To think there should be minimum standards

[Obviouslynamechangedforthisagain]

For parents to keep their home?
Reading threads on here people admit to children being bathed once per week, wearing pjs for weeks on end, changing beds monthly etc.
Obviously not everyone lives in squalor but if there were minimum standards (ie 3 baths pw, bedding changed weekly) it could help an awful lot of neglected children that don't reach SS level of need.
Admittedly it would be almost impossible to police but if it could be done AIBU to think this could be a good idea?

Isn't there evidence that too much cleanliness is as bad for young children as too little?

What do you mean “keep their home”?

And who sets the standards? I think changing beds monthly is absolutely fine but would never only bathe once per week.

Who says your way is the right way?

Ah mumsnet…never change 😂

You are correct, of course. As a middle-class primary school kid in the 80's I had one bath per week. It didn't do me any harm. But I don't remember ever being read a bedtime story, and cuddles did not feature. As a parent of primary-aged children, I made sure bedtime stories and cuddles were a regular feature. We probably managed about 3 baths/showers a week.

Kids who are fully toilet trained and pre-puberty don't need multiple baths per week. Kids who are not fully toilet trained, or who have hit puberty, do.
Adults who use public transport and are likely to have their armpits near other peoples faces should shower every day - it's deeply antisocial not to. Context is everything.

My children are not neglected in anyway, but probably only have 2 baths a week in the winter and their bedding gets changed every 3 weeks or so. Really weird criteria you have set out. I would be more concerned with children skipping meals, being emotionally/physically abused etc.

What's wrong with a bath once a week + when dirty for pre-puberty kids, pray tell?

Also, sod off.

What do you think the impact of only bathing once a week is?
What do you think the impact of only changing your bedding once a month is?

Now think about what the impact of policing your ideal hygiene practices would be?

This is a silly idea designed to make you @Obviouslynamechangedforthisagain feel snuggly superior about totally unremarkable routines in your house.

I was just going to say the same thing. I have read several times that "they" think that the rise in childhood Asthma has happened mainly due to people keeping their homes too clean.

Which is similar in principal to a toddler never mixing with other youngsters in case they catch a cold, when in reality all that has happened is that the isolated child has not had a chance to build up any immunity before they go to infant school.

*Edited to correct a mistyped word.

Did you lease after Covid? Lots of dance classes were online during Covid. My tap clsss was 8-9pm. I did warn and apologise to the neighbours in advance however!

I don't think a child who is wearing slightly grubby pj's or whose sheets didn't get changed for over a week is being neglected....I mean I am sure some of them are but neglect is more than that I will confess that sometimes we don't change our sheets every week because we are busy but we all shower every evening due to sporting activities so I don't think they are too filthy. I would of course change a soiled bed for example if a child was sick. Your suggestion isn't going to suddenly and miraculously stop neglectful parents being neglectful because there is usually something significantly wrong with those people like mental health, addiction etc. Those are the real issues.

Also, there are a million and one parenting books out there which make it vert clear that kids need to be clean, fed, loved and nurtured so I don't think neglectful parents are that way because they are short of guidance. These are basic social norms.

When I was a child bath night was Sunday nigh, hair washed with vosene . Strip washed in between . Sheets changed once a week in summer , less so in winter . If clothes looked and smelt ok they got worn again . No tumble dyers , automatic washing machines or central heating back then .

Even if the government were to publish guidelines they’d be accused of being a nanny state. Just reading on mumsnet you see enormous differences in housekeeping. I change my sheets once a week and clean the bathroom twice a week yet there are people who clean the bathroom daily and others change bedding monthly.

There is also good evidence that a lot of childhood leukaemias are the result of the immune system not being challenged in the first year (though there also needs to be a genetic predisposition). And also that rising incidences of allergies are due to lack of early exposure to potential allergens and a "too clean" environment. Having a family dog/pet is protective against certain allergies/asthma, as also is having been exposed to tapeworms.
All of which suggests: let them play in the mud, pet the animals, and don't worry too much about every surface being surgically sterile. I'd draw the line at tapeworms though.

That is a terrible idea. Who would police it, who would decide what those standards should be and what happens if those standards are not met?
It is also extremely ignorant to think that all children live in households where it's possible to wash the sheets every week or have baths 3 times a week .
Also and most importantly giving your child love and attention and letting them know you will always be there for them is much more important than baths and clean sheets! It is possible to neglect and harm children and stil keep them squeaky clean.
I am in my sixties now but grew up in a household where we had baths once a week and sheets were not changed weekly, but I am my siblings were loved and cared for. We certainly were not neglected!

Surely the minimum standard should be to love their children and not abuse them

Keeping a house clean is just window dressing

My mother could keep a spotless house and sheets were changed weekly, windowsills dusted everyday in a lot of rooms but there was no love and for all the cleanliness in the world it didn’t stop me from ending up in care.

My house was and is a complete tip. However I found that when dh (now exh who still lives in my house) worked away the house would be so tidy and clean without a lot of input and I always prioritised fun things to do instead of hoovering. The housework would still be there at the end of the fun day out. The fun day out wouldn’t be there if I had stayed in to clean first

@Obviouslynamechangedforthisagain have you not heard about the Sara Sharif case? Parents can keep an immaculate home, change the bedding, bath 6 times a week and STILL batter the shit out of a poor child, so she ends up dead!

You are naive OP. Are you going to police this?? Pjs and bedding?? How about A BED, FOOD, SAFETY, WARMTH, ACCESS TO A DENTIST and so on.

A child can sleep in between silk sheets, have 10 baths a week and STILL be neglected emotionally/ physically and psychologically.

Come on!

Whilst obviously there's far worse things going on out there, I do think that weekly body washing and sheets left on the bed for weeks on end is sub par. And in an ideal world no child should be brought up in a sub par environment. And the ones that are normalise it and will likely go on to also bring up their children in a sub par environment.

Of course we shouldn't be removing kids because their PJs weren't changed often enough, but I do think many households do fall well short of decent standards of basic hygiene and we shouldn't be normalising this.

I think it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to have guidance out there that shows what children should be able to expect. For me that would be a full body wash (be that bath, shower, strip wash, emollient) at least every other day (daily from puberty), sheet changed ideally weekly but at least fortnightly, clean clothes every other day, teeth cleaned twice daily, 5 fruits and veg offered daily, house kept clean and tidy with clear floors hoovered at least weekly, kitchen and bathrooms cleaned at least weekly (ideally more) etc.

Do I think Social Services efforts should be put into enforcing this? Absolutely not, there's far more important cases of neglect for them to be dealing with. But I do think that parents who can't keep on top of simple hygiene can be part of a bigger picture of neglect and it can be a warning sign of parents not coping.

The bottom line is until you stop inadequate parents having children you will never cure societies ills .

Believe me, kids don’t come to social work attention because their beds haven’t been changed for a month. You’re talking really significant, obvious neglect - often they don’t have a bed to change, or bedding, kitchens are absolutely manky, mouldy food and rubbish everywhere, pet faeces, dirt engrained bathrooms.

Policing fairly normal housekeeping standards in all their variety would take away resources to check where there were much more serious concerns than a child wearing the same pjs for a week.

This....

Add 'love them.... give them positive reinforcement.... listen to them.....intervene when they need help and are struggling,,.

Goodness, literally NOBODY grows up and has trauma because their bed sheets were only changed every two weeks .... utterly ridiculous. My sheets were changed immediately if I'd wet the bed. I needed that and remember it. And if they hadn't been it would have been hell and humiliating. If I got myself covered in mud or smeared in honey, I got promptly cleaned up. , but I have no clue how often my sheets were changed routinely or I was bathed by rote. The idea that THAT is what you would legislate, if you could.... silly. Sounds like yet more standards to Wack and guilt poor overstretched mums with.....

I agree with you
Obviously we aren’t talking about making this a law or anything but I do think it would massively help to have guidelines about this type of thing. We are seeing the compound effects of a couple of generations now of neglectful parenting and sometimes people just don’t know and having a set of reasonably achievable guidelines could help a lot of people. Perhaps children’s services could set these standards as part of CIN conferences etc, and it would also give parents something concrete to work towards and probably help their self esteem and feeling of capability too.

I also feel there should be a minimum age to be left at home or unsupervised enshrined somewhere too.

Don’t be ridiculous. Who do you think is going to monitor this and what will be the consequence of not bathing your child enough? Fines? Parenting courses? Removal of the child from the home?

YABU to think this could be a good idea.

I was surprised when I first started hearing people talk about nightly baths for their children. We had a bath but it was never used, as a young child I had a shower once or twice a week with my dad's help. I do remember being read bedtime stories though.

sheet changed ideally weekly but at least fortnightly,

But there’s so much variation in households. My kids spend half the week with their dad, in a fortnight they’ll sleep in their own beds 5/6 times depending on sleepovers, staying with their dad and sleeping in with me. I’m not going to change their bed after 5/6 sleeps so they don’t get changed fortnightly. There’s no blanket rule that suits everyone.