Asking too much to get a private school place?

[Twentythirdtry]

If there’s a child in a private prep whose parents receive no financial help for this, are they unreasonable to believe they have any chance of securing a bursary for senior school?

• the child is awaiting diagnosis for ASD
• quite exceptionally talented in art and current head believes there’s a chance to secure art scholarship.
• just above average CAT scores (tad below in verbal reasoning) so likely to pass entrance tests

parents are facing mounting debt (including utility bills) funding his current school place, and often go without basic and necessities for themselves. The parents rent, don’t own a car, don’t have any savings capital or investments, have no family to ask. One parent is a full time carer for a severely disabled relative and the other parent earns 45k pre tax with sometimes 100 hours overtime each month.

senior school place would be entirety of fathers post tax income per annum

difference in the child’s academic and social development since moving to prep has been noted by teachers as commendable.

Child did not cope well in State primary due to bullying and local secondaries have a growing problem with knife crime.

given some parents own homes/mortgages, equity, savings, car(s), not in debt etc, and moderate incomes, and are granted bursaries…

would the child be likely to be granted a bursary? If so, would this be likely a large or small bursary/any idea of percent?

Every private school is different with regards scholarships and bursaries. You need to contact each school you are interested in and ask specifically. There’s a school near me that offers sport and academic scholarships that give 20% off fees. It also has 3 bursary places with 100% fee covered. All of these have very different and specific criteria. You need to be fully transparent with your finances as they go through everything with a fine tooth comb regarding properties, savings, investments etc. Plus the children need to pass the entrance exams. The devil is in the detail so you just need to contact the schools individually and ask. Other private schools nearby have completely different arrangements - no bursaries and only 10% off for scholarships but for different things like music.

Too many schools give too much money to already wealthy families. That's why bursaries replaced scholarship fee reductions. . It's a fairer system of spending money. Scholarship fee reductions can easily go to the wealthy who use the best prep schools that prep for the scholarships. Bursaries are a much better use of finite resources as they are income based. Most schools want a good return on their investment though as do the parents who pay higher fees or into a bursary fund to support the dc. Many of these can see money going via scholarships to families far wealthier than them and with vat find that difficult.

Of course this has already been attempted?! I do wonder if these kind of nonsensical replies are coming from relatively wealthy people on bursaries that are worried they’re going to get rejected once people with my circumstances apply 😂

Yes I am aware. But to have joined on the understanding that we would pay full fees (and knowing the hardship this would entail) knowing that if there’s any bursary support, it is reserved for children already in the school, getting him in the school THEN applying for bursary after the fact, on the basis he’s now been offered a place (on the basis he would fully pay for the place) .. would be incredibly disingenuous.

this is the reason many schools do not accept bursary applications after offers have been made, I’m not sure how else to explain this.

I'm very much a 'nothing ventured, nothing gained' person, so agree with @merryoldgoat. You apply, and let the school decide.

My daughter has just gone through the process for 6th form, having been on a bursary/scholarship from Years 7 - 11 and whilst the competition is fierce, she has secured a scholarship and bursary again in a new school.

I'm also in rented accommodation (HA), on a low income and UC, and had 3 schools offer bursaries between 60-95%. They are not the preserve of the middle class at all.
Give yourself options if you have more than one private school in your area; as different schools have different criteria.

While bursaries are means-tested and are sometimes offered to the best and brightest, you never know the caliber of children applying, or how each child will show up during the entrance exams. Schools also have boxes to tick - academically brilliant, exceptionally talented, not so brilliant or talented but has the right attitude that fits, economically/racially/culturally diverse...

Prepare him well for the tests, interview and encourage him to produce the best work he can. Let the chips fall where they may.

So there’s absolutely no way you can get a job. I don’t see how my reply is nonsensical and no I’m not after a bursary and I’m not wealthy I’m a full time working parent who works hard to provide for my kids and my eldest goes to a selective state school because she’s clever and worked hard hth

Thank you! I appreciate the encouragement 🙂

No. I mean why is your child taking a place in selective state when you could get a higher paying job and pay for a private school place?

She could easily have got into private school but the school she goes to is stronger academically

why should your child get a bursary when they sound academically weak and not an asset to the school.

I take your point that you joined the school in full understanding of the fees and that your circumstances have not changed. But, costs have risen since the child started at the school and presumably fees have too. It's not disingenuous to go the school to say you are now in financial hardship and to see if they can offer anything. Worst case scenario is that they say "no". You don't say how old the child is, but making the assumption that you are looking for a senior school place in September 2026 that means you are only looking for financial assistance for the next 4 terms.

Why should your child take up a grammar place when you could find a better private school and get a better paying job to pay for it?

You’re just being disingenuous because you’re annoyed that people are seeing through you. I’ve answered your question, why haven’t you explained why a) you can’t get a job and b) your child deserves a funded private education, apart from being ok at drawing

It would be 2027, and he only recently joined. The school made it clear that fees rise each year and VAT would be have to be considered going forward.

in my thinking, the worst isn’t just them saying no, it’s them thinking that we would attempt to take advantage of them/funds reserved for children already there, which is morally difficult and not to mention how that could reflect in my son being treated less favourably as well as the kind of reference they would provide.

People disagreeing with you are doing so because they're wealthy people who think you'll prevent them getting bursaries? That's some logic.

Unless the person you are care for is your child, you are choosing to provide unpaid care and by doing so, be unable to pay for your child's school fees and your utility bills etc. And you're free to make that choice, and it might be difficult and upsetting to change that, but it is a choice you're making.

And from the outside it looks completely unsustainable to think you can send a child to private school for another 7 years on one average income and keep being unable to pay your bills and keep providing unpaid care, and hope that the way it'll work is that the private school will reduce the fees for you.

That was the question you asked and people are answering it. You can choose to prioritise providing unpaid care instead of being able to pay your bills and buy the education you want for your child, but the private school don't have to facilitate that for you. I'm sorry that isn't what you want, and I'm sorry you have some difficult decisions to make because your current set up isn't sustainable for you.

well I’ve answered the question way back in the thread and you won’t answer my question, it seems you’re annoyed that I’ve seen through you, especially as you’ve resorted to minimise my sons positive attributes as much as you possibly can.

so why are you taking up a grammar place when you’re able to get a better paying job and get your daughter into a better school?

If he's only recently started and the other school place won't be needed until September 2027, I think you might be getting ahead of yourself. It's clearly this school is better than his previous school, but it doesn't follow that this means he must go to a private senior school and that your view of local state schools now will not change by the time he actually goes there.

It also gives the family plenty of time to consider other options such as looking for ways to increase income/seeking more support with the disabled relative/more drastic solutions such as moving house. If you're in an area where knife crime is such an issue in local schools, you might want to consider this anyway? Secondary school children are likely to spend a lot of time out and about in the local area.

Is 2027 11+ or 13+ entry? If the latter some day schools intake majority at 11+ and any funding for subsequent starters is more limited. If the former you have time to identify potential state schools as a back up and maybe get an ehcp to support your choice. I suspect availability of bursary funding generally may change over next few years so whatever you are told now may not be the case by then.

Private school will generally require an Education Pysch report before admission. Not sure if this was mentioned already, sorry have not read all.
The purpose of the report is to be sure child will have successful experience at school and to be sure that school can meet child’s needs - all schools have learning support (which is often extra cost depending).

The Ed Psych should also be able to give you advice on schools which could be a good fit.

Anecdotally, a classmate of my child, had 1:1 support through primary to year 8, parent funded at private. My impression was it wasn’t needed all the time but funding was full time. Parents were 100% shocked, to learn after yr 8 graduation, after interviews, that their child was declined admission to the Sr School. What was more shocking, is that the Sr School isn’t particularly selective, they pretend to be, but are not. I’m not if it was felt child needed support in secondary, or not. Child went to state secondary and is now at highly regarded local college with many classmates from primary.

There are many parents on much higher incomes that get granted bursaries for their averagely achieving children… who are also acutely aware that bursaries are about to get a whole lot more competitive so I can absolutely see their logic in trying to dissuade parents with much lower incomes from applying.

if it were possible to give up caring for the person and have the council take over and provide the care the person requires, I would have, as I’ve already explained further back. I’m not walking around with holes in my shoes and mounting debt for nothing.

I understand my son wouldn’t have a high chance of fee assistance but given the circumstances, I do believe it is at least worth trying

Are you sure about that? I’ve had lengthy conversations with the prep head and the senco who hasn’t mentioned this at all, mentioned everything.. but .. this?

Am parent of ADHD child. Child did not have any extra support at primary.

All the secondary school applications I was wanting for child asked if child had an additional need (can’t recall the wording) and required ed psych report. I don’t think this is a bad thing. I would be more concerned if they didn’t ask, and they were not interested / or able to cope with difference. He was accepted, as a boarder to an academically selective school based on Ed Pysch evaluation and high scores on her assessments.

On the application form you may be asked to declare any additional needs or support required, and provide a relevant report. The school may decide they cannot cater for him. If you decide to not declare anything either the prep reference might indicate it or he may be asked to leave later. Your ds may have a better school experience if he is understood and supported. You may also find that the difference between him and his peers grows as he gets older.

Just call a secondary u are interested in & ask admissions. U don’t have to give your name
Hi looking for admissions to year 9, my child is ND, do you require additional info ? I am planning ahead, I know the wait for evaluations can be long…. Is there an Ed Psch who visits your school regularly, could you share the name as looking for best fit for my talented child.

Ok that’s an interesting development, I wonder why it hasn’t been mentioned. The head does seem confident DS would be offered places at several local schools so I doubt Ed psych reports would get in the way of that in any way. In the classroom he has no extra support at all, it’s more so his social development that needs a bit of support. But thank you for the heads up! 🙂

Secondary applications normally require full disclosure of medical conditions and diagnosis reports or statement that diagnosis is pending. Parents contracts normally stipulate that failure to disclose condition or suspected condition is considered a contract breach.
Part of the evaluation for a place does include confidential reference from Headmaster and they must disclose all additional support. They will not lie on this report.
Scholarship and bursary are different things, child might be strong enough to get scholarship but this is usually a small percentage of fees, it does not guarantee bursary. Given VAT schools prioritise current pupils and some schools just stopped new bursaries.
It is possible to get 100%+ bursary, at least in some top league London school. + means all expenses on the top of school fees, e.g. uniforms, trips, chargeable parents events etc etc will be covered. BUT - child needs to be exceptionally strong and bring some glory to the school.
I'm sorry to say but with just above average CATs and one below average and with level of support required your DC might not be bursary material. You do need to have plan B.

A side note - your comment about PPs using selective grammar instead of paying for private really alienates people.