To ask for advice on how to minimise your chances of becoming a victim of bullying ?

[MarioJumbo]

Some time ago I had a convo with a friend on the subject of bullying.

He had always lacked confidence and had been a victim of bullying at school and apparently had never fitted in. I never went to his school so don’t know this first hand just took his word for it. At the time he was 26, lived with his parents and desperate for friends and company. He also had no experience sexually or romantically aged 26 in relationships so was very conscious of this - he presented as a lonely man and his conversations reflected that.

We were discussing one day what would make someone more prone to being a victim of bullying generally and I said is it someone with no friends?

He said “not exactly someone with no friends”. He went on to say “someone who is unsure”.

I was a bit surprised by this - given his seeming desperation to make friends and meet people all the time I thought he’d see a ‘friendless’ state or being a loner as undesirable.

However, I actually agree with him because at times in the past when I’ve been a bit of a ‘loner’ but had more inner confidence, I’ve actually been more popular with people whereas when I’ve been clinging to the edge of groups and with no friends I’ve been less popular. Any thoughts?

I think being part of a "pack" helps.
I was badly bullied at Primary when my "pack" started doing things I didn't like so distanced myself, I then became the target.
At Secondary I was very much Queen Bee (sorry) and while I didn't ever get involved in bullying my group were all too close for anyone to be able to pick any of us off.
DD never found her tribe at Secondary and was bullied but DS has a very strong group and nobody has ever tried to target one of them because as a teacher once said to me "anyone who takes one of them on takes all of them on". they are a really nice group who have absorbed some boys who were isolated and teachers often encourage someone who is being bullied in their direction. There is one boy who was targetted quite a lot and while Ds isn't actually very keen on him he allows the boy to hang around on the edges of the group as it does apparently give him some protection.

I also think people see quietness in people as a weakness. When they get push back from the person who is quiet they get a shock .

Some people have never been told no and have been used to getting their own way so it comes as a shock when they are told no .

This is really true. My oldest gets bullied sometimes because she is smart, good at sports and quite popular. She will play with lots of different people, but sometimes gets abuse from the 'friends' she isn't playing with for 'rejecting them', sometimes it can get quite nasty. I have taught her never to be unkind first and never to start anything, but to always defend herself, and that if she gets into trouble for this then I will have her back.

Bullies are nearly always lacking in something, usually self confidence, or ability, and they try to cover this up/make themselves feel better by trying to make others feel worse. So I explain to her that what the bullies say to her is a reflection on themselves rather than a reflection on her, and she has learnt to fake a 'I don't give a f**k' attitude, that isn't how she feels as she takes everything to heart, but it does help I think.

My youngest genuinely has an 'I don't give a f**k" attitude, and she had never been bullied. The bullies want to gain something- power, a reaction, popularity. If they gain nothing they move on.

Yes. In school sadly I I was part of a very weak ‘pack’

True about quiet people pushing back

Yes they do want to gain something - agreed

In my experience assertiveness is key. Bullies like to test boundaries so the first time they say or do something mean you need to pull them up on it. If you let it go they get braver.

I was in a 'friendship' group where one of the dominant women liked to make sarcastic put downs. I didn't put her in her place and it escalated to several others joining in and became so unpleasant every time I saw them I left the group.

In hindsight I wished I had pulled her up on it but I was in a vulnerable bad place at the time. It really affected my self esteem for a long time.

I bumped into her several years later and she was all over me to meet up again. Perhaps the group had turned on her too? No thanks.

No that’s not true. It is possible to have a hierarchical society without bullying and for there to be dominant and less dominant participants. Bullying is something different and is unhealthy.

Some words of wisdom that someone said to me and it was a game changer . " If it wasn't you they were bullying it would be someone else." It's true . The problem lies with the bully . It's them with a problem not you .

People tried bullying DD at school, having two older brothers gave her s thick skin and she wouldn't let it bother. They tried getting physical with her but he elder brother saw and intervened .

She's still annoyed that he did as she says she could have handled it.

Basically you can't be bullied if you don't let yourself be bullied. Give these people no head space, ignore what they're saying.

Absolutely. When I come across a nasty person I always tell myself 'their behaviour says everything about them and nothing about me'. So if their actions don't cause me or my family actual harm I move on

Or ask them to repeat what they have said as you didn't understand . This takes the wind out of their sails. As they will have to repeat what they have said or explain themselves , and do it every time they make a mean remark.

I agree with him.

I had classmates who were bullied, but the outcomes for them were very different because they had the support of friends.

And I disagree with the posters who said victims do not attract bullies. They absolutely do. Bullies soon learn who they can get away with bullying.

Send-assurance helps to reduce the attention of bullies, and helps the person to recover from their attention.

I tend to agree that bullies will usually pick on someone they think will not fight back.

Among girls I have seen a kind of queen bee type who will low-level bully the girl at the bottom of the pile in her own group, or sometimes bully one or two in turn. The goal seems to be to keep them desperate to fit in, so the few girls on the bottom also bully each other to try and solidify their position.

I think not caring is probably the best remedy for girls, and maybe for adults too, but for boys it might be solidly pushing back at the beginning. Including physically.

I know, often people get crucified on here for suggesting their kid actually stands up for themselves.

Obviously that approach changes when you’re an adult but I wholeheartedly support a swift smack for any brat who picks on someone else.

Apologies about the random GIF. Definitely not intended!

Omg I so agree with everything here!

I told my Dad age 15 that I hated school because I needed to stand up for myself every day - he just said “well you’re with the wrong crowd then!”! That’s all he said - he didn’t help me at all when that was his cue to help me! I felt let down to be honest !

That’s ok I’ve gone this loads of times on Facebook !!

From experience absolutely!!

He might have been right though.

Yes he was right

Yes, boundaries, and showing it affects you - and there you also have the reason why so many autistic girls are bullied.

Being different from the majority is usually a trigger.
I still get a bit of rage if I see the 'don't react' advice getting rolled out, as in my experience nothing I did or didn't do made any difference. The bully says something horrible about me, his friend laughs, bully feels good and does it again. My reaction or lack of played fuck all part in the equation.
The one thing I did not do though was punch them. I hated any kind of rough physical contact, and was way too scared to get into a fight. From what I've read though it does seem to be the only way. Separation saved me in the end. All my worst bullies were boys, so I gave them the slip by going to an all girls high-school. Some of the girls there did have the odd crack at me, but it was so mild in comparison to what I'd been through before that it barely mattered.

Phew, rant over. Still so many unresolved issues, sigh

I agree with this too. Groups that indulge in bullying need to be avoided. Easy to say if you are reliant on them and unfortunately adult groups can still be like this.

In my case I regret not pushing back for my own self esteem. However, would I want to be friends with these people now? Absolutely not. Awful, petty insecure types that need swerving.

I think with maturity and self awareness you need to not allow yourself to be 'friends' with anyone that behaves unkindly to others. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me!

I think lack of confidence is a major one which you said your friend had/has.

Although I guess bullying can easily diminish someone's confidence, it certainly helps to have bundles of it to start with.

I do think fitting in helps to a certain extent though, I'll never forgive my parents for letting me start secondary school with a botched haircut and a hand me down ruck sack for my school bag!