To think there should be minimum standards

[Obviouslynamechangedforthisagain]

For parents to keep their home?
Reading threads on here people admit to children being bathed once per week, wearing pjs for weeks on end, changing beds monthly etc.
Obviously not everyone lives in squalor but if there were minimum standards (ie 3 baths pw, bedding changed weekly) it could help an awful lot of neglected children that don't reach SS level of need.
Admittedly it would be almost impossible to police but if it could be done AIBU to think this could be a good idea?

Indeed, but there's people on here saying their kids only get washed once a week and their bedding isn't changed for a month or more. Those kids are dirty, sleeping in dirty bedding and will smell. No doubt about it. Not bad enough parenting to meet the definition of neglectful abuse, but really not meeting the minimum standards for "good parenting".

they should also know that weekly bedding change/every other day full body wash/clean clothes daily/hygienically clean and tidy home is also a standard that they should be aspiring to.

My kids sleep in their beds 3 sometimes 4 days a week - I don’t aspire to changing their beds weekly, there’s no need. They also shock sometimes wear the same clothes 2 days in a row even if they’re not spotless, I don’t aspire to change that either, for good reason. Your standards suit you, they don’t indicate universally ideal parenting standards no matter how much you think they do.

What if every other day full body wash damages the skin barrier for a child with psoriasis, would you advocate that regardless?

Exactly this. Mine are bathed twice a week and they genuinely do not appear dirty nor smell and their hair is clean and presentable. If that were not the case I would wash them more. For example if they fell over in mud and needed a wash. We also regularly wipe faces and clean bums, so actually they're fine. And bedding is usually once a fortnight because, similarly, they are clean kids and their beds do not smell and are aired regularly

Very obviously there may be specific different standards for specific children due to circumstances or medical needs.

Some children have ARFID so they can't eat 5 a day. Does that mean we shouldn't aspire for other children to? And we shouldn't have guidance and information about healthy eating - because a small number of children can't due to a medical condition?

Obviously "weekly bedding change" would be fortnightly if the bed was only slept in half the week. Surely you could work that out?

For me, I think we should have education and guidance like the 5 a day guidance surrounding good standards for personal and home hygiene. No home inspections or social worker visits, but government guidance and support and tools to get there. And in the same way as it's general knowledge in society that 5 a day is what we should aim for (specific circumstances excepted) it should be general knowledge that washing minimum 3 times a week and changing bedding weekly (specific circumstances excepted) is what we should aim for.

Oh goody it's the cleanliness brigade again.

I change the beds fortnightly. My children are very clean thank you.

Indeed, the cleanest family I know is also the one who gets ill the most. Their 6 year old doesn't have any disabilities or long term health conditions but has been to A&E, the doctors, hospital, etc more times than my 10 and 7 year olds have put together.

should be general knowledge that washing minimum 3 times a week and changing bedding weekly (specific circumstances excepted) is what we should aim for.

Is it though? Those are relatively modern standards of hygiene and not evidenced in any way to contribute to better health, unlike the 5 a day message. I’d rather not impose socially constructed standards on the private lives of families - evidencing neglect is reasonably straightforward for professionals experienced in such investigations and goes far beyond standards of bathing. I don’t think we need arbitrary standards.

And why bathing three times a week? Why not every third day? Or every other day? Or twice weekly? What’s magical about every third day? And why weekly bed changes for young children, why not once fortnightly? Or as and when needed if the child has soiled their bed? Or daily if we think fresh bedding is a parenting standard to be set?

As with all things we balance perfect with what’s practical, economic, and possible with all the other demands on our time. Your lifestyle choices shouldn’t determine whether mine are acceptable and certainly shouldn’t be the threshold for statutory intervention.

Yes some people need parenting support if they haven’t had a good experience of being parented - though such support is often refused and resisted. My sense is that most parents don’t really need another stick to beat themselves with.

OK so your update does make more sense. If this was something that was missing from your own childhood, and you experienced unhappiness and bullying as a result, then I can understand more about why you have focused on these as a measure of "good" parenting.

However, I still think that washing kids' bedsheets once a week is unnecessary! (Not to mention bad for the environment.)

I only wash my hair once a week, only bath once a week, don't change sheets every week and I don't smell. Maybe you're just a very smelly person OP?

Unless you're washing regularly (most days) in between your weekly baths, you will certainly smell. You probably won't be able to smell it on yourself, but others will - trust me.

I've met many smelly adults, and not a one of them was aware of their stench. Obviously they'd wash more if they realised they smelt.

Maybe this thread is about a chip on your shoulder OP but I can see what you’re getting at and why x

I couldn’t do this. I shower and wash my hair every day. It’s just what I like. We are all different

When I trained as a midwife / nurse it was drummed into us not to judge others on our own standards.
While you might have a shower daily for example, not everyone will and sometimes that is up to them.
Same with how people parent.

Yes, I said we are all different

How exactly would these standards be enforced? What would be the consequence if they were not maintained ? Fines (which the family could probably not pay?) Children removed - to where? There aren’t enough places for children who need state care as it is? There aren’t enough social workers as it is?

Anyway, I don’t suppose anyone has died from bathing once a week. It was the norm when I was a kid (with shared bath water).
Its very difficult to provide clean bed linen weekly if you are living in temporary accommodation/ have no washing machine/drying facilities/can’t afford hot water to hand wash or launderette more than once a month. Were we in such circumstances, I’d spray the sheets with antibac (79p in Home Bargains) and air well weekly, which would do the job.

I’d say increasing the living wage to a level where people could actually provide for and look after their families without recourse to top up benefits would be a far more effective solution, as would a government backed mass social housing scheme, so that people who could not afford private rental or a mortgage could live in clean, safe dignity, as our family did in the 60s and 70s.

Yes
My germaphobe friend's kids all have environmental allergies. I wonder why.

I suppose the ducking-stool would be reintroduced and you would get a cold bath in the village pond with the villagers looking on.

OP there's a massive difference between a parent who stops a child bathing when they want to bath, or refuses to let a child change their own sheets (or assists the child in changing them) if the child wants them changed and a parent who doesn't force a daily bath and weekly sheet change on their children. I'm really sorry for what happened to you - that wasn't ok.

When my kids were younger if I ever thought my kids were smelling, I made them have a bath, I just didn't force it more than once or twice a week and I didn't keep track (because in my head I would think 'oh they haven't had a bath in a while, must force it tonight'). I have teens now and one voluntarily showers every day and the other doesn't. The one that doesn't gets reminded to every day and I get more forceful it they skip more than one day, or if I am worried that their hair looks greasy etc. It's the same thing with things like deodorant - I don't want to be around smelly teens myself so I do now see it as my job to ensure they bath etc regularly! The only time I would stop them bathing would be if I thought they were getting excessive and it was more than once a day.

On the sheets, I personally like clean sheets more than once a month but I wouldn't blink an eye at someone not changing once a week. However if my teen wanted their sheets changed once a week, I would say 'sure' and point them towards the washing machine to sort it themselves! I wouldn't refuse it. I might if they wanted to change daily, or I might say only fortnightly if I couldn't afford the costs of weekly washing, but that would be a discussion.

This sums up perfectly what I was trying to say.
I think a lot of people have jumped on me because of the bedding thing, in isolation it isn't a huge deal if it gets changed every other week but with minimal washing etc it adds up to a bigger picture.

I'm sorry but an adult having a bath or shower only once a week is dirty and they will smell. No, they won't be able to smell themselves and friends probably won't admit it if you asked them. But they will smell.

You are more likely to smell after passively sitting in a bath or standing in a shower with water raining down on you than if you actively wash yourself at a sink.

5 a day really isn't a good example to give for this 😂

Isn't it?

I thought it was a general minimum standard for those generally not aware of or interested in more complex/detailed nutritional advice. A child eating 5 a day is likely to be eating a healthier diet than one surviving on beige UPFs and eating 0 a day. And I think it's absolutely contributed to a societal shift to parents encouraging their children to eat more fruit and veg.

It is a completely made up number used to encourage the idea that people should eat a decent amount of fruit and veg (and arguably driven by lobby groups in the fruit and veg industry). The '5' is from nowhere.

There's no reason it should be 5 specifically. There have been attempts to post rationalise, but it wasn't based on any science at all at the time.

5 a day isn't a bad idea, but similar to the points being raised on this post, it's also not something that should be set out as the golden standard.

If a child is eating a diet of entirely processed junk food but then a parent adds 5 bananas on top, that isn't going to make a material different to the child's nutrition. The 5 a day campaign is controversial because a fair number of experts consider it to be the wrong focus.