Unwanted potential guest...please help!

[TrickySituation22]

Me and my partner live with my adult daughter. We let our spare room to my partner's longstanding mate who is single, but always hoping for a girlfriend, he's late 30's now, let's call him Ray.
Ray is fine but sometimes give me the ick when he's overtly sexual and crude over his comments about women on TV etc.
He met a woman a few years ago who had been with her partner for 10+ years, and he struck up a friendship with her. However we have never met her as she refused all invitations to our home or to meet up elsewhere. She also used Ray for lifts to the airport when holidaying with friends, for work done to her car and for meals out etc, he paid for everything. He did all this in the hope of getting closer to her (basically he said he wanted to have sex with her) despite the fact that she was with a partner and kept Ray strictly in the friendzone.
Today my partner has announced that Ray has called him and this woman has now split up with her long-standing boyfriend and has nowhere to go and will be coming to live with us until she can find somewhere. Ray says she will be sleeping in his room, but as friends.
No discussion, just presented to me and my daughter as a fait accompli.
My daughter and I are not happy, she's a complete stranger and Ray works away during the week so we would be here alone with her. Apparently according to Ray she has a lot of 'issues' and is going to find it very difficult finding a place a living on her own as she's not a 'coper'.
We've told my partner we don't want it because she sounds like a user and hasn't wanted to meet us before. Plus there's no room for her car and I work from home.
My partner is now embarrassed as we've messaged on our home group chat to the effect that we are not happy about this decision and he is saying in that case no one can stay, not even my daughter's boyfriend, nor any of my friends, ever, not even for one night.
We've been happy to have other friends of Ray's stay the odd night before, guys we have known.
Am I being unreasonable thinking this is an unfair request? We did say one or two nights would be ok but then she'd need to have concrete plans.

If Ray is paying a quarter of rent and bills, just like everyone else, then it’s as much his house as it is yours and you can’t stop him having a guest to stay in his room. Just like he can’t stop you or your daughter having guests.

You’ve messed up by not having him there as a lodger paying what a lodger would pay. Instead, you had him move in and split all the rent and bills equally between you. It’s his home.

Sad thing is, he doesn’t have any more rights than a lodger so you could kick him out tomorrow and you can refuse a guest. But he shouldn’t be paying the same amount that you pay.

What the fuck? Mumsnet is insane sometimes but this… what the fuck?

He can't move anyone in for whom it will be their only residence, whether that's for a day or a month.

I'm still struggling to work out (irrespective of legal or contractual issues) if the house is viewed as a house-share, or a family home with a lodger. But either way, any new residents should surely need unanimous agreement first?

The crux of this is you’re living like 4 housemates, so your partner’s logic is sound in that regard. You all split all bills equally, rent equally, you are equal housemates in all relevant ways.

Essentially, you have sub-let half of the house to someone of your choice and he’s done the same. So he wants everyone to be treated fairly and have equal say in house rules/what is acceptable.

Except nobody IS getting an equal say. OP’s partner decided it would be okay for Ray to move this woman in - and when OP objected, he unilaterally declared that no one could have visited. Several posters have said that OP’s partner views this as a house share, rather than Ray being the lodger. But actually, he’s behaving like OP and her daughter and lodgers too.

OP - ask yourself whether you and your partner are really on the same page. You describe him as your daughter’s stepfather. He’s acting like her landlord - and, I’m afraid to say, yours.

OP’s daughter isn’t a child. She’s an adult who contributes towards the rent. She could just as easily be living with “unrelated males” in a house share.

There's a difference between a guest staying over and someone moving in!

If Ray had a steady girlfriend with her own place and wanted her to stay over once a week, that might be fair enough.

But he's asking if this woman can MOVE IN. And from what he's said it sounds like she would never leave, as she won't have anywhere to go.

If Ray pays the same share of rent then he is entitled to the same benefits.

Op wants to have the best of both worlds and that isn't how the world works.

If he’s not on the tenancy agreement he has no entitlement. Lots of people charge their lodgers more than half the rent, for example. My ex neighbour used to charge his lodger more than the rent of the property. Outrageous but people do it.

I think the point that’s been mentioned several times over is that if this woman moves in then the house becomes a large HMO and there are all kinds of rules and regs that would come into play. She only really has to point this out and problem solved - although not the problem of her shitty partner.

But that is how the law works.
He isn't on the tenancy agreement.

Christ, why are people defending Ray the incel?

Thank you.... it's fucking bizarre.

Tell the LL that you do not want a house of 5 with a deeply unstable woman.

Your partner is a nasty prick and both he and Ray have zero respect for you.

Time to rethink this relationship BUT be clear, she is NOT moving in.

At the crux of it, despite whether Ray is a weirdo, her DP is a twat, her daughter is an adult and can leave or stay or is in danger or not

The house will become a large HMO putting all of them and their landlord at risk. It's just dodgy through and through legally before you get to the social aspect

Yes, if Ray wanted tenant’s rights, he’d need to sign a lease with the landlord and he’d take on tenants’ responsibilities as well. He presumably hasn't paid a deposit or provided references, for example, and can move out anytime. So there’s pros and cons to his position.

Essentially, the OP and her partner are his “landlords” so if the OP doesn’t want his partner moving in, he can’t do it. Why her partner thinks it’s a good idea is a mystery.

Plus the actual landlord will probably object so it’s a non-starter anyway.

I also have an adult daughter and no way would I knowingly want her to live with two unrelated and much older men where one makes odd sexual remarks. If she moved out she could end up in a house share but most likely with people her own age where she isn’t perceived as a younger vulnerable woman. I just don’t see how any parent could want this situation, especially since it was once just her and her dd’s home and now when the others are ganging up on them they are going to be in minority in their own home.

Euw. This is all so grim. Your poor daughter living with your boyfriend, his sex-addict friend and his female friend with "issues". Get yourself off the lease and find a 2 bed flat for you and your daughter.

No tenant has the right to move in an extra tenant without everyone else agreeing. Nobody at all has this right if the landlord doesn't agree.

No, he’s not. He’s a lodger - and lodgers don’t have the same rights as tenants. He isn’t on the tenancy agreement so technically OP and her DH are his landlords. The way the law works is that if there are two separate households totalling five or more people (which is the case if this woman moves in) living in the same house, then it becomes a HMO. The actual landlord would have to agree it and make sure the property complied with the rules concerning HMOs.

It will create an unlicensed house of multiple occupation. At the moment Op, partner and dd create one family unit, and Ray is additional. If the female friend comes too they will be 3 or more unrelated people, and the landlord could be in serious trouble if they don't have a licence.

Where we are an HMO licence is virtually impossible to obtain and had totally different legislation regarding fire safety etc which costs on average £1k per year.

I would suggest the op argues her position from that point of view.

I wouldn't want to house share with someone in the op's circs.

Op and her partner (people on the lease) have taken in Ray as a lodger. It doesn't matter how much he pays. He has very little rights. He certainly has no vote in who lives in the property, or who can stay overnight. Op's daughter is part of their family unit.
Regardless of that, if Ray moves in this woman, sharing the same room, they become another household and the property becomes an unlicenced HMO. That could cause huge problems for the landlord.
It's really simple when you split out the facts from what some MN'ers imagine, or their personal views of what is legal and fair.

He’s not in the lease though. So that’s not true.

However, in some ways that makes it more difficult for op as she has no legal mechanisms to remove him, if that’s what she wants to do. It all gets very murky

OP and her DP do corporately have a legal mechanism to remove him. He us a lodger, he has no tenacy rights and can simply be given "reasonable" notice (undefined but a month woukd be fine) and he would have to go. The police would assist if an unwanted person with no tenacy rights is refusing to leave a property they have no right nto inhabit.

OP's problem is her arsehole of a DP who wants to put his friend Ray's wellbeing above his girlfriend's. The DP isn't going to be negotiated into becoming a non-arsehole so extensive heartache about the Ray situation is irrelevant. The relationship is doomed and OP's efforts should be focused more on how to move on.

All this chat about legal issues around tenancy or lodger is irrelevant. One of the tenants wants creepy git and his non girlfriend to move in.

OP needs to find somewhere else to live where she’s not putting up with this shit from her DP.

Update:
I've decided to end my relationship with DP. His behaviour over this has undoubtedly been the deciding factor, though there have been multiple other crap behaviours as well. The more I reflect and look over my diaries I see how unhappy I've been with him.
I actually feel pretty good about it, so evidently I don't have much, if any, love left for him.
I've not told him yet as he's been ignoring me for the last couple of days, demanding an 'apology' from me because I have gone against his wishes and 'haven't learned my lessons' !! FFS!
My daughter and I will remain in the house and the two males can go.
I really want to thank all you lovely people for your comments, support, insights and advice xx