Most shops are just landfill waiting to happen.

[SummerDaytoNight]

I mean, all are to a point, but I’m talking about the non essential ones.

Our society is engineering its own collapse. We only need food, health, house basics and clothing. And I suppose, technology.

Fast fashion could go. Housing should just be the essentials.

My friend took me into a shop called sostrene grene. It was lovely, but nothing was essential. Most shops are like that.

The horse has bolted, but I wish we could limit the unnecessarily stuff and just have the basics. Im not talking Amish level, but there’s no need for all this waste. It would be so much better if only the essentials were produced.

At the point of production, it’s already basically landfill.

@SummerDaytoNight how to make a bag out of an old tshirt - with NO SEWING.

https://www.instructables.com/No-Sew-10-Minute-T-Shirt-Tote/

Not too sure, tbh.

Some things yes, but I think are too far gone.
Then Again, just buy a bloody apple and don’t get a stupid plastic pot with a ready peeled grape or something.

Would people go back to soap bars and get rid of shower gel and liquid soap?

We have swapped to shampoo bars and I much prefer bars of soap for washing my hands and body. Definitely noticed less plastic in the recycling bin. Vast reduction in plastic if we can persuade manufacturers to change

I know. I do think there's a way forward that doesn't have to be so extreme. Of your four points, it would be sad to lose the second.

If we worked to better our consumer society, there's no reason that we can't still transport essentials around the globe (like food items).

But buying less, buying locally where possible and being less wasteful with food should be possible without sacrificing other things. If we can get the consumer society under control.

My point was that no one seems to care about the huge waste of plastic on wrapping "big" items, and obsess about carrier bags and straws.

When we had our G-Plan sofas delivered, they came in a cloth handling bags with handles etc - no cardboard, no plastic. Re-usable, the delivery guys took them away with them for future deliveries.

So there are options. Trouble is that plastic is cheap which is why it's used. Consumers should be willing to pay that bit extra for more sustainable delivery options or at least ask at the furniture store about packaging. But I'd imagine most consumers don't give it a second thought. They're happy with their virtue signalling obsessing about the small stuff.

Clothes never used to be individually wrapped between factory and shop. They were sent in bundles. Now virtually every item is unnecessarily singly packed in plastic bags. You seen the shop workers unpacking individual items before putting on racks/shelves, and those individually wrapped items are already packed in larger packed bundles or boxes. Completely unnecessary. Huge waste for no reason at all. The items would still be clean and neat if they just came in their bundles/boxes. It's not as if they were left unpackaged in the back of a lorry!

I definitely are with this. The problem is seen you start to suggest ideas, anything omitted sounds like it's not important.

I don't know why things like sofas and beds should be shipped around the world. Surely it's easier to send materials (as locally as possible, not around the planet) and build locally.

We have to make changes. We have to produce less and we have to cut back on waste.

Construction products already have to do this - not by law, but in order to win contracts.

We have to make changes. We have to produce less and we have to cut back on waste.

Nice sentiment but that’s all it is, less production means less jobs, more unemployment, more unemployment means more social problems and a bigger drain on the economy ……there can be a snowball effect to all of this

Anyway who is going to dictate to a company / companies to stop production

Why should we in the UK worry about fewer production jobs in China?

Do you just want to limit production in China and not world wide, it seems to be a world wide issue

I find the thought of poor people not being able to afford good quality clothing annoying too.
And unless you want the newest Brand sneaker or have the most eclectic taste everything you want can be bought second hand. It might take more effort for some items but just typing black shirt into vinted isn't that hard.

We have to make changes. We have to produce less and we have to cut back on waste

I certainly agree but I think incentives often work better than banning products.
What about giving monetary incentives to people if they produce less than a certain amount of waste. Or giving out vouchers to people if they use a repair srvice instead of throwing away their washing machine.
I would also love for celebrities to endorse that lifestyle. Taylor Swift or Kate Middleton were 50% vintage clothes would certainly send a stronger message than some virtuous preaching.

I was out shopping today and there was just piles of stuff to buy in Dunelm and M&S. I can understand why people succumb. So much choice.

I didn’t and bought groceries

Seasalt are good at not using excess packaging

Totally agree. We sort of have something like this for manufacturers in the UK. Manufacturers have to declare the amount of packaging they place on the market and they are charged a fee accordingly. So there's defiantly things happening in the background - maybe not enough. I think the voucher thing is a great idea.

FFS even mumsnet are at it. On my list of threads we have :

"In need of a complete new wardrobe" and "Have you got outfits for Easter?"

I noticed that… !

I thought exactly the same at those headlines, though I clicked on them all annoyed and it turns out they're for growing children.

I do not know anyone who gets a new outfit for Easter. I understand kids under 5 having an outfit/top with Peter Rabbit, bunnies, lambs, flowers.

I will be wearing a hoodie, comfy trousers and trainers, my usual dress sense this time of the year.

Think all repairs including cars and boilers should be exempt from VAT.

OP I can’t argue with the fact that there is way too much poor quality plastic that from China etc. around these days and I absolutely hate what fast fashion has done to the clothing industry. I don’t buy from places like Temu or Shein on principle but I know a lot of people who do. So I am generally in agreement that things should change. I’d like to see fast fashion taxed to oblivion and I’d also be fine with high import type charges for non U.K. made goods for those who really really want them. I agree with you about plastic bags, I’m actually one of those people who never brings a bag and pays the plastic bag tax for convenience (partly due to suspected ADHD and bipolar disorder my executive functioning isn’t always the best). I’m glad I have the option honestly, however I am fully confident that I would adapt if it became a matter of pay more significant money for a new cloth bag every time I go to the supermarket. I probably would end up doing that occasionally but I think 95 percent of the time I’d manage if I really had to. I agree there is a weird sudden emphasis on shopping for celebrations and holidays and holiday related decor etc. Though I do love my Christmas baubles and I also saw the thread about new Easter clothes and thought “how ridiculous” then remembered my mum telling me that as a child in the 1950s one of the biggest treats of the year was their new Easter dresses for church on Easter Sunday (handmade on a sewing machine by her mum of course). So I guess that’s been around as a tradition longer than people might realise!

But your vision of society is a bit too far for me in terms of being austere and utilitarian for me personally. I place high value on things being aesthetically pleasing, more than nearly anyone else I know. But it genuinely matters to me in my everyday life and the quality of my life. And also things like the clothes I wear and homeware/decor/furniture I see as an expression of my creativity/artistic nature. I’d hate to be limited to “well you only really @need one kind of plate, it’s basic and white and you can eat off it so that’s what’s available in the shops, all of the shops”. I feel like human beings want a certain amount of choice (I do agree sometimes it’s ridiculous and overwhelming/paralysing too like the aisle of various Oreo products someone mentioned). We’re also driven to shop as part of gathering resources basically. So shopping as a thing isn’t just going to go away. But there is a happy medium! I love the sort of little stores you mention to be honest 🤣 But I choose my purchases very carefully and I tend to invest in high quality long lasting items that I really love.

one of the biggest treats of the year was their new Easter dresses for church on Easter Sunday (handmade on a sewing machine by her mum of course). So I guess that’s been around as a tradition longer than people might realise!

I am guessing though that your mum's new dress was a generic summer dress which would be worn for the first time on Easter Sunday and then worn many more times over the rest of the summer and in autumn with a cardi on the top! The problem is the promotion of Easter specific clothing with bunnies or whatever which people do not want to wear again in May July or September.

You might want to have a look at C40 cities agenda clothing.

Great idea!

That’s not what I said and you know it .