To ask for advice on how to minimise your chances of becoming a victim of bullying ?

[MarioJumbo]

Some time ago I had a convo with a friend on the subject of bullying.

He had always lacked confidence and had been a victim of bullying at school and apparently had never fitted in. I never went to his school so don’t know this first hand just took his word for it. At the time he was 26, lived with his parents and desperate for friends and company. He also had no experience sexually or romantically aged 26 in relationships so was very conscious of this - he presented as a lonely man and his conversations reflected that.

We were discussing one day what would make someone more prone to being a victim of bullying generally and I said is it someone with no friends?

He said “not exactly someone with no friends”. He went on to say “someone who is unsure”.

I was a bit surprised by this - given his seeming desperation to make friends and meet people all the time I thought he’d see a ‘friendless’ state or being a loner as undesirable.

However, I actually agree with him because at times in the past when I’ve been a bit of a ‘loner’ but had more inner confidence, I’ve actually been more popular with people whereas when I’ve been clinging to the edge of groups and with no friends I’ve been less popular. Any thoughts?

My advice to family,friends, colleagues and students is to call ppl out. As an adult practicing this is important. Sometimes it's just a case of saying, you don't agree forcefully, or saying hang on what did you just say who do you think your talking to.
As a child it is more difficult I suppose, as the bullies might not be embarrassed 😕

How have your old school bullies fared in life?

Anyone can be prone to bullying to be fair, although I’d say those who lack social prowess and the ability to at least appear confident on the outside are more likely to be vulnerable in my opinion. Anyone who has communication and social difficulties are particularly vulnerable unfortunately.

I'm saddened to read how many of us are still scarred by the actions of bullies, even if it happened years/ decades ago. I had to see one of my bullies the other day, who I have avoided for years and although I 'tactically' knew how to handle him, the whole experience has shook me. I haven't been able to sleep since, my anxiety levels are sky high and my nervous system is trapped in fight or flight mode. I feel physically sick with nerves. The damage they inflict is limitless.

If your boundaries have been invaded growing up they become more flaccid and you don’t have such an intact sense of self, have trouble saying no etc. it sets you up for bullying later in life. The key is to strengthen and know your own boundaries, leading to a more intact sense of self of self

those who bully others can sense the above and target them

Gosh so true I had no sense of self as I’d been called thinks like ‘spoilt’ and ‘ruined’ when my mother was drunk. I was only 4!

Yes I read your updates. I’m so sorry. This is how it’s set up in childhood. Your sense of self is developing as a child so the dynamic you explain affects your developing personal boundaries between you and others, and you can develop flaccid boundaries that others can invade, instead of strong clear healthy boundaries. Flaccid boundaries are where you don’t know where you begin and others end. All so sad. I’ve been there too

are you doing ok now?

Ah yes fine now thanks

^this should be the main focus absolutely- accountability for actions and behaviours is essential. However I do also think many people bully because they're not in a good place themselves - hurt people can hurt people- so they also may not be in a place to care about consequences or what others think of them.

I think the key thing is encouraging all children to stand up for what is right from the get go and giving them the skills to be able to do that safely. But also self esteem and resilience are so key. I remember a few people in school trying to bully me but I didn't actually care what they thought of me - so their insults and put downs held no weight because I genuinely didn't care, my mindset really was that if you were willing to treat me in that way then you weren't worth my time. I had really clear goals for what I wanted to get out of school and noone was going to hold me back from that. I think reading lots of books about real people who had overcome awful situations also helped me to think well if they can do x I can deal with y. Lots of young people now don't have any role models.

It's hard to shake, isn't it? I doubt any of them ever think about me, but I'm stuck still giving it head space after all these years. In some ways that's the worst part.

I’m exactly the same if it’s any consolation ❤️

Anyone can become a victim of bullying. I don't think there is a particular 'type of victim'.

My child stood up for himself by giving one of his bullies a kicking.
The school issued my child with a exclusion
The bullies who make my child's life a misery in class & out of class get a talking to
How is that fair?
Why is the constant psychological abuse not treated the same as the physical?

Totally agree - this sucks

I've always been a bit of a loner, I was bullied at school because I was the kid with holes in her shoes and head lice.
As I moved into teens I started to accept that there was no point in trying to make friends with my peers. I'd take my self of to the library at lunch times and they got bored and left me alone.
As an older teen and in my twenties.. I met my tribe! Met friends that I will have for life, was still a vulnerable young woman though and seemed to attract men who liked to exploit that. Therapy helped to fix this.
At work.. Still don't really fit in and I wouldn't go to a work Christmas party for example, I automatically go back to the school girl who sits on her own. The thing is I do actually try now to mix in to these groups but it doesn't work, I have no clue why (I don’t have head lice or hole in my shoes anymore)
It's not something that bothers me to much anymore though.

Because the bully and their parents twisted this around and made out your son to be the bully and he the victim. A lot of bullying is insidious, and other people think the true bully is great and won't accept what they are really like .

As extremely abhorrent as it is I think having poor body posture might contribute, not having confident body language ie head up, shoulders back, chin up. Shy closed body language won’t help. Being unable to defend one’s self verbally in a banter exchange won’t help. Important to have quick, snappy come backs. Being too tolerate of people being cheeky won’t help. Looking unhappy and timid won’t help. And as you say, going to senior management and basically just not standing for it is important. It’s a jungle. It’s so wrong. Bully’s should be stopped immediately and anyone who laughs along with a bully is totally complicit.

I agree that bullies often mistake quietness in a person for a lack of self esteem, and therefore an easy target for bullying.

I've always been a quiet person, I was bullied at school but as soon as I left I blossomed and became a lot more confident. But I’m still by nature a quiet person. A few people have attempted to bully me as an adult, thinking I would be an easy victim, and got the shock of their lives when I pushed back and made it clear in no uncertain terms that I wouldn’t tolerate their bullshit.

They always left me alone after that, yet clearly HATED me forever more, and more often than not would try to make out that they were the victim. It’s like these people were angry that they had me picked out as an easy victim and when they were proven wrong, their little brains couldn’t comprehend it and had the equivalent of a toddler tantrum but in a grown adult. It’s very bizarre.

I agree. It's well documented.

Could we just see things for what they really are? Normalising oppressive behaviour whilst placing the onus on individuals to avoid oppression is asking the wrong question. Bullying might be a regrettable innate tendency in some humans, but it is also antisocial behaviour. Being victimised for any characteristic is not acceptable.

I dont think anyone is normalising oppressive behaviour or saying that its acceptable to be bullied for a characteristic. but discussing the strategies they employed to avoid it. The onus is on the victim in how they handle it and avoid it.

I dont think we can ever stop bullying. But we do have to build self confidence and resilience in ourselves and teach our children it. There are many people on this thread who have said how they have carried that bullying around with them their whole lives. And mostly because they didnt know how to handle it / what to do.

Most of the advice is tell teacher/ignore/ be kind. Not helpful at all and just ruins self esteem even further.

And what is the right question?

I think it's lack of confidence being a but different and being an easy target.
I was bullied, not terribly. It was mild bullying and mocking. I think it's because I was quiet and shy, lacked confidence but also a bit dopey. People would take the piss but know that I was too timid to fight back.

When I was growing up this was called “tall poppy syndrome ” and it was your family and friends doing the bullying!!!

A child's first bully is their parent. If you were bullied its because one caregiver or another set up an abusive dynamic that you internalised.

I totally agree with this