a coffee to discuss something. It turns out she is in a bit of a mess financial and has a large amount of debt. Long story short she is having to leave her current home and downsize but due to poor credit she is having to put down a guarantor on the new property and she has asked that this be DH. She doesn't have much family around other than elderly parents and one brother whom she isn't close to.

DH came home to discuss this with me and I'm at a loss. Honestly I want to say no. We are comfortable financially but there are things we have planned for the next few years that are quite money heavy, an extension on our house, perhaps trying for another child (we have one 5 year old together) and I am reluctant to potentially have those plans put more financial strain on us or have to change completely if she were to need DH to help cover the rent. She assures us it won't come to that but really who knows. She lost her job a couple of years ago (redundancy) and has struggled since then on lower paid ones she says, having taking things on credit she really shouldn't have.

DH is obviously torn as its his children's home but has said he would not agree to anything if I wasn't fully on board.

It's hard, I have absolutely no issue with SC living with us if it helps or being here more often (currently 3 nights per week) but part of me does feel that's where our obligation ends. I am reluctant to put potential strain on my own life, children, finances because of exes money troubles and I want to say no.

WWYD?

There’s a lot of people in here who don’t have a clue about what it means to be a guarantor. Or even an adult.
she has got herself into this situation by not being careful with money. She doesn’t need a flash car on HP for example.
i know how you feel. We ended up doing this for my in-laws. It was the worst thing we could’ve done as it made them complacent and they thought they didn’t have to try and improve their terrible money mismanagement as a result.
people mis-manage money for lots of reasons. If they can’t get themselves out of the debt by their own willpower, and have no motivation to do so, then they are using you as the guarantor not because they need it but because they don’t have the inclination to take responsibility.
people who are bad with money often stay bad with money forever. She didn’t use the proceeds of the sale of the marital house to invest - it looks like she just lived off it. This is a tell-tale sign of someone who can’t differentiate between present “easy-life” decisions and future needs that require a bit more sacrifice.
its not your responsibility. If you help you will be helping her for longer than you realise. It will be something else after this. I cannot warn you of this strongly enough.
ask her to approach a debt charity and change her ways.

OP said the kids can live with them. He isn’t responsible for his ex

Good suggestions here

Nothing in the world should be as important to the children’s mother as providing them with a stable home with her. Yet she has made bad financial decisions that she knew were risking this. Why is it the fathers job to make up for the mothers failings? Why is it more his responsibility than hers?

1. No idea to be honest, if she genuinely had no money then I would have helped her claim UC / housing benefit which would have more than covered her expenses along with her child maintenance (her ExH is a high earner and she gets a very decent amount). Thing is she’s a decent earner herself and affording the house alone wasn’t the issue (she more than met that criteria) the problem was her credit rating (apparently it was low as she doesn’t use credit and prefers to pay in full). That’s part of the reason I stood as guarantor, she showed me her financials and I could see she could easily afford it.

2. The judge took issue with the contract and its wording but basically decided that the cost of having to evict a tenant is the price of doing business as a landlord so he couldn’t completely put that on me so he had to shoulder some of the cost but she also acknowledged that had I not stood as guarantor, he wouldn’t have rented to my “friend” in first place therefore I was partially liable.

3. No I don’t believe I can, I basically agreed to pay her rent if she didn’t so that’s that.

You will be paid back with excuses and tears

I didn’t catch the age of the children

Op said kids are teens

So why does that not equally apply to their mother ? Spending recklessly and risking the roof over their heads and then expecting to be bailed out by her ex of ten years isn’t ensuring their well-being is it ? I agree it’s just as much his responsibility to make sure his children are properly housed, which he can do by moving them in with him and OP. He has absolutely no moral obligation to bail out their mother from debt she knowingly got herself into.

I'm not surprised after years on MN. It's all about perspective. Here's the reality:

The posters who believe the OP&DH should pay/be guarantors say so because they themselves would want to be paid/supported and think that they somehow deserve it no matter what.

The posters who say the OP&DH should not do this are looking at it from the angle of actually being the person on the hook and paying out their hard earned money for an Ex's financial mistakes.

In this situation being guarantors for the DM has the potential to sink both sides of the family. If the concern is really for the DC, then the smartest thing to do is make sure that one side remains financially secure, so there will always be a home available for the DC.

Lending a bit of a helping hand for the DM is nice if possible, but not in any way that risks the security of the OP&DH. They already pay above what is required based on them having almost 50/50, so they are in no way obligated to do more.

I would only consider the lump sum as a loan on the condition she'll be paying you back each month instead of her landlord (if she's reliant on universal credit that might not be allowed though)
I think he pays decent maintenance (unless he earns above 100k then he should pay more)
He could tell her if she ever defaults on rent then he won't pay the child maintenance that month (but send kids food etc directly instead) but there's nothing then stopping her immediately signing up to child maintenance service.

I dated a guy who was doing this for his ex who wasn't from the uk and didn't have much warning power here, he felt responsible as he'd brought her here and didn't want her to leave the country with their kids either. I liked and respected this about him but it was off putting as I felt like I'd never be the proper partner she would always come first like another child to be looked after forever.

This could also impact you remortgaging if you need to do that to do your renovations,

You also need to consider the possibility she'll go into social housing further away and take the kids further and they'd move schools etc

I'm not sure how he'd explain this to his kids. Your mum can't get a home because I'm protecting the chance of making my home even bigger.

@Winter2020 the maintenance in advance letter wouldn't work. Anything above the child maintenance monthly amount is considered a gift to the child maintenance service. If she registered with them he'd have to pay from the day she signs up

And how is the mum going to explain the fact that she has got herself into massive debt and caused them to be homeless when with her?

It is not his responsibility to house her. He pays way over cms and as long as he has done this via traceable means ie standing orders and not in cash then cms will see that and would not pursue a claim.

The split well over 10 years ago and op and her dh have been married for 10 years. He has obligations to his kids which he is more than meeting.

The ex has got herself into this mess and I say that as someone who was a single parent for years with an ex who earns more than double what I earn.

Instead of paying her maintenance can he pay it direct to the landlord ?

The last thing you need is to be responsible for other people's debts. I know she is struggling and you want to help but this commitment to pay if she can't (which is likely considering her past history) is too much.

At the moment, she just thinks it's just an extra signature on her rental agreement and it's no big deal.

8 months of not being able to pay rent and you owing 50k in lost rent and solicitors fees - your relationship with her will be completely destroyed which is a disaster for the children.

I think you need to sit down with her and have a caring conversation about how you can help but the guarantor request is too big an ask.

Ok so I think she shouldn't move out of her current home without the next one secured, which she can't without a guarantor it seems .
This is not an emergency as she isn't homeless yet. She should first try to sort out debt support see if any can be written off or the monthly payback reduced.
See if universal credit will help pay her rent - it should if she is on a low income without savings which it sounds like she is.
If she has a spare room, then ask permission from landlord to take in a lodger or foreign language student to help pay the current rent.

What is the difference between the rent she's paying now and the rent on the desired now properly? If it's say £800, how can you help her to help herself to earn or cut costs to make up £800 a month? Possibly having the kids more (although they're teens)
She also needs to get income protection insurance /life insurance.

The op and her partner are not responsible for the ex being in financial trouble

That’s not why Mum can’t get a home though, is it?

Absolutely not, far too big risk to do for anyone.

those saying he has responsibility to the ex partner she is a grown up she needs to take the responsibility for herself. I actually can’t believe people think you should do this.

I think he needs to do this to enable her to have a home for his kids. Lots of people need guarantors unfortunately. It would be awful for his kids to have to move in with you full time and see their mum in a flat share. I understand your concerns but I would bet she will pay the rent first before any other commitments because the risk of not doing so is too great.

@Blueblell but she openly admits she has made bad decisions with credit why will this be different.