To not go to a friend’s party because she still owes me money?

[SpaceMoo]

They are DH’s friends really more than mine, and have borrowed money from us to help out their son buy a house. That was a year ago. She’s now having a massive 50th party and is very keen for us all to go. She’s also been on holiday (flying business class she raved to us - it was a gift apparently.) We’ve asked for the money back three times now and she said it’s so hard to take out loans and her other property didn’t sell, problems with tenants etc.

Anyway, I would prefer to cut her off and get solicitors involved. DH trusts her he said and thinks they’re just putting the house on the market and will give the money back. He sees her more often than me as they work close by. He doesn’t want to end it and thinks I’m being petty, it’s just a matter of time. In the meantime she advised us to remortgage our property (which me and DH argued about and a) I resent the arguing and b) point blank refused.

It’s time to get solicitors involved I feel. (Money amount 40k)

I think that’s a good plan.

And it isn’t too late for something in writing. You don’t need a loan document, you just need her acknowledgment in writing that she owes repayment. That could be as simple as an email from her saying when she intends to repay.

Going nuclear and shaming her at the party will achieve precisely nothing. It might be something some posters would find cathartic in an angry way, but looked at logically it would be taking away the only leverage you currently have, which is her desire to contain this and stop it being publicly outed. That’s why doing something before the party is a good idea. It’s the threat of outing her that will have more effect than actually outing her - which will in fact turn the tables back on you by leaving her with no more to lose. Send in your rsvp: we’ll be there!!!

… and op I’m glad DH has come round to acknowledging he needs to chase this up. He’s been a daft twit but if he’s normally great I’m glad to think of you guys working through this.

Some posters have not had their sport on MN if they don’t implode a marriage on every thread !

@CantStopMoving I have seen Judge Rinder and can fully appreciate that people do friend's favours. But there are stringent checks in place as to the origins of any finance when house purchases are involved and I can't believe that this would pass them. Mortgage companies are not keen on deposits coming from loans, and any gifts have to be declared as such with evidence of where the money came from. So even if the friend's son said he was gifted the money from his parents, his parents would have to prove where they got the money from.

Yes this - I was given some money towards my house deposit and there was a lot of paperwork and proof that it had been in the account for many months involved.

DH and her keep using words like ‘she had to raise the capital’. I know what this means obviously, but it’s so pretentious!
I have explained it to him in plain English, she has taken our money!

Why does he think her liquidity issues were in any way your problem?

Yeah, and with her and her husband being in such good jobs, did your husband never wonder why she was struggling to raise £40k? They should have access to that amount of credit with relative ease. The fact that she couldn’t raise the money is exactly the problem; it means they are skint, in debt and living beyond their means so will never be able to pay you back. Have you proof that the house she is trying to sell isn’t mortgaged up to the hilt already?

Are you sure she hasn't paid it back to your DH & he's not telling you?

He said, about a month ago that because I haven’t seen them for a while, that I’ve become detached from them. (I swear we were never that close. 3 dinners all year type). They dropped off gifts to our kids at Xmas who are quite young. Their children are older adults and have left home.

DH thinks they have been kind and nice to us (free financial advice and gifts!) and I have no empathy and am selfish. Apparently this is how friends lend to friends to help them out. I did tell his brother which he didn’t want me to do. I said if it’s all above board, let’s keep it transparent and tell your family see if they think you’re a mug. Told them January time and he’s been sleeping in spare room since then from the massive rows. He still has not told her we’re all (my family, his family, my kids included) think he’s a total nob for lending this money.

How can you even bear to look at him.

I am another one who thinks you aren't getting this money back. You both being invited to her 50th is a cover designed to be documented in photos, SM etc to show that you are great friends... Ahead of you then going nuclear when money isn't forthcoming, making it easier to block you/cut you off.

Have you actually seen her professional credentials? She must be registered, have an office and website etc. Have you seen any of this OP?

No, people do not take out £40k in a loan in order to give the money to a friend who apparently has a lot of their own money and great jobs and lifestyle.

You are in debt to fund their lifestyle, because they couldn’t raise the money themselves on their jobs or properties… which means they have maxed out all loan options, which means you won’t get the money back because they don’t have it.

He's been groomed and played. Deep down he knows it but is lashing out at you because he can't admit it.

Con mum is definitely right. He threw his partner under the bus as well when she tried to point it out to him.

Time to go around him. You can't trust him anymore.

@SpaceMoo you've had loads of advice, what are you going to do?

Do you have signed documentation about the loan with an agreed timeline for repayment? Is it based around the sale or a date? If not, then you're in a difficult position and she knows this as a financial advisor. She may have made a promise to repay to other "friends" as well - so be prepared to be in a queue! Check the online paperwork for small claims court on the .gov website. TBH she seems to have a hold over your DH which is also deeply unfair, or he's naive. Speak to a solicitor about your options.

I loaned CF BIL a similar sum and waited nearly 2 years for his house sale before he could repay me - and all the other family and friends he owed money to. DH and I are NC with him due to the stress of dealing with him and his Walter Mitty attitude to life. He lives a champagne lifestyle on fanta money!

So your DH was playing billy big bollocks with money that wasnt even "spare" money (as in savings) but money from a loan, which has to be repaid.

And now he gets pissy with you for being angry (rightfully) and is so blind he cant see he has been played by them.

Divorce him OP, i guarantee it will happen again should he get anymore spare money. If they do pay him back what are his plans for the money? Go round the town handing out notes to anyone who crosses his path like King bountiful?

😱
This is insane !!!!
Praying its an April Fools

If she does start to pay you back, keep careful note, this could be an email or similar to her:

Thanks for the £150 Deirdre, only £39,850 to go

She sounds like the sort of person who will think nothing of short changing you. Your DH is a limp, wet, lettuce leaf. Don't be the same.

Also, don't be surprised if she tries to convert the loan into an 'investment'. Warn your DH that she may attempt this. All he needs to do is reply:

No thank you, I need the cash back now

He may need to say this several times.

At the moment she is trying to keep you sweet. Don't expect that to continue if she realises you mean business.

Thank you to everyone. Even the ones calling me a fool! I’ve taken screenshots of some of the best advice and things I can do, and say to DH to jolt him out of this. I wish he would see it. That’s been one of my biggest frustrations.

Do it. Fuck the friendship.

Your marriage is about to end over this. Get the big guns out.

Good luck op. I hope you get it back. Sadly I think there’s a strong chance you won’t but just take it carefully and logically and you will optimise your chances. Don’t be tempted to use any nuclear options as they will more likely flip her into saying “ you can’t make me.”

This is a good suggestion. you need to know what avenues you have.

have you requested the money by text/email? have you suggested to her that you are wanting the loan repaid? if you can engage her in something in writing you can then take her to court.

You have both been ridiculously naive in this, and there is probably a less than thin chance you will ever see that money again.

Trying to protect this friendship is daft, the friendship is over. you need to face up to this now. Once you realise this, you know you will be able to make the next move if indeed there is a next move.

OP if you end up divorcing, the £40k should be deducted from his share of the marital assets and he should also take on the debts that would be paid off by now if it weren't for his stupidity.

Did you miss this line:

I am so furious at DH and never agreed to lending them money in the first place

Out of interest why isn’t the son paying you back? What is stopping him?

This is more about the singular act of the bank transfer though.OP has helped create the current situation by ongoing lack of intervention/challenge. If she said no and he just went ahead what action was immediately taken? Doesn’t sound like much was done if OP is still considering whether to attend a party, whether to send a message etc.

I think this is a good idea. Problem is that if you go for a divorce you will probably never see your share of the money. I would write her an email (so it can be tracked) saying exactly what you’ve just said, making sure you state the amount they owe etc, and keep everything for future use. Then if and when u divorce you have the proof. Definitely no present for the birthday though! For the time being pretend all is ok, then ask for the money. Ridiculous. Fake awful people . Good luck. Once you’re split find yourself some real nice down to earth people to be friends with x