Horrified at how many parents guarantee rental agreements without reading

[PinkDino33]

This might sound brutal but I am regularly horrified on Mumsnet when I read posts from parents desperately seeking advice because things have gone terribly wrong with the property their child has rented, and they are shocked to discover the full extent of what they and their child are liable for.

Their DS has just found out their flatmate hasn't paid a single month of rent in the 12 months they've lived there.. Does he really have to pay what the other boy owes?

The DD's flatmate is making life hell and her and all the other flatmates want to move out and stop paying... surely this is allowed?

The DS signed up to a house with his friends but now he wants to move back home.. Does he really have to honour this contract and pay the rent for a whole year?!

It's like parents don't really think of a tenancy agreement / guaranteeing a tenancy as being a real contract, and don't know anything about what they've signed.

Is it a joint tenancy agreement? "No idea"
Can you give notice or is it for a fixed period like 12 months? "Don't know"
"I'm going to have a proper read of the contract tonight.."

It's no good properly reading it 6 months after you've signed it!

People seem to think the contract / how it works with the Landlord must be based on fairness.. It's not fair that their child is financially liable because another tenant hasn't paid, so the landlord can't possibly have the right to try and get the money from him. It can't possibly be the case that they've guaranteed the full rent amount and not just their child's - because that would be madness!

Say it's a 6 person property on a 12 month joint agreement with each person paying £750pm.. that's a total rent of £54,000 that you are guaranteeing!!

I say this, not to shame parents but because if there was more awareness of what parents are actually signing this would cease to be the norm amongst estate agents and landlords. You've got tens of thousands of parents every year signing up to these things which no one in their right mind would sign if they actually read and understood the thing!

It's horrible when these things go wrong and you're living with someone who's a nightmare or doesn't pay, so I do sympathise. But if your child is signing up to a tenancy agreement (especially if its a joint agreement and you need to guarantee it!) ask questions, READ the contract, look up terms like 'joint tenancy' online, ask for proper legal advice if you don't understand anything.

The better option from a parent perspective may be to subsidize their child to get a single or at please a place with fewer people. It’s more expensive, hence less affordable for the student, but removes some of the risk. Fewer people means less chance of problems plus just a smaller total liability.

I already explained that. My dh signed it. He’s unable to help with this at the moment so I’ve taken it on and trying to figure it all out.
you think I’ve come here to take my situation out on you?
my god, my dd and her thee flatmates are scared shitless in their home, I made a post to gather information and support to help them with next steps. You then start up a post about how horrified you are that I’m a complete idiot. I wouldn’t thought your post was a good idea if you’d started a post like ‘so sorry to hear people are struggling with uni tenancies, what can be done’ but it was more ‘I am horrified that people are so stupid. Kick me while I’m down but yes I’m taking my situation out in you. Fair.

I was faced with this nonsense years ago, and am horrified that it’s still going on. I did refuse to accept the liability and DD had to forgo living with a crowd of mates and look elsewhere. She heard later that one of the parents had to pay over £1000 at the end of the lease, something to do with an outstanding electricity bill for the property.

Yes, this.

Can I ask a potentially stupid question? When my dd goes into a house share (currently yr 13 so it'll be next year) - I always thought as guarantor you were just guaranteeing THEIR rent would be paid? So if you have 4 students in a house, each set of parents acts as guarantor for their own child's rent and that it? Have I misunderstood? How would I be liable for all of it, as per some of the posts on here?

As a nation I am always surprised at how financially illiterate we are in all areas.
A lot of people have little idea of how much tax/NI/pension they will be paying, or how much interest they pay on their credit cards.
The worst one is women going on maternity leave with absolutely no idea of the payments they will receive.

Please don’t.
I like to think I am someone who reads everything carefully but there’s been a lot of helpful information on here. I have only had experience of university accommodation before now but ds will probably be in private rental at some point and I will definitely be more cautious now.

Thanks to everyone who has given good advice.

Because unless it’s a HMO they won’t have individual tenancy agreements, they’ll share one for the house. They’re all liable for the rent.

its like a joint mortgage - if mr and Mrs smith break up the bank don’t give a crap that mr smith ran off and won’t pay his half of the mortgage payment - they’ll go after 100% of the outstanding payments from either or both of them. Someone just has to pay it or they both suffer

“As a nation” 😂 what a bizarre thing to link to Britishness. It’s the same everywhere, and you maybe know more people who don’t understand these things

I didn’t have a guarantor, but for a shared student house had to sign a contract that made all tenants liable if someone didn’t pay. I definitely couldn’t afford to if that happened but it was either that or homelessness so obviously a lot of people are going to sign it regardless.

Oh I agree - my point is that the PPs suggestion is unworkable in the new world.

But the problem with the Renter’s Reform Bill is enforcement. If you need that property, and you’re willing to pay upfront to get it and your landlord is willing to accept that payment - the chances of any fine being enforced against the landlord are slim, even if the rules prevent it.

Totally agree - I wish they were called Tenancy Contracts rather than Agreements, so people would appreciate the legal gravity of them.

You would be guarantor for ALL of it, as your daughter is liable for ALL of it. They all are jointly and severally liable for the whole rent.

Say each of the four students rents a room for £500 per month for a combined household rent of £2000 per month.

If they have individual contracts, each student (and their guarantor) is liable for paying £500. If someone doesn't pay their £500 rent, it doesn't affect the others as they have only contractually agreed to pay their own £500. If someone leaves, that person is contractually obliged keep paying the £500 until they find someone to take over the contract.

If they have a joint contract, the four students (and their guarantors) are jointly liable for paying £2000 per month between them. If someone leaves, they should keep paying their share until a new tenant is found but if they don't, the joint responsibility to pay the £2000 total remains and the others have to make up the shortfall. The same happens if one of the students just doesn't pay their share of the rent. The guarantor is essentially signing that they, along with the other guarantors, guarantee that the total rent of £2000 will be paid which could potentially mean that just one of the guarantors ends up being responsible for all of it if noone else will pay.

In a joint and several tenancy the landlord can go after one or all of the other tenants and/or their gurantors. In practice they go after the one they feel they are most likely to get their money from which is often those still living at the property.

You do have an implied right od redress from the defaulting tenant but you would potentially have to take them to court which is time consuming and that is if they havn't gone awol.

This!! We had no choice. He could hardly live at home and commute over 100 miles a day, and as a uni lecturer I know these contracts are the norm now.

@SunnyDayInFeb I’ve done this on both sides. Paid a years rent up front for my student son to avoid acting as guarantor for all 8 tenants.
I am also a landlord, and my current tenants have paid a years rent in advance (they offered, I assume to avoid affordability checks). Previous tenant offered the same.

She said in one post that she has 10 years to go yet. I agree that she is pontificating without real world experience yet.

It's easy to set out how astute you are compared to the rest of us when you haven't yet been hit by the real world experience of your child being potentially homeless if you don't sign.

Understanding the contract and its implications is one thing. Having an array of choices about what to do if you don't like it (few of us do) is quite another. In most cases there is simply no choice because accommodation is in fairly short supply and virtually all contracts are the same.

Your child losing their chances of reasonable accommodation with their chosen friendship group is not a situation anyone really wants to end up in either, but hey, you "won" because you insisted on a committee meeting over the guarantor contract. A hollow victory indeed as someone else already mentioned.

This was such a sudden thing to be introduced. Eldest in York in mid 2010s didn’t ever have this guarantor scheme in any of his myriad of accommodation , but by time youngest in 2nd year it was standard. It wasn’t a thing with niece who’d been at uni 2 years before either, and certainly in my day and all my friends it was never a thing. Even though rental worked same way as termly amounts, based on acedemic year. And we still need per maintenance grants and parenteral top up to have enough to live.

What we did for DC (once our dropped jaws closed agian and we’d picked ourselves off floor having read the full contract 😱) was to talk direct to the agent. We said we’d pay THEIR rent only, up front, in full for whole year, but DC had to have separate agreement and not to be accountable for anyone’s else’s default in any circumstances. That was too much temptation for agent, and they agreed. Sure it was still a risk for us if dc decided they couldn’t live with their flatmates after one term , but we talked at huge length to them, explained once deal done there wasn’t a back out. We knew if DC became ill, for instance, we’d loose, but frankly if they were too ill to remain for year at uni , that’d be least of our concerns. Different agent accepted same deal the following year. DC went back into uni accommodation in MSC year where it wasn’t needed.

it worked fine. We also put a written “mini loan” in place for DC to pay us back their terms rent as each of his termly maintenance loan sums came through. We were paying his loan top up for all his other costs, so we were in essence advancing him his loan for 2nd and 3rd terms. Though I do seem to remember he never paid us back for third term, and we didn’t spot till a year later. He’s 27 now and still not paid back! 🤷‍♀️🤣

Unfortunately it's not just whilst they're students - we found the guarantor and references more onerous for DD's first flat after graduating than the student one had been. Each of the three sharers had to have a guarantor who earned over a certain sum.

I agree. We really need a public education campaign, preferably starting in school, re adult life financial matters, i.e. tax, pensions, savings, loans, contracts, leases, - the full monte really. Doesn't need to be in depth nor the detail, just overviews of how they work, the pitfalls to watch for etc.

Life was simpler back in the 60s and 70s as people were paid in cash, generally didn't have loans/HP/leases, most didn't have pensions, and a lot of the time, "savings" was money under the bed or in glass jars. The financial and legal world has moved on, but public education is still stuck 50 years ago.

Unfortunately under the Renters Rights Bill you won't be able to pay 6 months upfront. The people who have drafted it in an attempt to "protect" renters don't realise how much they are screwing over student and international student renters in particular.

It’s rather unfair to deem parents “financially illiterate” when most of us have little choice. You can only negotiate if you have any power in the relationship. If the landlord can just give the house to another group who don’t have stroppy parents they will just do that and your child loses out on the nicer house. Commercial reality trumps all sadly.

Exactly. I did read the contract, discussed with the other parents, tried to negotiate with the landlord who said “no”. It’s suck it up, or see your child lose their joint house.

Jeez, this is definately a scam. My two graduated 7 and 5 years ago. Even though this guarentorcthibg came in with youngest at uni (not a thing for eldest) neither got hit by it when they graduated. They had to do what has been done for decades- show proof form employer they were employed and what their salary was.
thats how it’s always worked. They’re adults. Sure, if someone hasn’t got a job you could maybe understand it,

this is now a big rip off for shared houses for youngsters and their parents - surely government needs to ban this. There is absolutely no need if these adults are employed, even as new grads