Council housing priority - council advising to wait until Ballifs turn up

[Blueotter22]

Hi All,

Im posting here for traffic really to see if anyone else has experienced this or has been able to challenge it. I’m at a loss on how I can support my Mum with this.

My mum has advanced Alzheimer’s (early onset) and is cared for 24/7 by my SIL & Brother. My angel SIL quit her job (as a care home worker) to care for my Mam full time, she does everything for her (personal care, feeding, medication, appointments etc). My SIL & Brother have rented a house from SIL’s brother for a number of years, rent is reasonable and they’ve managed just about but now her brother is moving back home from overseas and would like his house back. SIL has her heart set on a council house because of their low income they will struggle with the private rent but also the area they live is typically flats to rent which wouldn’t be suitable for Mums mobility needs. They would also like the security that having a council house brings as they have a pet and want the stability of not having to move again.
Which is understandable, as they have no savings, wouldn’t really ever be in a position to buy and brother works a low paid job which is a struggle to provide for 3 adults.

Mum has been rejected for benefits due to a super complicated and I think unfair situation, she was basically living in America with her husband when she became unwell and was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s. We (& she) wanted her to come back to the UK but husband insisted they were staying in America as he worked there, he wasn’t aware of how Alzheimer’s disease progresses and sadly she deteriorated quite quickly during Covid and he couldn’t travel to bring her home. He admitted he could no longer care for her and brought her back to the UK and basically promised he would sell up in America and come back to help care for her, but yeah..he didn’t. He’s stayed there and now my Mum hasn’t been able to access any financial support because technically she’s been out of the country. The rules are the rules so it’s just something we’ve had to accept. My SIL therefore hasn’t even had any carers allowance or support.

So the issue is, the council are refusing to acknowledge that my Mum exists basically because she doesn’t have benefits. Despite turning up to the house unannounced and witnessing how unwell she is. The housing officer has told my SIL that they won’t be considered a priority until she is taken to court and ballifs attend the property.

SIL brother has served them a section 21 and said they have until X date to leave, but obviously he doesn’t want to take them to court or get the ballifs. It will cost so much! I just think it’s absolutely crazy that this is the actual advice given? Pay court fees, pay ballifs just to prove you need housing?
Also, they said they’ll likely find them temporary accommodation first before they are able to bid. I just don’t see how this is reasonable for a woman who is highly distressed a lot of the time anyway, can’t manage stairs, needs constant supervision and I’m just so overwhelmed trying to understand how I can help them.

I can’t believe this is actually a thing? Part of me was thinking my SIL might have got the wrong end of the stick but she is adamant that is the advice from the housing officer?! 😳

I am going to write to their MP and I’ve googled so much about this but has anyone experienced a similar situation and is there some kind of legislation or something I can use to write to the council?

Pip isn’t means tested and I’d be surprised if she didn’t qualify.

I don't really understand how a British citizen who lived abroad for 5 years is deemed to have no recourse to public funds.

If your relatives are evicted then in all honesty the best option for your mum is to take her to hospital and say she's homeless & needs nursing home care. They will have to admit (no safe place to discharge her to) and then get a nursing home placement paid for by the council. If family continue to care for her the council will do nothing.

You need to talk to Citizens Advice & Shelter.

How long has she been back in the uk?

I have suggested this to my brother and sister, however the pair of them are scared to upset the husband and he has been a stepfather to us since we were teenagers so there’s a lot of emotions and loyalty involved. There’s also our youngest half sibling who relies on me as her oldest sister and I play a sort of mother type role to her emotionally supporting her. So if the 3 of us go against him, it will cause a huge family upset and nobody wants to “rock the boat”. It’s really hard, made even more complicated that he is in America and my Mam is over here without capacity to consent for a divorce. Like I don’t even know where to start with which type of solicitor to speak to, and even then I would need my siblings to be a united front with me but their both just so conflict avoidant they’ll do anything for an easy life.

There are several issues here, none of which will be sorted by waiting years for a council house.

get legal advice on getting a divorce / claiming shared assets. You’ve asked nicely, didn’t work, so work out her legal rights

speak to citizens advice about rights over claiming benefits for your mum - that means your SIL will be able to claim carers allowance too, if she is getting under the threshold paid for caring for your mum.

i was in temporary accommodation before for years. You don’t get a choice over it and it can be unsuitable. They may also consider they have no obligation to house your mum if she’s seen as ineligible from a residency point of view. They will not offer more bedrooms than needed for the tenants so your DB/SIL could end up with only 1 bed and nowhere for your mum to stay. In short, shut this one down, your mum is not a passport to a rare council house.

Just over 2 years. He came over for Christmas 2022 and left her here, saying he would be back in 6 months once my sister had started college. He didn’t come back and now has a new job and no plans to leave America.

@Blueotter22 why doesnt she go for divorce then? she should at least get half the matrimonial home. is the husband you father???

Realistically, unless you're in one of those very few areas where there is plenty of council housing you're looking at something along the lines of:
Wait until the bailiffs come
Be evicted
Be put in "temporary" housing. This almost certainly won't accept pets, so the dog will have to be put in kennels. It may be out of area and may be pretty unpleasant.
Then bid for council properties. They will be told what they can bid on, and cannot go for anything else. It's likely to be (assuming they are still with your dm, 2 bed, and as you say she has mobility needs may need to be ground floor flat)
This could take between 6 months and many years. Our area the absolute urgent ones who are top priority can still take 9 months to a year.

Surely your angel sil with much experience of Alzheimer's would be able to see that this is going to be hugely distressing for your mum? Far more than staying in the house she's used to and being cared for.
It does come across as she thinks this is her ticket to getting a council house, and not really thinking of your dm and how she will find the above situation.

They're scared to upset the man who is financially abusing their vulnerable mother?

You need to help them understand that far from this being the route to an easy life (or a council house), it's going to end in disaster. This will have to happen, the state isn't going to make it ok for them and hard conversations and hard decisions will have to happen. Sorry OP.

She doesn’t have capacity, she doesn’t even know who I am. She can’t even speak a full sentence. We would have to say she would benefit from a divorce, he will argue that’s not what she would have wanted or something. It would be up to us as her children to start that process and my siblings are not on board with it, so it would be me on my own instigating what they will see as a big family drama

Don’t want to rock the boat? He has abandoned her.

Are you are this isn’t about the family wanting to keep on his good side/not use the money she has so you get an inheritance?

Ok, then I think she can apply for pip. Or, rather, you can, on her behalf.

Get advice from citizens advice though. And they can help you again with a UC claim, which will be more complicated as she has assets elsewhere. She’ll need a sick note from the doctor to say she can’t work.

I don’t care about the inheritance, he has made it clear that all of their assets will go to our younger sister. That’s fine, though I’m sure that’s not what my Mam would have wanted because she has 4 children.
I think he thinks that me suggesting he sells his house or if we suggested a divorce is a way to take “his” money. So when I suggested selling the house he said he had been over paying the mortgage on his own for his retirement plan. I said yes but the house is half Mams, she told me she put down a large amount on the house. He was shocked because he didn’t know that Mam had told me that, that’s when he said it was ridiculous and hasn’t spoken to me since.

Your siblings are being selfish. They might think they are doing whats best for your mum but they are not doing.

They need to arm themselves with the facts and possibilities instead of sticking their heads in the clouds and banking on this amazing, pipedream council house.

You need to take charge. If I was you I'd contact social services and ask for advice on what kind of solicitor I would need for proper legal advice in this situation first thing on Monday.

you need legal advice and fast

she needs to divorce him asap and you all need to stop being nice and worried about upsetting people
are you ever actually going to back to the states?

once your mother passes, the money will be gone. Would she really have wanted that? or actually had kids that stood up for what would have been rightly passed down 4x ways. Not one.

I think also from her husbands perspective - my Brother & SIL are very bad with money, when my Mam was well she bailed my brother out of debt on more than one occasion. I’ve recently found out they haven’t been paying their utility bills but have been spending money on unnecessary things, they’ve always been really bad at managing money. So I think her husband is worried about them having her finances, and to be honest I would be a little worried too as there’s a lot of concerns there about historical debts etc. So it’s all a big mess really, on both sides it’s a mess but I’m in the middle just trying to do best for my Mam. If I could take her and care for her myself then I would but honestly, I just can’t. I provide respite but then I spend a week afterwards emotionally battered and crying, I’m just a bit selfish really. My SIL is honestly amazing with her, she has such a natural way of providing care where as I’m just too emotional and find it exhausting.

There are 2 situations here.

1. is your brother and sister in law, who will shortly be ' homeless ' once your other brother pays out for court and bailiffs too . However does the Council have a legal duty to house these 2 people - when they are both able bodied and capable of working and paying for a private rental. They may be offered emergency temporary accommodation. Their housing officer will try very hard to find them a private rental and the Council may pay the deposit and first month's rent to ensure they get this private rental. they may be allowed to join the waiting list for Social housing but they will not be a priority - that is for families with dependent children.
2. you will probably find the Council has no legal duty to ' house ' your Mother as she has chosen to live elsewhere for many years AND she has assets of $350,000 + in the USA. Your Mother needs to divorce her husband and gain her 50% of assets i.e. house / his pension / savings etc. Where is your Mother's pension ? or did she not work whilst in USA. What private pension/s has she here in this Country ? tho she won't be able to receive them until 60 ? so 3 years to wait. How long has she actually been back in this country as you say her husband couldn't bring her back during Covid which was 2020 i.e. 5 years ago, just when did he bring her back.

How much is her husband paying your sil to care for her?

btw your brother and sister in law will be notified by the Court the date and time of the bailiff's visit. The dog will need to go to an animal rescue the day before as the Council does not have a duty to rehome the dog nor to provide anywhere for it.

They need to privately rent and save for a deposit and first month's rent which should be doable given their reduced rent.

I have no idea why they're relying on the council.

I believe about 1k per month or there abouts. He knows if she goes to a care home he would have to pay her fees. He also gives them a portion per month towards rent/bills.

Quite frankly that's not so bad at all...

I would suggest contacting adult social care for an assessment of your mother's social care needs and assessment of your SIL's needs as a carer, particularly as both of them are likely to be imminently homeless. Due to your mother having assets abroad which are not being made available to her and her lack of capacity to pursue them, you very likely need legal advice. It may be that someone needs to apply for guardianship for her. Ultimately if her money is being withheld by her husband, that may be financial abuse. Adult social care should be able to help and signpost through this process.

@Blueotter22 has your mum been referred to or had a social worker assessment? I think people, when they talk about her needing to get a divorce ,are missing the point that she has lost the capacity to deal with her own affairs. Someone with no capacity can’t divorce anybody! Has the GP not suggested any other involvement? She’s been here since 2022 so I’m very surprised that she doesn’t meet the residency test ,however obviously there’s a big question mark over her US/ marital assets and how she can access these. If she’s not been referred for a SW assessment then I think this is crucial to do asap..ultimately this situation may be heading for the Court of Protection.

You need to contact a divorce lawyer in the US state where her husband lives and enquire how/whether it is possible for someone with dementia to file for divorce.

• You need to be succinct and brief in your enquiry, i.e. focus on the bare facts rather than trying to describe the entire situation, which is very complex and likely to put lawyers off.
• If a divorce is not possible, what else can they suggest, e.g. putting a lien on the property.

NB: Does your mother have a valid US will? What is likely to happen to her share of the marital property if she were to predecease her husband? Which seems likely, given her state of health.