Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

BE - dog and newborn guilt

313 replies

Cat921 · 18/03/2025 19:29

Three weeks ago we had our reactive 14 year old Jack Russell put to sleep because of his strange behaviour around our newborn baby and I feel so guilty.

Our dog was our whole life. We loved him dearly! My husband had him before we met since he was a puppy so for 14 years and I had him for 9 years. He was very reactive and we changed our whole life since I have known my husband for him. He was very territorial of the home and we couldn’t invite people over so we would have to put him upstairs away from visitors. He had previously bitten two people who entered the house quite a few years previously.
He accepted my mum eventually after she give him treats but had to be introduced with a muzzle. On walks we kept him close to use as he did not like other dogs or people and we were unsure if he would bite out of anxiety. He was an anxious dog who hated baths, blowing out candles, and sneezes. He would need to be on a lead in the garden as he hated the dog next door and would bark at him incessantly through the fence and we also were worried about him getting out and potentially biting someone out of fear. He hated when parcels would be dropped off and we would have to fight to get to the door. He had three people in his life he was fine with and who he loved. He hated the car and we could not take him anywhere or to public places as he would get so anxious.

When we first returned home, for the first three days we were surprised as our dog was fine with our newborn and we introduced them from a distance and let him smell her blanket and baby grow. I bought extra treats and toys for him. I naively thought he would be fine but my husband had had prior reservations before we brought her home. We were hoping he would sense my pregnancy as he would always sit on my knee for cuddles. After a few days, he barked at my baby in her Moses basket and my husband grew unsure of his intentions. He started becoming stressed when she cried as if he realised that she was suddenly here and would hide under the table and started weeing in the house. We never sanctioned him for this. He then started taking an interest in the Moses basket in the living room and was obsessed with jumping up at it even when she wasn’t crying. He wasn’t necessarily bothered about her when I was holding her on the sofa. We contacted a dogs trust behaviourist for advice. We couldn’t have a behaviourist come to the house as he does not accept visitors. He then continued to bark when she cried and we recorded my babies cried and used a doll (suggested by dogs trust) to positively reinforce him leaving it alone with treats but this did not work. He then started jumping up at me on the sofa when holding my baby with his tail down and we recorded this and sent to dogs trust who said it was potentially concerning behaviour. Our dog slept in our bed with us his whole life and our baby had her next to me crib in there and I felt uneasy about him accessing it if I was asleep at night as it was on his level. He never bothered it the previous nights but I ended up sleeping downstairs with her the few nights after that which was hard with a newborn. We had to put his muzzle on to calm him in the house as he would not leave the Moses basket alone.

We were able to manage all of this behaviour previous to my daughter being born as he was the most loving dog with us and never bit us or showed any aggression to me and my husband. We loved him so much but this was hard to manage with a newborn. I think I know ultimately it was the right decision but feel bad as he looked to me to protect him and would always come to me when scared! The guilt is awful! It was such a stressful situation and hormones were everywhere and feel we should have gave him longer than a week to adjust but me and my partner just were unsure of his behaviour and couldn’t read him and weren’t sure if we could take that chance with our newborn. We were worried this anxiety would manifest itself into aggression. We could not rehome him as he would not do well in that situation and could be a potential risk to strangers. We also read that dogs don’t see babies as human and as potentially an animal and prey which scared us. We are heartbroken that we had to make this decision. Anyone had a similar situation and how do I deal with this guilt?

OP posts:
MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 20:37

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 20:33

Well then she has to accept then that if she chose to have a child and planned this knowing full well then she planned the dog's death. Not hard to understand. She knew what would happen and carried on regardless.

Knowing the dog was 14 meant that it would not have had much longer left anyway but she couldn't wait as her wants came over the dog's right to life.

She had fertility problems, so no, she couldn't wait.

I suppose you think her child should not have been allowed to exist so that her dog could have another three years.

Like it or not, most of society agrees that people's lives are more important than animals' lives.

That means that if your dog bites people there is a high likelihood that it will be PTS, but if your child or your husband murders somebody, they won't be.

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 20:39

prettyneededchill · 20/03/2025 08:24

Oh dear child. You really think everyone can just “decide” to have a child, and that happens for them?

Nope! Oh dear child!

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 20:42

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 20:37

She had fertility problems, so no, she couldn't wait.

I suppose you think her child should not have been allowed to exist so that her dog could have another three years.

Like it or not, most of society agrees that people's lives are more important than animals' lives.

That means that if your dog bites people there is a high likelihood that it will be PTS, but if your child or your husband murders somebody, they won't be.

Edited

So she would've had them down the line too. It wasn't going away.

Nope - why are you fabricating things now for no reason - why is that? What do you hope to gain by making such ludicrous statements?

You are allowed to disagree with me, that is ok. Pretending I think something that is not true because you are pissed that I think something different to you is showing your immaturity in debate.

I do not like putting a dog down to meet someone's desires. In the same way that you have to like it or not that I disagree with you. That is what debating is about. Seems you feel unable to do that.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 21:33

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 20:42

So she would've had them down the line too. It wasn't going away.

Nope - why are you fabricating things now for no reason - why is that? What do you hope to gain by making such ludicrous statements?

You are allowed to disagree with me, that is ok. Pretending I think something that is not true because you are pissed that I think something different to you is showing your immaturity in debate.

I do not like putting a dog down to meet someone's desires. In the same way that you have to like it or not that I disagree with you. That is what debating is about. Seems you feel unable to do that.

Edited

Good lord.

Do you really understand so little about fertility?

All women of childbearing are on a one way trip towards the menopause. Whether you have fertility problems or not, the longer you leave it, the harder it gets. Eventually you can't have babies anymore.

If you're already having fertility problems, or have a reason to think you might have them, or are in your mid thirties or older and you want children, you need to crack on. You can't fuck around for five years waiting for your antisocial dog to die of natural causes.

Jeez.

Poppyseeds79 · 20/03/2025 21:44

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 20:42

So she would've had them down the line too. It wasn't going away.

Nope - why are you fabricating things now for no reason - why is that? What do you hope to gain by making such ludicrous statements?

You are allowed to disagree with me, that is ok. Pretending I think something that is not true because you are pissed that I think something different to you is showing your immaturity in debate.

I do not like putting a dog down to meet someone's desires. In the same way that you have to like it or not that I disagree with you. That is what debating is about. Seems you feel unable to do that.

Edited

I had to get my Ddog PTS due to her having a stroke and a genuine likelihood she would have attacked my other Ddog. Absolutely heartbreaking but I had to choose to put the welfare of one above the other.

It's nothing to do with desires, nobody skips off to the vets looking forward to their pet being pts. But you do sometimes have to make tough choices because that's part of being a responsible owner. OP didn't dump her dog at a rescue where it would have been terrified and miserable. Instead he had a peaceful end to his life.

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 21:52

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 21:33

Good lord.

Do you really understand so little about fertility?

All women of childbearing are on a one way trip towards the menopause. Whether you have fertility problems or not, the longer you leave it, the harder it gets. Eventually you can't have babies anymore.

If you're already having fertility problems, or have a reason to think you might have them, or are in your mid thirties or older and you want children, you need to crack on. You can't fuck around for five years waiting for your antisocial dog to die of natural causes.

Jeez.

I know that the cliff edge of 35 is a myth. Seems you know so little about that. The source of that info was church records in the 1700s when people died mid 30s hence the sudden halt in live births! new research shows little decline. This person had a fertility issue so whatever age it would've been an issue.

I also know that trying for a child when you have a dog that will need putting down is irresponsible ownership and selfish.

Ahh so you accept that killing a dog because it interferes with your wants is ok. By all means declare that. I do not agree. I think it is awful and I have a right to think that as you also have a right to agree that killing a healthy dog is acceptable to meet your wants in life.

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 21:54

Poppyseeds79 · 20/03/2025 21:44

I had to get my Ddog PTS due to her having a stroke and a genuine likelihood she would have attacked my other Ddog. Absolutely heartbreaking but I had to choose to put the welfare of one above the other.

It's nothing to do with desires, nobody skips off to the vets looking forward to their pet being pts. But you do sometimes have to make tough choices because that's part of being a responsible owner. OP didn't dump her dog at a rescue where it would have been terrified and miserable. Instead he had a peaceful end to his life.

That is a different situation and not even a comparison. You didn't choose to get a new dog when your older dog was being aggressive and then say ah I'll just put this one down as the newer one is more important to me instead of waiting to get a new one.

This was about the woman's desire for a child which trumps the dog's right to live. Simple. She thought her desire was more important. The dog's life was less important than her desires.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 22:17

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 21:52

I know that the cliff edge of 35 is a myth. Seems you know so little about that. The source of that info was church records in the 1700s when people died mid 30s hence the sudden halt in live births! new research shows little decline. This person had a fertility issue so whatever age it would've been an issue.

I also know that trying for a child when you have a dog that will need putting down is irresponsible ownership and selfish.

Ahh so you accept that killing a dog because it interferes with your wants is ok. By all means declare that. I do not agree. I think it is awful and I have a right to think that as you also have a right to agree that killing a healthy dog is acceptable to meet your wants in life.

I never mentioned a cliff edge at 35.

I said that women get less fertile with time and eventually are no longer fertile at all. If you want children it's not wise to gamble what might be your last remaining childbearing years on your dog's natural life span.

What was she supposed to do, at the age of 25? Not get together with a man who had a young and aggressive dog because it might still be alive ten years later when she needed to get on with trying for a baby?

This is a dog that bit multiple people. Dogs are PTS for biting people even when they don't have to share their home with a tiny, vulnerable newborn.

StumbleInTheDebris · 20/03/2025 22:24

So she would've had them down the line too. It wasn't going away.

How on earth could you guarantee this?
What a weird thing to start making up.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 22:46

StumbleInTheDebris · 20/03/2025 22:24

So she would've had them down the line too. It wasn't going away.

How on earth could you guarantee this?
What a weird thing to start making up.

It's just a bit of a bonkers argument, isn't it?

Yes, if you have fertility problems and you wait another 5 years to TTC, you will still have fertility problems.

They will most likely be worse, in fact, because your ovaries will be five years closer to the end of their working life.

For that matter, if you don't have fertility problems and you wait another five years to TTC, you might find you do have fertility problems by the time you get round to it.

Do you think this poster has forgotten that she was suggesting the OP should wait until the dog died of natural causes before TTC, or does she think "if you have fertility problems now you will still have them later" is a compelling argument for waiting?

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 22:57

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 22:17

I never mentioned a cliff edge at 35.

I said that women get less fertile with time and eventually are no longer fertile at all. If you want children it's not wise to gamble what might be your last remaining childbearing years on your dog's natural life span.

What was she supposed to do, at the age of 25? Not get together with a man who had a young and aggressive dog because it might still be alive ten years later when she needed to get on with trying for a baby?

This is a dog that bit multiple people. Dogs are PTS for biting people even when they don't have to share their home with a tiny, vulnerable newborn.

You mentioned mid 30s! Well you are wrong, it doesn't wane like that.

She can do what she likes and she did. I'm not saying she can't - why do you think that? She tried for a baby knowing the dog would have to die. That is her choice. She made that choice knowing the outcome.

She can do that, no one is saying she cannot. Why are you pretending I am saying so?

The dog didn't have to share with a newborn. She made that choice to make the dog share with a newborn.

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 22:59

StumbleInTheDebris · 20/03/2025 22:24

So she would've had them down the line too. It wasn't going away.

How on earth could you guarantee this?
What a weird thing to start making up.

If she had fertility issues then they would still have been there further down the line.
Do fertility issues just go away? Well I never?! Just like that?!

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:00

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 22:46

It's just a bit of a bonkers argument, isn't it?

Yes, if you have fertility problems and you wait another 5 years to TTC, you will still have fertility problems.

They will most likely be worse, in fact, because your ovaries will be five years closer to the end of their working life.

For that matter, if you don't have fertility problems and you wait another five years to TTC, you might find you do have fertility problems by the time you get round to it.

Do you think this poster has forgotten that she was suggesting the OP should wait until the dog died of natural causes before TTC, or does she think "if you have fertility problems now you will still have them later" is a compelling argument for waiting?

How is a bonkers, you just agreed with me that the issues would still be there!

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:01

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 22:59

If she had fertility issues then they would still have been there further down the line.
Do fertility issues just go away? Well I never?! Just like that?!

No, they get worse. Which is why you can't hang around waiting for your dog to die.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:02

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:00

How is a bonkers, you just agreed with me that the issues would still be there!

So why do you think this is a good argument for waiting?

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:03

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:01

No, they get worse. Which is why you can't hang around waiting for your dog to die.

You just said how can I be sure they wouldn't go away? You were suggesting they would go away by criticising me for saying they would still be there.

So just kill it then! As she did. She had a choice. Nothing stopping her.

Jobs a good un!

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:04

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 22:57

You mentioned mid 30s! Well you are wrong, it doesn't wane like that.

She can do what she likes and she did. I'm not saying she can't - why do you think that? She tried for a baby knowing the dog would have to die. That is her choice. She made that choice knowing the outcome.

She can do that, no one is saying she cannot. Why are you pretending I am saying so?

The dog didn't have to share with a newborn. She made that choice to make the dog share with a newborn.

She made the same choice most people make, which is to have a child.

Do you think that people who think they might want a child some day should not get pets, and not get together with anyone who has a pet, just on the off chance?

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:05

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:03

You just said how can I be sure they wouldn't go away? You were suggesting they would go away by criticising me for saying they would still be there.

So just kill it then! As she did. She had a choice. Nothing stopping her.

Jobs a good un!

Are you OK?

Pickingmyselfup · 20/03/2025 23:07

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:04

She made the same choice most people make, which is to have a child.

Do you think that people who think they might want a child some day should not get pets, and not get together with anyone who has a pet, just on the off chance?

Some people do. I had a breeder refuse me a kitten because I would at some point be planning children.

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:07

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:02

So why do you think this is a good argument for waiting?

Can you answer why it is bonkers to agree with me?

The reason to wait is that some think it is not ok to put a healthy dog down because your wants are more important than their life.

She can choose whatever she wants. But she is asking yes or no so people are entitled to answer both ways to her - is that the case or not?

Why is it wrong that someone disagrees with her choice? Should we all be forced to agree and nod because ppl on here cannot debate?

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:08

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:05

Are you OK?

Yeah grand thanks, how are you?

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:08

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:04

She made the same choice most people make, which is to have a child.

Do you think that people who think they might want a child some day should not get pets, and not get together with anyone who has a pet, just on the off chance?

Nope I do not think that.

Do you think we should all agree with everyone just because?

user1492809438 · 20/03/2025 23:09

You are brave and lovely dog owners and parents. You can look back with joy at the lovely companion your dog was, rather than his memory being tainted by worry about what harm he might have done to your baby. I speak as a parent and besotted dog owner [only four legged golden children in this house!]. Enjoy your time as parents.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:12

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:07

Can you answer why it is bonkers to agree with me?

The reason to wait is that some think it is not ok to put a healthy dog down because your wants are more important than their life.

She can choose whatever she wants. But she is asking yes or no so people are entitled to answer both ways to her - is that the case or not?

Why is it wrong that someone disagrees with her choice? Should we all be forced to agree and nod because ppl on here cannot debate?

I don't agree with you about anything.

I don't understand your point about her still having fertility problems later. That's an argument for not waiting.

And yes, I think her child's right to exist and her chance to be a mother are more important than what sounds like a very distressed dog living for another three years.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 20/03/2025 23:13

whippy1981 · 20/03/2025 23:08

Yeah grand thanks, how are you?

You don't sound OK.