Family holiday - been given a list of things we can/cannot do due to nephew’s ADHD/autism

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Going away on a holiday abroad at Easter with my 3 siblings, their families and our parents.

We’ve been on holiday with them before and not going is out of the question as our parents are elderly and our kids are all getting older too so we want to take the opportunity to all enjoy the time when we can.

Separate accommodation. My nephew is 11 and has recently, after getting nowhere diagnosis-wise with the NHS and 2 private clinics, been diagnosed by a 3rd private clinic with autism and ADHD. This is after a long history of behavioural issues and other symptoms.

My sister in the holiday group chat has given a list of “rules” for us all, including our kids, about what we can and can’t do around nephew now that he has a diagnosis. She’s asked we all respect it so that it can avoid a meltdown. They include- no competitive games (my own kids are a similar age to him as are my other nieces and nephew). The kids like to do things like throw those little sinking toys into the pool and be the first to dive for it. No talking about certain topics such as school (he’s a school refuser) to him and have asked to share our own kid’s school stories about school away from his ears as it upsets him when he hears how other kids are getting on And no talking to him when he has “quiet time” - so for example he will ask for an hour by the pool to be left alone and we all have to respect it and brief the kids as well. This might be a struggle for the cousins as some are younger and will want him to play and won’t understand to leave him alone. When we go out for meals together we can’t eat outside as nephew prefers to eat inside.

I don’t really know how to feel about this. I myself have a disabled DS but with a physical disability and we’ve always tried to ensure his symptoms and needs don’t impact on others - we just ask people to be forgiving if we have to cancel things, but there’s certain things my DS sometimes can’t do or join in with and I’d never stop the other kids from enjoying what DS can’t enjoy.

Not an AIBU as such but how would you respond? I want my sister and her family to have a good time but I’ll be damned if I’m told I can’t eat Al fresco with my mum and dad (who love Al fresco eating too) whose last holiday it will probably be!

A designated quiet space might be nice for everyone, so he doesn’t feel too conscious. Children can easily be guided to understand it’s a whispering type of area.

Your sister sounds really anxious, so I would probably reassure her, whilst keeping it realistic. The pool needs to remain open to be everyone, dn can opt out of games be isn’t comfortable with and quiet spaces will be respected,

They are not going to be able to police the outside world like this, so would be better advised to teach him how to cope with strategies.

In the spirit of compromise this should be ideal, but if mum's determined that it's everyone else's job to accommodate the child I doubt it'll be enough - try it, and another demand will probably take the place of the original one

I'd also keep any possible scepticism about the diagnosis to yourself. It's perhaps understandable when they've gone through four providers to get it, but mentioning this certainly won't be appreciated

It's a shame the holiday's already paid for, but could you swap to somewhere else if they'll just let you off with a "fee to change"?

They don't sound that unreasonable. You surely don't have to all be together constantly? Can go for a meal outside without them?

Some requests are actually fair enough, some can be compromised on and some you should stick to your guns.

He can have quiet time if he needs it. You say kids are close in age, so surely anyone over the age of 7 understands the concept. Plus, it gives them an opportunity to play the type of games they want.

The competitive games is a really tricky one as most kids are by nature competitive and water games tend to be as well. Are you at a hotel with a variety of pools? If so, you could take turns in taking the kids to a different one to play games/join in with the entertainment.

Not talking about school is a fairly easy one. Even if it does come up , just don't let it become a lengthy conversation.

Eating... you eat outside as that is what you want. If they eat inside, they eat inside. Your parents could join you on some nights and eat with them on some nights, it's up to them.You can also compromise and eat inside one night or two, but you need to make this clear in advance.

Basically a lot of sensible, discussion is necessary in order to make this work. If your sister is a sensible person generally, then it can work. If she's "my way or the highway " type, this trip is doomed anyway because she'll find fault with you regardless.

I think the thing here is compromise.
You can brief the kids on not talking about school, but they are kids and might forget. School is a huge part of their world and they will naturally talk about it.
I’d offer to have an hour a day when your nephew can use the pool all to himself but be clear that outside of that its free for all to use.
Eating outside, do you eat out at every meal or will some be at the accommodation? Perfectly feasible for him to eat inside for meals at your lodgings, with the rest of you doing what you like… aside from that then I think it reasonable that you eat where you like when out and about and the parents tag team either eating at home or going inside with him.
Competitive games. Maybe the other kids can focus on these when he’s having his quiet time?

Thing is, you cant change everyones holiday enjoyment for one person. You can make compromises, but at some stage your nephew is going to have to exist in wider society, where most people won’t accommodate him at all. He needs to be exposed to normality.

If your dsis really needs to try and exert this level of control over everyone then really the time to have raised all this was BEFORE it was booked. So you could all make the right decisions for your own family groups. Quite out of order to suddenly lay down rules after that.

"If he wants to avoid these things, you need to take him away when they are happening. If you don't and he has a "meltdown", it's on you."

If he wants to be left alone - leave him alone

competitive games - when he isn’t around. Or with your example - throw his own sinkie that just he gets.

who the fuck wants to talk about school on holiday

eat outside sometimes (his family can eat separately) and inside sometimes.

Doesn’t sound too hard to me.

I dare say your sis is knackered and wants to have a little holiday too and avoid her son having too many breakdowns.

I think the list is reasonable atm, she knows what her child needs and I don’t think she’s asking too much at the moment, it might get too much but I don’t think anyone else is really losing out by these requests.

Not disturbing him when he is having quiet time I would respect but then again i would be taking my child to the room for quiet time
Meal times if you don't mind sitting inside its not a terrible compromise

Things like competitive games and certain discussions not really something that can be dicated
I understand your sisters thought process but sadly meltdowns just can't be avoided all the time and as they get older you learn to recognise and intervene to stop them
My daughter has Autism/adhd and explosive meltdowns the only thing I ask my family are not to be sarcastic or jokey because she doesn't like it, force her do anything like playing a family game, make a big deal about things like if she dropped a cup etc

I think you need to explain to your sister that the other children may discuss these topics, they may want to eat outside and they should be able to play whatever games they want as it's there holiday too!

There is zero chance on Earth I would be pandering to this.
The holiday involves up to 10 people, not 1. Nobody is more important than anyone else.

I'm one of 4 siblings. Two of us are ND.

We all have children. Out of the 8 cousins, 6 are diagnosed ND - either ASD, ADHD or both. The other two I suspect are also ND.

When we are all together the kids know that they can take themselves off if they need space, or they have headphones and phones/ipads.

Otherwise they all have to fit in with what everyone else is doing. I don't expect other people to change what they do or what they talk about for DD - my role as her parent is to help her deal with the real world and that means sometimes being out of her comfort zone.

I also don't expect her to make huge adjustments to keep whichever cousin happy.

Your sister may need to eat separately with her DS if he really doesn't want to be outside, but it's unfair of her to expect all of you to comply.

She is not doing him any favours by letting him think the world revolves entirely around his needs.

Yes. He’s legally entitled to reasonable adjustments at school and in employment BECAUSE HE’S DISABLED.

Excuse me?

This.

Quiet time should be in his own bedroom / accommodation, not a shared facility.

Some meals can be inside. If you sit outside they don't have to join you.

There's a balance between understanding and pandering.

Let them do their thing, you do yours.

I think quiet time is fair enough. And if school really is such an emotional subject then I'd be considerate of that.

The no competitive games for children and no eating outside are a bit more unfair to the rest of the group. I don't like eating outside either but wouldn't impose that on a big group of people.

Is there any possibility that you've misinterpreted your sister's messages?

Could it be possible that instead of imposing rules on the rest of your family, she's setting up expectations for how present her family is going to be able to be because of her son's needs.

For example if your parents have the expectation that you all need to be together all of the time, is this the first step in your sister saying "Actually mum, we can't stay by the pool with you all this afternoon because litte Timmy would find that difficult" or "Sorry mum, we won't be joining the family for dinner tonight, we're giving Timmy a break and having room service instead"

I interpreted the 'quite time' request to mean he wants to be able to sit on a lounger and relax without being pestered to play. Personally I think that's fine, he shouldn't be obliged to entertain the younger kids if he doesn't want to. I understand young children might not understand or forget, but surly a child that young will have an adult with them in the pool who can redirect them.

I don't think avoiding an upsetting topic of conversation is that much of an ask either. If it was an adult who had just lost their job, I wouldn't be telling them all about how great I was doing at work, so why wouldn't you give a child who's clearly struggling the same consideration.

For the competitive sports I think the compromise is to not push him to join in, but remember not everything needs to be a competition. Why can't they collectively see how fast they can get all the sinkies?

The eating outside thing is the only one that would cause me problems, but again it depends on what exactly is meant. If the expectation is that everyone will eat inside every night, then that's not reasonable. If your going to split into groups most night, then one or two indoor meal together wouldn't be that bigger deal.

It doesn’t sound like DN wants everyone to be quiet at the pool, just that he wants some time to himself. Which the other DC should respect.

Maybe DSis can suggest (& organise) some non-competitive pool games?! I think this one is actually quite difficult - mine are always diving for weights or seeing who can swim furthest underwater etc With the diving weights though, I do throw in 5 or 6 in different directions, so the stronger swimmer doesn’t get them all.

It sounds like a lot of people to all be eating at the same time, so suggest that some meals are inside & others outside. Or DSis & DBil entertain all the kids inside whilst you & your parents eat outside…..

Not talking about school infront of him shouldn’t be too difficult.

Do you mean the NHS didn't agree he was autistic and had adhd ? And the first 2 private clinics also didn't?

That's a bit mad if so...do people really just keep going till they get someone to agree with the diagnosis they already decided?
Also as a parent of a autistic child I would never dictate how others spend their holiday. I just keep a close eye on my child and remove them from any situation that causes them distress. It's what I have done since she was a toddler and it's worked well for us

I would have no problem not mentioning school in front of him, could easily convince my kids to not bring it up. They would happily not think about school while on holiday anyway.

As the parent of children who are ND, I have probably been guilty of being quite singleminded at times because I want to avoid meltdowns from my kids, judgement from others and a bad atmosphere all round. Your sister is likely the same; she just doesn’t want the holiday remembered for that time her child went into meltdown.

Absolutely this.

I think, looking back to when my DC were diagnosed that there is a knee jerk reaction to try and control everything. To make the world perfect for your DC, to avoid meltdowns 100% of the time.

But I've learnt that actually, this doesn't help them in the long term. E.g my son's special school offered to have the same person meet him at the door each morning, and I asked what if this person is ill? Or leaves? Then that will cause so much upset. Don't we need to teach him that life is unexpected sometimes, that people are off ill etc etc.

He was 6, so a lot younger than your nephew. But it sounds like your sister needs a gentle / firm hand hold through these things. If DN doesn't like eating outside then could he wear a cap / sunglasses to shield from the sun? Take his phone / tablet with headphones etc.

I'm not saying that you need to come up with a list of solutions or adjustments for her, but I wonder if it sounds like she needs someone who's been through a diagnosis to talk through things.

I hope that all makes sense, as it's such a tricky situation for you and like you've said about your own son that there is a balance to be had between a child's needs and the needs of the others.

A holiday group of 10-15 people sounds nightmarish for an autistic person. Out of their familiar environment and with a busy noisy group or varying ages.

I would say nothing for now, play it by ear and do your best to not upset your nephew. If something is particularly unreasonable, then I would try to negotiate with your sibling at that time, rather than arguing about hypotheticals now.

The world is a difficult place for people like him.

I really can’t see the problem.

-You have your own accommodation (so these adjustments are only in a group setting). You can play board games / competitions with the children when you’re as a smaller family unit.
-You shouldn’t talk to him about school. Totally relatable, nothing worse than someone bringing up work when you’re trying to relax. Engage with him on a more interesting topic.
-Don’t speak to him when he’s having quiet time. Again, relatable. If he needs his own space, why wouldn’t you allow him to have that.

Your sister has sent this to try to minimise the meltdowns. If she didn’t share this and you were ‘triggering’ him unintentionally every 5 minutes, that would ruin your holiday. Ultimately you either follow her guide and have a fun time, or totally disregard it and see how long it takes for DN to irritate you.

I agree. I don’t think her requests are unreasonable at all.
Try and show some empathy. I agree that one child shouldn’t ’dictate’ the whole holiday but at the end of the day they are family so why can’t you just try to accommodate some simple requests to prevent a meltdown?
I think your sister is probably quite anxious and just needs some support to know you will be backing her.
Try and think of a compromise together for dining.
My son has asd and is home Ed.