To wonder if Labour really understand the implications of their attack on private schools?

[Bumpitybumper]

I've just found out a private school near me is almost certainly closing. I honestly think this is a disaster for everyone involved. Obviously the direct employees (teachers, caretakers, caterers and cleaners etc) and the suppliers will suffer. The children will now need to find a new school either in the state or private sector. Easier said than done considering many of the good local schools are full so there it isn't like they are applying for a state schools with a full range of options that everyone else has. Most importantly though, I wonder if the government has quite anticipated the type of children that they are disrupting and harming here.

I withdrew my child from this private school because the school was basically acting as a bit of a school that unofficially specialised in SEN and my child doesn't have a SEN so it was a poor fit. Many of the children struggled with behaviour, socialising and needed adaptions to the school day to keep them on an even keel. The school managed this fine as it was small enough to adapt and create an environment that wasn't too stressful for the children. I am seriously worried about what will happen to these kids now. I don't think many of them could cope in a state setting, especially one that is struggling already to deliver a good level of education to the children there. I honestly think these children will either have their own education decimated or they will incredibly disruptive and resource hungry which will impact other kids. I feel really angry on these poor children's behalf. The parents that I know that sent their kids there were doing so as a last resort because they had been failed by the state sector.

AIBU to think that Labour really hasn't thought through who they are impacting with their anti private school policies? They are nowhere near nuanced enough to target the privileged only and inevitably many struggling and SEN kids are going to be hugely detrimented by this.

SEND provision has been a shit show for years but you now have an interest in it.__

You’d think with all the money they spend on education, people would be able to understand this simple caveat re places applied for / places taken… 🤷🏻‍♀️

Another bloody thread on Mumsnet about Private School VAT. They should just set up a separate forum for you all.

Have you ever noticed that there an awful lot of threads on MN about lots of topics? Why wouldn't something that's topical not being the subject of lots of threads? Have you noticed there is also loads on disability benefit reforms etc? Shall we make separate forums for all of these too?

Don't like it, don't read it!

I hate Labour.

They are awful

Taking money off pensioners. Disabled and kids

I agree op. It said it was a
Mistake to do this. It won't help fund any other provision.

Apparently some councils are paying the VAT for DC with SEN rather than pay for extra resources at the local state school.

One of my friends works in a state school and she is 1-1 with a child all week. If the local council now has to do this for DC moving private to state then the cheaper option will be to fund the VAT.

I think parents should pursue this. Make Labour wince.

Why do you think that both can’t be true? SEN pupils leaving because their parents cannot afford the fees and those with highly academic children leaving because they can find state alternatives.

Many of the state schools that are closing have a high percentage of children with SEN. It is those parents (many of whom have used state schools in the past for their children and whom turned to private schools in desperation) that can least afford the fee increases. Fulneck school in Leeds is one of them. It has a significant number of pupils that are actually funded by the LEA. More than 30 I believe. However, just because a SEN child doesn’t have an ECHP, doesn’t mean that their needs are insignificant. The difficulties in obtaining ECHP’s are widely reported.

It is also true that applications for sixth forms from private school parents are significantly increasing. At a time when there are huge cost pressures, it isn’t surprising. Parents are focusing their funds on years 7-11 and looking to save money where they can. Many private school parents went to state schools themselves and we understand how different sixth form is compared to years 7-11. Most of the kids who can’t be arsed to learn and cause disruption have left by then.

And by the way, I can still afford my DC’s fees. That doesn’t mean that I have no empathy for those that can’t or those state school pupils that are going to be impacted by this.

You could always try Netmums if Mumsnet is a problem for you.

I don't have a particular interest in it. My kids aren't SEN and I don't pretend to be some SEN advocate. That's why I was shocked by my experience at the private school about the role that private schools play regarding SEN. I think lots of people like me, who have used state schools and were state educated themselves don't really understand this element. We see the Eton and Harrows of this world, not the kids in private schools with pretty average academic results but that meet other needs.

Whether you agree with private schools or not, I just can't see how loads of kids with additional needs joining the state sector will help anyone when we are already in a crisis. Nobody on this thread has been able to explain that either.

No, taxing education doesn’t make sense and labour don’t have any significant or real funding or ideas to help the SEN crisis.

What they are doing is making it harder for young adults failed by the state system to claim benefits, that’s been their most significant idea around SEN hasn’t it? What does that tell SEN parents about what’s in store?

didn’t a labour minister refer to PIP as pocket money? Revealing.

"One of my friends works in a state school and she is 1-1 with a child all week. If the local council now has to do this for DC moving private to state then the cheaper option will be to fund the VAT."

A child who has full time 1:1 has very high needs. They would not be educated in a non specialist private school.

We have three kids in our non specialist private school with 1-1. Diagnoses of AuADHD. Struggle with organisation, sequencing, processing but can thrive in the mainstream setting with their support person and get all the benefits of being in a mostly NT environment, social and sporting activities etc.

If you’ve been following the court case, which closed yesterday, they knew the carnage was going to happen, they didn’t want to cut into revenue and decided to plough on anyway.

anyone saying this is for the betterment of state schools should know the tax collected hasn’t been fenced off for only schools- it’s gone to the total
pot of tax for everything in the budget.

What was the verdict?

The verdict hasn’t been published yet.

And nope to your last point. Our massive outstanding sixth form college takes everybody. The privately educated often move into the state sector at sixth form, it’s nothing new.

Yes, DD's college is the same.

I thought that loads of kids have always left private school for state sixth form, presumably because a) the even higher fees of private school sixth forms, b) the larger colleges (like my DD's) offer a vast range of A levels, c) behaviour in A level classes (according to my DD) isn't an issue, it's always fine because presumably the kids want to be there and they can be kicked out more easily than at a school and d) the old belief that Unis would consider you state school if you did A levels in a state setting when in actual fact they also consider where you did your GCSEs.

I'm sure that last year there was a huge rise in 6th form entries because that year was a huge birth year. It was the year below DD and all the schools that I know of had to create bulge classes.

I don't care either way about the VAT on private school fees but I do think there's always been an influx from private to state in 6th form.

There are children with 1 to 1 in my younger children’s state primary

‘And nope to your last point. Our massive outstanding sixth form college takes everybody. The privately educated often move into the state sector at sixth form, it’s nothing new.’

Found out that ours has discussed - IF needed, which isn’t at the moment at all- either only taking state educated students OR students from the city boundary schools which excludes all but 1 of the many privates.
The first option seems to be the most sensible as they have several schools -state- outside of the city boundaries that send a lot of their children to this very successful 6th form.

We know from the legal action that the Government were advised by the treasury that over 100 schools would close, 56000 children forced into the state sector in the first two years and the policy is unlikely to generate any revenue. This isn’t a case of Labour not thinking through a policy resulting in unintended negative consequences, the negative consequences are the main aim of the policies.

‘Forced into the state sector’, like over 90% of children in the UK. Boo hoo.

100% of children had tax free access to none state education until January, now 0% do.

That costs the tax payer though, where it didn’t before. What’s the point if no funding comes from it?