To give up work due to nursery bugs?!

[MimosasInFrance]

DH and I both have high stress jobs with a lot of responsibility. We earn the same amount, and we both work 4 days a week - meaning our 13 month old goes to nursery 3 days a week, with each of us covering a other day. This seemed a sensible balance when we were planning.

Since our baby started nursery in November we have all been constantly sick. I was expecting this to some extent, but it is just so much worse than I anticipated. There has not been a single day since November where we have felt well. We've all been on antibiotics for various infections. Tonsillitis. Heavy colds and flu, fever almost weekly. Vomiting bugs. Virtually every week he's sent home with something, that we then get. We've both had so much time off work. We have flexible employers, but at the end of the day we have jobs to do and it doesn't feel like we can do them if we carry on like this. I also have a terminally I'll mum they I basically cannot see because I can't risk passing on any illnesses, and we are never without them.

DS is absolutely miserable. Separation anxiety has kicked in as well, made worse by the sickness. He won't eat a lot of the time because he's unwell. People tell me that nursery is good for him, but I feel like I'm doing the wrong thing by him and I feel absolutely awful.

I just feel absolutely on my knees with it all and genuinely do not see how this can continue. Does it improve?? I know it's particularly bad right now because it's winter. But right now I feel like I'm failing at work and as a parent.

I genuinely am considering handing in my notice. We'd manage, although it wouldn't be ideal financially by any means. I also am not sure about taking myself out of the workforce in terms of future career. Plus we want another baby at some point (seems mad right now!!!) and I have good maternity leave currently. I can't really drop my hours further.

Can someone who has been here before offer any wisdom?

Pros and cons to this one. Our older was in nursery 6 months to age 4.5. She got sick a week a month (average) from age 1 to 3, from October to March. Then it got better. It started being more like 2 days length not a week of sickness. Now she’s in school and she’s barely sick at all, if she is, it lasts a day and we’ve missed one day this entire school year. Her friend stayed home, so no nursery and has been sick every week pretty much since school started. Her mum is pulling her hair out over it. Personally, I’d suffer through it now. I also work an intense job so I get how hard it is to be off all the time and for it to be unpredictable. Having a sympathetic employer is pretty critical. Good luck.

It is tough those first 6 months or so, and as others have said, in the winter it’s much worse. I remember my GP saying that it will be tough now but once they start school they won’t be off much as they will have built up a lot of immunity. And this was largely true, bar a few bugs. I had to work though, if you can manage without maybe worth considering.

Mine weren’t constantly sick, and we didn’t catch much at all. Maybe give it another month, spring will bring less bugs.

For me it’s also the setting (hygiene there or do they allow sick kids), and/or what you do at home. Do you all take multivitamins, wash hands etc.
my 3 year old has been at a childminder’s since hr was 1 and at preschool for last 6 months and he hasn’t been ill as often as your DC. Maybe in 2 years we took 3-5 days total between us.
mostly he has had minor colds.

for me giving up work would be the absolute last resort that I would only consider in a very serious situation. Consider making other changes first.

I think you have made an excellent choice of both working 4 day weeks so I don't like the idea that you would now fall into the trap that so many women have before you by giving up pension savings, career progression, and a complete CV by stopping working. I think you should continue on the more equal path you are on and do 2.5 days each per week or just soldier on and wait for this period to be over, because it will be.

Power through to October and see how things are

HOWEVER.....I am surprised that the adults in the house are getting SO poorly all the time

In my experience that doesn't happen

I'd look at boosting your and your husband immune systems

It does get better. But let your Dh give up work, not you.

Hang on in there!

Our DC1 started nursery at 10 months at the end of summer. That autumn/winter they were off 5 times with bugs (so one of us had to stay at home with him) and each time we would get ill afterwards (so more time off). I remember being on the phone to my manager in April during bug number 5 and crying that I just wanted to come to work but was too ill. Luckily I had a supportive boss and it did get better the 2nd year.

DC2 didn't have it as extremely as DC1 (probably because they caught DC1's bugs before they started nursery). As primary kids they are rarely ill.

Keep going, and try not to beat yourself up about it.

A high pressure job with lots of responsibility (ie you HAVE to be there for your team) means a nursery isn’t compatible. I tried nursery for a short while but eventually realised it wasn’t feasible (when dd had to stay home with a gunky eye for three days) so I got a nanny.

Agency did admin and tax : cost a bomb but you’ve got to look at the 10-15 year picture of staying in your profession, not just 5 years, you might even end up working for “free” for a short while. My mum said she used to lose money working in the school holidays when we were young but it was worth it as she had a thriving career until she retired.

The final straw was two different family members (psychiatrist and child psychologist) showing me the research that nursery offers no benefit to under twos (and arguably under threes) . They begged me to get a nanny for child development reasons; I ended up getting one because my life just became so much easier!

my younger dc who did not go to nursery until they were three did not have any extra sick days than other children when they started (maybe 4 days off in a whole year?) and no more sick days than my dc who was in nursery and had been constantly sick. It really depends on the child and the family.

One academc article I read completely debunked the idea that getting repeatedly ill as an infant and toddler produces a robust immune system - it just results in a child that is worn out and run down. At least living in London they get exposed to enough bugs and viruses just going on the crowded bus and shops to stimulate the immune system (which is essential) - they just don’t need to be exposed to illness on a daily basis in crowded nursery conditions.

oh - and pay for a private chicken pox vaccine! That’ll save you at least a week off work.

I have been there and sorry to say my journey ended up very hurtful for my son and for us emotionally. My son was doing 4 full days. Then I took a break of few months, gave him time to recover, then started with 3 half days and I was surprised to see how less / negligible time he fell sick then. We are currently onto 3 full days in nursery and 2 days with nanny at home. She takes him to park/ library for at least a half day when I am wfh. So he also likes it.

I really second a childminder. My DC’s are very different but both of them hated nursery and so ended up going to a childminder and really thrived. I also genuinely felt like they came home with far less bugs. Once DC1 was 3 they went to nursery and coped with it so much better.

To be honest I found that everyone around me always vehemently told me that nursery was a good thing for them but my instinct told me that they hated it. The second they got settled in with a good childminder we all breathed a sigh of relief!

I felt like giving up work too, and I would absolutely hate to be a SAHM. It just felt impossible, we were all ill all the time and I was getting depressed.

It really does get better, I promise. By April it should have vastly reduced. Next winter will probably be a bit germy, but then you'll be fine. And when the second comes along you probably won't catch everything because you've just had it.

I swore by a daily concoction of vitamins - no idea if it helped but I did feel brighter and seemed to dodge a few illnesses. I took high dose vitamin D, a multi vitamin, vitamin C, and echinacea as soon as I started to feel sniffly. Also Yakult - I doubt it does anything but it helped me remember to take the tablets with it. I am prone to being low in vitamin D so tbh that was probably the only useful one.

If course if you really want to leave work (and I understand the separation anxiety is hard as well as the illness), you need to consider how long that's for and if you're happy for your career to take the hit. Will you be able to find a flexible job when you go back? Will you stay off until your second is at school? That's a long career break. And if they don't catch illnesses in nursery, they catch them in school which isn't ideal.

Personally I think we should take the Scandi approach, and fund someone being off with the baby until 2.5ish. They're a bit more resilient and the illnesses don't hit so hard, and there's a definite benefit to socialising at nursery. Obviously we don't have the money for that, but I think it would be best for everyone.

Spring / summer will be better. Look into an au pair.

We decided that I would stay home until youngest is in school (here's that 6 years old). They are currently 4.5 and 2, and I said recently to DH how much easier it is that I'm at home right now (we've gone from a horrible virus to tummy bug to strep a ... In a row)
I think there's no right answer. If you love your job and it serves as a break, I'd find a way to push through. But if could picture yourself a Sahm for a few years, go for it.

We also have to be careful but it's temporary. And it makes life easier for now

It gets better. First winter is the worst and we’re almost out the other side of that now. I remember thinking the same with my eldest, couldn’t believe no-one had warned me about it. He is four now and has the strongest immune system!

Hi, firstly I’m really sorry to read how poorly you have all been, that sounds really tough.

I’m a SAHM (previously a Reception teacher and EYFS leader of almost 10 years). I have a DS (6) and DD (3). I chose to send both to the fantastic Nursery which is next door to their Reception class for 3 hours per day from the term after their third birthday. This has worked really well for both in terms of illness. They get ill occasionally, but nowhere near to the extent of those of friends who attended as babies/toddlers for much longer hours. As you describe, they seemed to pick up stomach bugs, eye infections, chest infections, hand foot & mouth, etc almost constantly. Really tough. Once they hit 3 they are far more capable of learning how to properly wash their hands and their immune systems are better developed generally to cope.

In my opinion and based on my extensive studying of children aged 3-7 at Cambridge, the benefits of socialising for children under 3 at Nursery are hugely over-exaggerated. It is really during the Reception year that many children move from solitary/parallel/associative play to more co-operative play, so definitely don’t worry about that if you remove your son. There are plenty of baby/toddler groups available for social interaction together out in the community as well.

As an ex-teacher I never worry about not being able to re-join as there’s such a shortage. I keep my hand in with being a governor and reading volunteer. Your industry may be different. It is also perfectly understandable to want to continue a career you have worked hard at, enjoy and are passionate about. To temporarily ease your situation in that case, I would suggest switching your son to a family member, child minder or nanny, where he would be exposed to less children and therefore less germs, and possibly a quieter home environment with more time and space to rest/sleep more easily when ill. Also try to keep his evenings/weekends quieter with plenty of time for R & R.

I wish you well and really hope things improve.

I also think you should wait a while longer and see things improve in Spring. My DD started nursery 2 days a week last May at 13 months, she had a lot of coughs and colds to begin with and then it calmed down but this winter has been brutal. It's one cold after another since November; we've also had strep throat, a vomiting bug and currently chicken pox 😷

Winter is the worst for bugs! I'm hoping by next Winter her immune system is a bit more robust. DH and I don't catch all her germs but often one of us is under the weather- it's so tiring and boring! I also feel shit about missing work but they understand its an unavoidable situation and will get better 🤞

My girl loves nursery now so much, it's a pleasure dropping her off and seeing her run in excited. I think your boy will too- and it sounds like you have a great work/baby balance, I think its worth preserving a while longer. Good luck and solidarity!

As others have said, definitely get a nanny until he’s about 2.5-3. The financial hit/admin will be less than you giving up your job!

Advantages are (1) much much fewer bugs as not constantly mixing with other sick kids and (2) even if he does get ill, you won’t need to take time off work to look after him. There are no benefits whatsoever to nursery for a child of 13 months.

Also strongly disagree with the immune system thing. My kids had a nanny until they went to preschool at 3. They got far far fewer bugs at 3 than my friends’ kids who started at 1 as they’re just more robust by then. You can’t build up immunity to most common viruses anyway, so better to save all of you 2 years of colds, flu, vomiting, hand foot and mouth and that’s before you get on to nits and threadworms!

I remember this so well when my DS started kindergarten! He or I or both were always sick. But it settled down.

Please don't give up your job.

Just to give you an idea by way of comparison, neither of my kids have ever had antibiotics, my 4yo (who has been at preschool for a year) has never had a vomiting bug or a day off preschool, neither of them have ever had HFM, DC1 who is now in year 2 has had 3 days off school in the 2.5 years he’s been there. I can’t remember his nursery year well but he definitely had 1 vomiting bug.

Being constantly ill is not something that you have to suck up or inflict on your baby.

Don’t give up! It will pass! We had the same with my eldest and then our twins, it felt constant. Luckily we had flexible and understanding employers who knew we were hard workers and not taking the mick. I know some people aren’t as lucky but it sounds like yours are similar to ours.

i went part time when my eldest was born and he really struggled to settle at nursery, I definitely considered giving up some days due to the seperation anxiety. Now 8 years on with everyone in school I’m going back to full time and earn double what I did when I went on that first Mat leave, I’m so pleased I stuck with it.

it’s a really difficult time OP but you will get there, good luck with it all!

Childminder all the way!!!!! Nursery's are just disgusting germ pits, I had the pleasure of constant illness for a year when our Childminder gave up her job, nursery was our only option at the time and if I could have then I would have quit my job too because the sickness was just awful!

Having had one child who was in nursery at (actually well before) 13 months and one who wasn't, I think there are huge benefits to nursery at that age.

If your kids never went to nursery, what are you basing this opinion on?

Firstly, I do actually think this winter has been the worst for years - mostly because it's the first year when we've completely dropped covid precautions such as isolation, school/nursery closures etc. Our immune systems have been so protected we haven't got the immunity we needed. So yes this winter has been tough.

It's so tough but it always happens when children first come together with large groups - whether that's nursery, toddler groups, or school when they eventually start. This is ultimately good for him long term, even though it would feel like anything but at the moment.

ive had Nannie’s and I don’t really understand the admin worry. They make your life so much easier than nursery! And much better for a young child but that’s just my opinion.

My daughter is also 13 months and has been going to a childminder for a few months, she not been sick since she started once- until this when she caught the flu from her dad!