Trans men are women according to Gender Critical Movement

[ThisPinkWyvern]

Under Trump's transgender policy, which echoes the ideology of the Gender Critical Movement, trans women are men and trans men are women. This view denies and rejects as worthless and baseless the lived experience of millions of men and women in the US who identify as trans. As a result of having their lived experience of themself ignored and denied by law, millions of trans men as well as trans women are now experiencing deep psychological trauma and living in abject fear and terror in the US. Many are trying to leave the country because they are so terrified.

The almost total silence of the Gender Critical Movement and it's supporters about the effect that it's ideology has had on those hundreds of thousand of women who self identify as men is deafening.It's whole argument about banning trans women from female public toilets and other ' women only spaces' is based on the argument that denying trans women the right to access these spaces is needed to protect the safety of women and girls. Given the fear, terror and trauma that hundreds of thousands of women( trans men) are now experiencing in the US, as a result of the government putting into practise Gender Critical Movement ideology, the sense of safety and well-being of hundreds of thousands of women has been devastated. This makes the infinitesimally small number of cases where women have been or ever would be assaulted by a trans woman in a women only space pale into insignificance by comparison.

In short, the Gender Critical Movement is directly responsible for harming the well being of hundreds of thousands of WOMEN according to it's own ideology.The damage done by implementing it's ideology makes a sickening mockery of it's claim that it's ideology protects the safety of women and girls.

When the number of men( trans women) in the US who are now living in fear and terror in the US is taken into account as well, the Gender Critical Movement and all those who support it are directly responsible for terrorising millions of people. It is impossible to claim that we are supporting women's rights and protecting the safety of women if we support the Gender Critical Movement.

Er, no. Sex is shown by chromosomes and DNA. Not just a penis or lack of. A de-nutted male dog is still a male dog. That is what your dangerous ideology ignores. Even trans themselves admit they cannot change sex, so you are out of step and coming across as quite unhinged. You can't change your chromosomes and DNA = you can't change sex. Biology is chromosomes and DNA. Not a cock, nuts or breasts. But DNA that is in every single cell in your body. That is BIOLOGY. A male dog that has had its nuts removed REMAINS a male dog.

You also ignore the fact that up to 97% of transwomen retain their penis and testicles. In other words, almost none have the operation. Your ideology denies the ACTUAL lived experience of biological women. Every time you GASLIGHT women and girls to deny their actual lived experience as the oppressed sex class in order to cosplay in a male's fetish, you harm women. Eery time you gaslight a rape survivor to call her rapist a 'she', you harm women.

But you don't care.... do you? You're a Male Supremacist that believes actual females in the actual oppressed sex class should be gaslit to deny our actual lived experience to cosplay in a male's fetish. Your HATE and disregard for the rights of women and girls says it all. Go back to your Andrew Tate videos. Your dangerous Meninist ideology has done so much to harm to rights of females all over the world. I really wonder how you sleep at night.

Most women have no time to think about their "I".
Too busy spinning plates and doing the grunt work.

Sorry that happened to you. These Male Supremacists are mentally unwell and really truly HATE women. The OP should be ashamed of themselves but in order to feel shame you have to be human and have a sense of human decency.

If the same criteria is applied to a post op transgender woman her lack of a penis would mean that her biological sex would be determined to be female not male. Since the Gender Critical Movement's ideology declares that sex is binary - there is no spectrum- an individual without a penis and outer female genitals is by default designated female. A post op transgender woman is categorised as female therefore using the same criteria that categorised her as male at birth.

so yes, an individual can change their biological sex and a post op transgender woman is therefore a biological woman.

So by your own logic an MtF trans who has not had surgery is still a biological man because they still have a penis.

However even post op that person may not have a penis, but they don't have ovaries, a uterus or a vagina either.

Biology has a way of demonstrating that a transgender woman is not a biological woman.

And for that 1%, we've had society turned upside down, our language re-defined - women and girls called 'menstruators', 'bleeders', and 'uterus havers', we have had intact males in women and girls changing rooms and stealing the sports scholarships, awards and places of women and girls. And, males in rape crisis centres sitting in on women's trauma literally grinning at hearing the stories (per 'Sarah' and her story which many here will be familiar with).

NEVER before has such a tiny minority had such overreaching POWER. Never. Gay men never had this power. Not even so-called (forgive me for using this term) 'cis' men. Transwomen are at the top of the totem pole higher than 'cis' men.

Gender Ideology is a dangerous misogynistic Mens Rights Movement cult. Its taken every single right women and girls have ever had to fight for. And the intense sheer HATE for women and girls dripping from the OP's post (who I have no doubt is a male and Andrew Tate-loving incel here to cause trouble) is palpable.

Mother Nature eh, what a TERF.

What a load of BS you're spouting, OP! I haven't laughed so much in days!

Not having a Penis is not what makes someone a woman. As others have said, it's their chromosomes that determine their sex. More specifically, the absence of the Y chromosome.

No Y chromosome means you are female.
Having a Y chromosome means you are male, and this is still the case for those with disorders of sexual development. Eg,

XY ..... MALE
XXY .... MALE
XXXY ..... STILL MALE.

XX ...... FEMALE
XXX ...... STILL FEMALE.

ETC.

HUMANS CANNOT CHANGE SEX. IT IS A PSYCHOLOGICAL ISSUE, SAME AS ANOREXIA.

Chopping a man's penis off and turning it inside out does not magically turn it into a vulva/vagina or him into a woman. It's still a penis. And it still belongs to a MAN.

Oh don’t be silly @ThisPinkWyvern

Transmen are women. Otherwise they couldn’t be trans.

That MAGA guy will still have clocked she was a woman.

That’s the thing- she thinks that if he knew she was female he would attack her, but she can’t cope with the fact he did know, and it made no difference. It causes the whole edifice to crumble, she is just as safe or unsafe because MAGA guy is male.

the infinitesimally small number of cases where women have been or ever would be assaulted by a trans woman in a women only space

Nonsense — like the rest of OP’s attempt at an argument. We have a steady stream of trans-identifying men coming to court in the UK for rape and other offences against women, often in women-only spaces.

UK Ministry of Justice statistics show that trans-identifying men commit crimes at least as often as other men, and commit more sexual offences.

In UK prisons, 58% of trans-identifying men have been convicted of a violent or sexual offence, compared with 16% of non-trans-identifying male prisoners and 3% of female prisoners.
https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/18973/default/

What the? Aren't safe or wanted in America? What type of bullshit darvo and gaslighting is this??!!! They are the safest, most powerful, most privileged and most protected group in America and elsewhere! They are THE most safest group there is.

And stop minimising the affect of the large number of women and girls losing out to males in sports. Including losing a sports scholarship to college which means they now can't go to college at all. Its a massive amount, not just a 'few'. Even one, is one too many! Over 5000 transwomen victors, 27 world records, 109 U.S. records, $1.6 million in prize money. Just in the last few yrs. https://www.hecheated.org/totals_results_2020s

But it's the truth, trans women are men! Even if they chop off their dick and balls they are still men with XY chromosome and no amount of surgery can change that. We should do the same in this country

I just read that Democrat Wisconsin Governor Tony Evers has introduced a bill that will change state law to replace the word "mother" with "inseminated person."

You betcha father will still be father.

Inseminated person. That is what we're (If Evers gets his way) reducing women to now. And some of you still can't see how malicious, malignant and misogynistic this Mens Rights Movement is.

Inseminated person? FUCK OFF! The more this goes on, the more I really am starting to hate trans people. For real.

This is correct in 99.995% of cases, but just to note that we now know that the biological switch is the SRY gene on the Y chromosome. It's also now possible to test for this directly rather than just looking for a Barr body, and doing so would be the right sex screening test to use in elite level sport for example.

It is possible - but very rare - for the SRY gene to be found in XX individuals (de la Chapelle syndrome) or to be absent in XY individuals (Swyer sybdrome).

It's also possible, but even rarer, for an individual to have different chromosomes in different parts of their body, perhaps because two zygotes fused together.

Also that while SRY determines sex in mammals, it does not define sex - which is a classification of bodies* into two classes, characterised by their typical production of large or small gametes, and which applies to almost all animals and plants.

Of course not of these rare cases, or any other DSDs, have any relevance to the 99.9% of people for whom chromosomes, genes, genitals, gonads, and gametes all line up over their lifetime in the typical male or female fashion.

• Except platypuses and echidnas. ** Or parts of bodies, e.g. in worms.

@ThisPinkWyvern

Absolutely nobody else can tell us how we should experience our sense of "I' because it is a subject and falls outside the domain of objective inquiry.

I think very few GC people seek to dictate how anyone (trans or otherwise) experience their sense of “I”. Some? Sure. Most? Absolutely not.

If that’s been your understanding of the GC movement then I hope we can help put your mind at rest.

What GC people are mainly concerned with are social and legal rights.

They don’t generally depend on someone’s subjective sense of “I”, and shouldn’t do.

Other than in the case of trans policy, can you think of examples where rights depend on subjective self-identification (either to acquire rights or remove the rights of others?).

The closest case is belief protections. And most GC people support rights akin to belief protections to apply to trans people’s beliefs about themselves.

I hope that helps make you feel better. Trans people’s rights aren’t really analysed any differently from rights in general. Because trans people are people.

Terror? Why are they living in terror? I haven't heard of any attacks on trans people since the orange one became king. They surely have the same rights as everyone else.

Oh, my footnotes went a bit awry. Hopefully comprehensibke anyway.

Sex determination in monotremes is fascinating btw: pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2413164/

You'd need to ask the men how they feel about women presenting as men using their spaces. If I was guessing, I wouldn't think transgender would feel particularly safe doing so

The real and present dangers faced by transmen (biological females who identify as men) is not reduced or mitigated in any way if authorities and hyperprogressive virtue-signallers go along with the pretence. They are at risk because of the endemic sexism and enforcement of the sexust stereotypes that they are trying to escape. They are at risk both from both sexist men and sexist women, who may well subject them to various kinds of violence and prejudice. That violence and prejudice is very wrong but they are not subject to it due to being trans but due to the fact thar they are women who are transgressing sexist expectations.

Trump is a sexist. The pro-trans lobby who isist that it is possible to change sex is equally sexist. There is no way for someone born male to "live as a woman" or for someone born female to "live as a man" except through sexism. Without sexism, both men and women can live, act and dress any way they damn well please and that's totally fine and whether you're a man (the kind of human who makes the small mobile gametes in the event of reproduction if the relevant organs are working) or a woman (the kind of human who makes the large immobile gametes in the event of reproduction if the relevant organs are working) is totally irrelevant in almost all circumstances in terms of expectations for how someone will dress or behave, and amyone is totally free to manifest their personality in accordance with the stereotypes associated with the opposite sex if they still want to. In the small number of circumstances where it is necessary to differentiate by sex, transmen are as much at risk as women are, because they are female. Ensuring that protections for women apply for transmen too is important.

Women can't chop their penis off ( as they aren't born with one) Hth the OP.

Been wanting to ask for someone for a while, so this seems like a good opportunity.

What is the difference between "lived experience" and "experience"?

Unscientific, uneducated, illogical, and false crap.
Do better, OP.

A man without a penis is a eunuch not a woman.

Women don't have prostates, men don't have ovaries a womb and a vag. A penis isn't the sole identifier.

There is a lot of 'me, me, me' in your post. The reality is people can self declare as anything they like- the problem is that everyone else has their own autonomy and doesn't have to play along with their delusion. You can tell me you are the opposite sex - nothing can compell me to believe you. I work with a trans woman. She is a very nice person- I am respectful, I call her she and by her chosen name. She isn't a woman she is a transwoman and no one can force me to deny that reality

The truth isn't an ideology. Or is 'the earth is round' also an ideology and denying the earth is flat is deeply upsetting and invalidating to flat earthers so we should just say the earth is flat to keep them happy while denying the truth - that it is round.

Of course gender questioning people are struggling- they've been lied to and had their delusions cruelly affirmed, and now they're being forced to face reality. It's like a child who wants to be a bird being assured, by adults too scared to upset them, that they'll sprout wings on their 18th birthday, and waking up to find they still have no feathers. It's far, far worse than if everyone had just supported them to deal with the truth in the first place.

It is having one's lived experience denied that is responsible for the psychological trauma. It is bring gaslighted about the most fundamental aspect of one's being. Everytime the wrong pronoun is used, everytime a gender designation appears on an identity document that conflicts with an individuals innate experience of themself, everytime the individual has to walk into a changing room, public toilet, or hospital ward that conflicts with their innate experience of themself, every time they are referred to by a given name that conflicts with their innate experience of their self, a transgender person is being gaslit and emotionally abused.

Good grief! And I thought I was sensitive. Nobody likes to be called things they did not choose themselves, yet it happens every day. You cannot control what other people say, what they call you or how they see you. It's sucks, but that is the reality for us all.

I am also baffled by the astounding hypocrisy. So it's fine for them to demand we use chosen names, pronouns and nouns for them. However, if we object (and even if we don't) to being called terms such as "cis", "uterus-haver", "terf", etc, then we are the "violent", "hateful" "bigots". I am sure I have forgotten a few epithets, but I no longer care.

I am done catering to violent narcs.