To think free bus passes for the old should be abolished?

[Bumpitybumper]

Statistics show that on average wealth peaks at age 65-74 in the UK, why then do we give these people free bus passes? It makes absolutely no sense at all and is just an unnecessary expense. The idea that 'young' pensioners are a relatively poor group of people is completely incorrect and it only serves to enhance the already massive intergenerational wealth gap between baby boomers and everyone else.

when the assisted dying bill comes in, there will be threads about the best way to coerce granny into popping off her clogs and leaving the inheritance intact.

As for OP and all the other pp on this thread whining about how hard it is for younger people - you think the elderly (especially women) who worked at a time they were legally allowed to be paid less, couldn't buy property without husbands or fathers signature, couldn't get a credit card and often had to give up work when they had kids... you think they should be further penalised by having to stay in (their huge paid-off mansion) rather than give them a bus pass that costs peanuts compared to other government/council spending?

There are conversations to be had about free travel passes for school age children, apprentices etc etc. But you started a goady, whiny ageist thread, so stick to the topic.

You are a horror!

We pay the lowest State Pension in Western Europe just about. It is just over 1/3rd of minimum wage.

Some pensioners paid a fortune into work pensions to back State Pension up- they are pretty small pensions ultimately.

If they own property- it is rarely something worth a huge amount and appears to be mainly spent on care fees. In the north-east where we live, pensioners are the poorest in the country, property prices are the lowest and health statistics the poorest. In the south-east people may own expensive properties and have large pensions (as salaries are usually significantly larger).

I think a free bus pass is very little to offer them at 67- and it's about all they get now.

In many countries in Europe they treat pensioners with dignity and respect. Not much of it evident in this thread.

Have you considered how much ££££s, taxes, council taxes these “wealthy” pensioners will have paid all their working lives?? So why shouldn’t they get a bus pass when they are at an age (66/7 in England) where their health / eyesight is probably beginning to fail. Life isn’t fair - whatever gave OP the impression that it is? My DM’s generation were all pensioned off at 60 (females); whereas my own generation who have generally worked more throughout their lives, have paid in more tax but will get pension from a much later age. Also, what is it with these stupid age stereotypes like “Boomer” “ Gen X” etc. Treating people like they all run their lives in the same way - ridiculous. There are both hard working and lazy, entitled folk in every generation.

(a) You are not offering the wealthiest people in the country free bus passes. You genuinely think that the wealthiest people in the country get on buses????
(b) It would cost more to put a means testing system in place and run it that bus fares are worth.

and

(c) oh goody, yet another elderly bashing thread. It has been 20 minutes since the last one.

Sure some people would 'abolish' the old given half a chance. As for the bus pass, it is a lifeline for most pensioners who live on very little, to enable them to go out shopping for example and to meet friends. I do know some older people who can afford to not use it, and continue to pay their way.

That's a good point. I hadn't thought about it but if I go into my local town during the day pensioners are probably the majority of people. We go into a local cafe for a tea or a lunch, it is very elderly friendly, almost like a club and the owner told me he was opening for Christmas lunches as so many of his regulars would be home alone otherwise. Would his business survive without his elderly customers would that just be another empty business premises in the town with loss of business rates and his staff out of work.

Yep absolutely, it would save so much money.

My MIL and FIL are millionaires and drive but they get buses now and then to "get their money's worth" going nowhere in particular which is all the more annoying for people actually trying to commute to shift work on an already overcrowded bus. What's worse is that it's our local hospital bus so it forces NHS staff that have already been on their feet for a 12 hour or more shift, to continue standing.

I would suspect that he's spending more of his time in his fancy merc than riding round on buses then? In which case the fact he can get a free bus pass is neither here nor there, the taxpayer is not paying for bus journeys he isn't making.

Also if he's earning 6 figures he's going to very much be net contributor in terms of the amount he's paying in tax so if he's taking the bus occasionally for free it's again neither here nor there.

Greater Manchester is a brilliant example. I’d be interested to see any statistics they’ve produced on to what extent, if any, lowering public transport costs has reduced car journeys.

Disagree because someone I know has used his free bus pass for a few years now to visit different nearby towns for his lunch. He has now fully retired and uses the bus pass most days to go somewhere for lunch. He doesn't drive, lives in very basic accommodation and likes to be out and about. Family live in a different county. I think the pass gives him so much freedom to explore. He loves it.

I also think it's very important that people can choose to stop driving (or stop owning a car) at some point and still get out and about.

I actually think the free prescription age could go up. I was a bit shocked when I started getting free prescriptions and I was still working, it didn't really feel right as I could afford the prescription charges. Anyone on benefits would still get their prescription free but it still may affect those on lower wages who don't qualify for benefits - it's a tough one.

There used to be a West Midlands a rail/bus pass. I don't know if it still exists. I think it was monthly, you had to pay for it but it worked out cheaper. I always bought one, it saved a lot of time and hassle. I don't know if anywhere else offers/offered this

Edited to add just seen the post above and Manchester has a scheme

In Scotland the cost of the bus passes were released due to a Freedom of Information Request…from May 2018 to 2024 the cost for bus passes to the over sixties is a whopping £951 million. In addition the Young Persons bus passes 2023-2024 estimated cost £198 million. Not sure if that is a great use of public money. I think I would prefer my ambulance to arrive promptly rather than have a free bus pass.

Pension age is now 67? So I don't think there are many pensioners aged 67-70 who are using buses just because they can travel for free. The majority will be driving.

Honestly now I’m no longer needed to care for elderly relative or dgc should I just curl up and die? Clearly seen as a massive burden by many on mumsnet. I’ve had a free prescription recently, had I been unable to afford it I would definitely have ended up in hospital on iv antibiotics due to a tracking infection.
It’s not just about saving pennies today but pounds tomorrow. It’s a fact that faculties decline with age and encouraging bus use rather than driving cars is good. I’ve known a few oldies who’ve driven longer than they should ( keys taken from them, harsh but necessary). What is the cost of a simple rtc ? What about an rtc where a breadwinner is killed, a mother and child killed on the pavement?
I’ve worked hard all my life and fortunately don’t need any financial help at the moment but these threads make me feel utterly worthless after a lifetime of working.

Add...He also owns a motorhome. He regularly goes abroad and uses his bus pass to admit him lower cost travel to the airport so he doesn't have to pay to park his car. He'd be the first to admit he doesn't need a bus pass and uses it simply because he can. "Why should I pay for fuel and parking when I don't have to?" Was what he said, quote.

From what I am aware, pensioners get a pass (this costs money to administer) but if it's not used, it doesn't cost anything. The main cost is when it is used, it's a card that gets scanned so the local authority know it's been used, hence a charge is made.

I’m sure there are plenty of other people reading this thread who understand what you’re saying and not that you hate old people, think they’re a waste of space and want to kill them all.

hypothetical discussion on the internet is nearly impossible now. Certainly on this forum - a lot of people on here genuinely seem unable to deal with nuance, or apply critical thinking

its just shout shout shout and take it to the nth degree as fast as possible. Weird!

i take it you haven't heard of reducto ab asurdeam then (sp? cba to check)

My bus pass is a lifeline. I use it to go to the local library and sit in the warm, to go to places on market day and chat to strangers, to see life going on outside my 4 walls. Pensioners who can easily afford the £3 fare wouldn't be seen dead on a bus, so they may apply for one but it will just gather dust. Please don't attack the pensioners' bus pass.

For goodness sake. There are wealthy pensions but I don’t know any that are as wealthy as you describe. What I do know that is that

we would be lost without our freedom pass. It enables us and many others to drag ourselves onto a bus and go short journeys to get shopping or visit doctors surgeries. It enables the old and lonely to get out and about and actually speak to people at bus stops and on the buses, in the shops. It actually helps local shops and encourages mobility which the elderly need to prevent them becoming ever more dependent on other people.As for those with land rovers and are millionaires well they wouldn’t apply for a bus pass as not needed. The council pays for each one applied for and not sent to one and all. I can assure you that just heating homes and being able to keep up with ever increasing food prices is a concern for the majority of old people who are not in a position to earn extra to pay for these things. As for big houses! Well they command bigger council tax which helps to pay for bus passes etc. Your opinion is based on a general assumption that is similar to the one that labels all single mothers as on benefits and scroungers. It’s wrong and ill thought out.

To placate the elders on here, I agree that they should remove the free bus passes for the younger aswell. I read that there has been an increase in abusive behaviour towards drivers since they brought it in.

Oh I love a bit of Mumsnet ageism in the morning.

@Bumpitybumper you wait - you’ll be old eventually. We’ll, you’d better hope you get old - the alternative is worse.

In the morning people are:

Going to work
Going to school
Possibly going to hospital or a GP appointment
Taking younger children to nursery

So the busses (and in London trams and tube) are busy.

But those people return home at different times. Most school children are travelling at 3.30 or 4pm.

Workplaces might close at 5 or 5.30 or 6 or people may go from work for a drink or a meal so again not everyone is trying to get on public transport at the same time.

Many hospitals have people working 'long days' which is 12 hour shift.

If you were to limit the evening rush hour then you could be leaving elderly and / or disabled people stuck for a couple of hours.

my arguments make way more sense than your nonsense of an OP.

We get it. You are jealous of a few old biddies using a bus pass they don't need.

get over it. One day, if you are lucky, you will be old. And hopefully by then agesim won't be as trendy as it is now

Like all these benefits it should be means tested.