To be so worried after ds's first parents' evening and want to move schools?

[Nant90]

I need to get some perspective and advice following ds's first parents' evening last week. I'm sorry it's long and thank you to anyone who does get to the end.

He is in reception and, if relevant, his birthday is coming up so around middle in terms of age. He didn't go to preschool as I was on maternity leave and then dh is sahd. He had been in nursery one day a week to give dh and then me a break and loved it. Then when he went up to the preschool room he just didn't seem happy. He and didn't ever seem to be playing with anyone when we picked him up so we took him out. Now I wonder if that was a huge mistake. He was not in any educational setting for the 6 months leading up to starting school.

This may make me sound like an arse, but I do believe ds is very bright. He is so articulate and never stops talking at home. Friends (with dc of similar ages) and relatives are always commenting on his vocabulary and ability to hold a conversation. Being read to is his favourite thing and he is forever asking questions I don't know the answer to, so we look them up. I'm not saying he's advanced - I wouldn't really know, but neither do I think he is behind. He can count up to 100 ish and recognises numbers in puzzles etc. My friend teaches his age group and was impressed at him playing I Spy last year as he was blending sounds. He also enjoys documentaries like Walking with Dinosaurs and Planet Earth and talks about what he's seen afterwards. Loves museums and concentrates well and discusses the content. Plays well with friends' children - mainly three children we've known all his life, but does hook up with other kids in playgrounds etc and seems to play well with them too, give or take the odd issue, but nothing that marks him out from other kids I know.

I considered teaching him to read before starting school but he showed no interest whatsoever. He got frustrated and kept saying, 'Just read me the book,' so I thought it was best not to push it and leave it to the experts. As I said, he loves books and adores being read to. He also has no interest in writing but, again, I didn't see the point in pushing it. He's now making slow but steady progress with Biff and Chip after a very shaky start - he's found the whole process frustrating but I did think he was getting there more recently and it does seem to be clicking.

Now we've had the first real parents' evening and I feel so deflated. The focus was on what he can't do and I was shown other children's' art work with their names neatly written on to really make the point clear. I was asked whether we have pencils and paper at home, ffs. They are all ahead of him, apparently. I asked how he is doing socially and the teacher asked ds who he plays with, which was pointless as I ask him that myself all the time - I wanted her opinion. When he gave her a name she said, 'Ah, yes, the other silent one.' I wanted to cry. She then asked whether we talk to him or have the TV up loud all the time - I have done nothing but talk to him ever since he was born and he never stops talking! He only started watching TV when his brother was born and it's limited. Dh and I never watch TV until dc are in bed. She just seemed to be judging us but nothing she said rang true anyway!

It seems he is not thriving there at all and is not showing anything he can do and definitely not learning anything new. To make it worse, the school is in a deprived area and outcomes are below average, yet he is worse than all the other children?! I feel this is worrying for his future and just want to move him.

Dh, who normally thinks I worry over nothing, wants to ask for a meeting with the other teacher when they go back next week (it's a 3-2 job share and we saw the one who does 2 days) and go from there. I just want to move him.

Any thoughts would be great - I just feel we're letting him down in leaving him there.

I also think it’s easy for SAHPs to overlook how much screen time their kids really get. At nursery they don’t have any. At home it’s easy to fall into a pattern of an hour in the morning, an hour after lunch, an hour before tea, then that’s 3 hours a day. That’s time spent not playing or using fine/gross motor skills.

What a nasty and unhelpful response. The teacher was very unprofessional comparing him to other children and showing you their work. She was also wrong to immediately make assumptions about the reasons he might be having difficulty ( plonked in front of TV at home) she could have asked what he enjoys doing at home instead. My granddaughter is bright and had very good language skills when she started school. At the first parents evening my daughter learned that she had never spoken a word in school and they were concerned about language delay. I would email and ask for a meeting with both teachers. I would say you were concerned he might be having difficulty settling in as he’s very different at home from what was described. I do agree with the posters suggesting you help with fine motor skills. Is this a very large school? If things aren’t improving by the summer I would consider moving him.

When did I work there? 3 years ago, I work in the same trust and am aware that things are worse now than when they were then.

the fact that you think parents who can’t afford breakfast are spending money on pens and paper is laughable. Seriously. You don’t spent money on pens and paper when you’re budgeting for food! Is that really what you said? And you’re wrong. A box of cereal is less than pens and paper.

@100A Your post "this child will struggle every day of his life" made me smile ruefully. I know two parents who were told their sons were educationally subnormal aged five/six (they did move schools as a result) Both boys ended up with Firsts from Oxford in Humanities subjects.
But in both cases the parents intervened to stop the damage done by negative school atmosphere and moved schools. And intervened to support their sons in other holistic ways they might have not first anticipated.

Hi ya OP I’ve only read the first page so apologies if I am reiterating what has already been said. I work in a college and the spectrum of students is huge. Education at school level is very ridged and it doesn’t suit everyone. He sounds like a perfectly happy and bright young boy. Please don’t beat yourself up over this, he is still so young. It’s natural to feel a sense of guilt but at this point In his life there are no red flags. I think you should talk to his other teacher and hopefully put your mind at rest. Remember everyone is different and learn things at different speed.

Oh bless you. You are exactly describing my son at that age. I remember leaving parents evenings in a flood of tears and sick with worry. He was as bright as a button on facts and interests (so many) but his writing was a problem until year 5 and teaching him to read was incredibly hard. Several nursery staff suggested he might be on the spectrum due to his specific interests and social skills. He became popular in secondary school and has not had any issue making friends or fitting in since. Socially primary school was a bit harder for him. We put in a lot of work as reading and writing just didn't come naturally. We had to guide him and help him through primary and secondary school (average student) but all the work and support paid off and he just finished his first year of his Engineering degree and is top of his year.

To be honest - and this won’t be popular I’m sure - id move him just because the teachers are in a job share. I don’t think; in a deprived area where children would likely benefit from a really consistent, solid start at school; at a very young age - that this is ideal. Id be looking for what I felt was ‘ideal’ rather than settling.. you feel he isn’t thriving; trust your gut x

I think it's worth mentioning that many families in low income brackets take great care over homework because they realise the value of it.

Kids are complicated beings designed to cause us maximum worry.

My DD could barely speak when she started reception and they were always expressing concerns about this or that. Now she is predicted straight A’s (7, 8 and 9) in her GCSEs and is an all round brilliant person,

Give him time and don’t worry.

You going to move them every time there’s a job share? My daughter is in year 7. During her time at primary she had job share in year 2 and year 6. Both SATs years so years that are considered important. It was fine. Son has had job share in year 2 and will in year 4. Meanwhile other local primary he would have had job share in reception and then never again. All primary schools will have a job share year at some point. It works fine. What doesn’t work is changing your kids school repeatedly.

Lesson learned that you shouldn't look down on deprived families 🙄.

I also think it sounds like the teacher is a bit tone deaf and I would be disappointed with the communication from them - in the parents’ evening itself - saying ‘the other silent one’ is not appropriate or professional and the fact you’ve not had anything raised by her with you prior to the parents’ evening. That would also concern me to be honest, aswell as the fact it was only with one of the two teachers. If they’re job sharing and there’s concerns about a child, I’d like expect them to both be present for clear communication about it all. Lots of luck x

I think the teacher was being overly harsh and certainly judging you, as well as unfairly judging your son. Teachers should state what the child has achieved and suggest next steps you can help him with, rather than pointing out what he can't do. I suspect he's not the only child in the class at a similar level - there will be able/ more advanced children in any school and it's not really fair to compare your son to them. He's still very young and maybe not ready for much formal learning yet. Or he could have some learning barriers- possibly with regard to reading, that may show up over time.

I doubt these will relate to not spending much time in pre school, and even if they do, he will begin to catch up over time.

I wouldn't move schools at this stage with so little to go on as that will be unsettling for him. Over time, children with several school moves tend to achieve less well.

I find it very uncomfortable that you keep comparing him to children in a deprived area as if you expect he should be better than them.
As a teacher you should realise that actually some children in the most deprived areas will have a lot of parental support plus they are also likely to have attended pre school and had that interaction in a formal setting.
The teachers do not know you personally and will not know your background. They might be wanting to help by asking if you have resources at home.

It sounds like you wanted to enjoy your time with your son and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this. You have however mentioned that when trying to read or write with him, he didn't like that, so you instead followed his interests. Again nothing wrong with this at all, but could be why he now finds it hard when at school he cannot avoid the tricky stuff and is behind as he hasn't been pushed to do this at pre school and is only encountering this now. His peers may have shown similar behaviour, but had time to overcome this in preschool.

Definitely ask to meet with the other teacher and speak to them about your concerns that he is not where he should be and what you can do to help him.

@Ritzybitzy Sorry to tag you again but you have posted quite a bit and are clearly pushing the idea that the teacher thinks ds may have SEND. The thing is though, I would absolutely have been receptive to this had she clearly stated, 'We have some concerns about x, have you noticed that he...?' and discussed it in a professional way. But I want to make it clear that she did not do that. All she did was make disparaging remarks, compare him unfavourably to others and imply that he is behind, not because of SEND, but because we haven't interacted with him or provided any of the resources he needs to learn. If she had SEND concerns, why didn't she raise those properly, especially after we confirmed that he has access to paper and isn't plonked in front of the telly all day? If he has SEND I need to know and want to know, but I don't see how someone who spends two days a week with him, doesn't seem interested him, and didn't actually mention it would be the one to identify it.

I will see what the other teacher says though and will definitely be engaging with them if they think something additional is going on.

No not every time there’s a job share; but when it’s their first year of school, in a difficult patch, in a deprived area; I would find it less than ideal.

If it helps, my daughter was described as 'mute' by her reception teacher at the first parent's evening. She then went on to say she had heard her talking to friends though. I knew she was shy but this still worried me a bit.

At the next parent's evening I was told she never stopped talking. It seemed the teacher hadn't thought about how her words might worry me. She had no concerns at all. My DD is just shy with people she doesn't know and takes half a term or so to get used to a teacher.

Please ignore the post commenting you did something wrong by keeping him at home. You know your son best - you are his mum. Whatever you do or don't do, someone will criticise and just impose their own experience. You did what felt right for you and your family and provided age appropriate responsive activities at home. He is 4 and sounds absolutely lovely - he knows his own mind and interests so you have responded to that at home and helped him learn through play and his interests. You're already fostering a love of reading if he enjoys being read to! The problem is the expectations of our rigid education system and I guess he isn't fitting into their particular boxes at the moment - but he's only 4!! If he's settled and happy the rest can come with time.

It sounds an awful and unprofessional parents evening experience and that would be my main concern!! It's actually unbelievable!!!

Absolutely I would be requesting a meeting.
What exactly are their concerns and what additional support are they suggesting he requires in the classroom? If you're still not happy request to meet with the head.

I would want to know more about them describing him as 'silent' as ?is he experiencing some anxiety in school which equates to not speaking.

It’s possible that is why he’s behind though so it’s a fair comment - I know you’ve talked a lot about what you and him have done but there’s no discussion from you at all that relates to successful independent socialisation or any real independent anything. You’ve described very fixed controlled socialisation, a lack of resilience, possibly controlling behaviours from him and refusal to engage in things he does not enjoy or finds difficult. Given his background it is hard to know if that’s SEN or lack of opportunity to develop the appropriate skills.

Job shares are not ideal at all, are either of them NQTs ? My sons first school had no tas, half the teachers were nqts and had no support at all, it was made an academy in year one, the brilliant Head moved into the academies leadership team and away from the school. My son is now 14 and we took him out in year three (far too late but I was very invested in the school and trying to make it better). They are now on their seventh or eighth Head, the results have dropped year on year and unless you were higher achieving or SEN, you were completely overlooked. They just wasn’t the resources for the amount of children and little teaching support. In my sons class of 31 only 10 original children left in year 6

He might be advanced, how do you know?
My son was written off by teachers who focused on the fast readers and writers in the class butt he caught up and got a good degree, he didn't learn to read until he was 7.

Many decades ago my mother was berated by my sisters teacher because my mother hadn't done anything about my sister being deaf and mute. My sister was far from deaf and certainly not mute. she didn't like the teacher therefore refused to speak to her.

I agree with others that you need to arrange a meeting with the other teacher (ideally, both the teachers if possible). I don’t think it’s appropriate for the teacher to have been showing you other children’s work, and ideally they should have spoken to you before if your DC isn’t where they would like him to be. I wouldn’t pull him out at this stage but I would be asking what you can work on at home with him, within reason, as Year 1 is a big step up (but is also six months away).

I note you say the only settings DS has struggled with are preschool and now, seemingly, school. That suggests that he may be adapting to being in a setting without a parent. If he’s managing his feelings around that at a later stage than is typical, that could be a factor.

I wouldn’t be put off by it being a job share - I have a DC in reception with two teachers job sharing and we had parents evening with the one who is there on fewer days. She was very switched on and everything she said about our child sounded in line with what we would have expected. Good job share partners hand over and compare notes in advance of parents evening.

Someone up thread had some good suggestions of questions to ask, such as how he seems socially, whether he’s interested in engaging with other children, and whether he’s compliant. I’d also ask directly whether they feel there is something else going on or whether they think he’s just adapting to a school/classroom environment.

I haven’t read every reply but one thing I would say is that some schools are quite happy to allow children not to fully showcase their abilities at this stage, as they are then able to mark them down as having made greater progress (which I believe can secure more funding). My older DC was like this in nursery and reception - we were told at his first nursery parents evening that “we know he can count to 5”. I had to explain that he could actually count past 30 and that they should push him a little to show them what he could do.

Also - does he seem happy about going to school? Does he go in without tears and does he seem ok coming out?

Hi OP,
you didn't do anything wrong in not putting him in pre school or nursery - I also took my first child out of pre school because he didn't enjoy being away from me. He missed me, I missed him. He did start going in for 3 mornings a week but I took him out after about a month. I ignored everyone who said to me 'he'll never socialise...he'll never settle at school..'. I often felt it was odd that people were so invested in it, like I was just sat in doors doing nothing and going nowhere. I think that's what people think when you don't take them to preschool. Anyway, my second child went in and loved it, so it depends on your child and your circumstance. The problem we have is that because so many parents send their children to nursery from such a young age, schools expect them to be at a certain level of independence. So it becomes that our children are 'wrong' rather than 'this is exactly how children are meant to be when they aren't in a pre school setting'. Sometimes they take a little longer to settle and that is absolutely fine. As I said, my son is 10 and absolutely fine, more than fine, in fact. I think the teacher is out of order actually, mentioning his writing - my youngest is nearly 5 and I just had her parents evening - she said her letters were backwards but that was quite normal, and she needed to work on her letter formation at home, which we are doing. But it was all very upbeat and I don't believe for a second that your son's school friends are all writing neatly...that's just rubbish talk. They are so young and all developing differently. PS your son could be extremely bright still - my son is very bright and top marks at recent sats mocks, but his writing is still messy so that isn't a test of intelligence. Oh and also, he was always very quiet and still is when he is with others, not at home though.