To hate that funerals take place weeks after the death?

[Bloodybrambles]

I have the funeral of a parent this week. They had organised every part of their funeral and as their death was expected, there wasn’t no postmortem. However, between the funeral directors, the church and the crematorium, the earliest date we could have was just under a month.

As my parent had been ill for quite a few months, I had to put life on hold just incase that I was needed/having to do a trips back to my home town. Also didn’t feel in the mood to be living life normally with everything going on.

Life in this country continues after death, back to work, kids needs to be parented, trips to the bowling alley etc. Can’t say life is completely back to normal but I’ve made peace with them passing and it’s no longer consuming my thoughts constantly. I know I’ll never be 100% back to normal but I feel like I’ve been happy again this last week or so. I’ve been singing along to the radio again.

What I feel like I’m dreading is the funeral. I feel like it’s picking at a wound that’s started to heal. My parent wanted a very traditional funeral, no expense spared, very somber, no ‘celebration of life’ type affair. DH says what they’ve asked for is completely normal, for people to be sad and mourn for them.

I’m just rambling now, but I wish we could have had this in the first week. I’ve already had to make peace to continue waking up everyday for my family. I don’t want to grieve again, especially in a very public, and ceremonial type affair.

I know I have to put on my big girl pants and go. This isn’t about me. But if I could choose to have a 24 hour bug I’d take it.

Exactly what RockingRoll says.
And system are in place within Medical Examiner Offices and Registration Offices where it is required to facilitate quick burial.

But it's not our fault. We can get it done quicker because we have everything in place to do so. We aren't responsible for delays in cremation. I personally think it's really sad that there is such a delay in funerals, but it's not the fault of Jewish or Muslim people.

OP, I am sorry you're finding things difficult with regards to the funeral - It's a really stressful time. Our 6 week wait to bury my grandmother was really emotionally draining. Take care of yourself

Wow.

I'm not surprised to read about the various hospital policies. But I am a bit surprised at the ruling against the coroner.

Thanks for these sources.

A few posters on this thread are determined that faith communities don't receive different treatment? Why? They obviously do. Are you worried people will object?

The keywords on those hospital documents make it very clear who they're aimed at.

Of course there could be bottlenecks elsewhere in the system.

I don't understand this comment. The crem knows nothing about it until you book them and you don't book them until you're got the death certificate and have registered the death - noone will do anything until you've registered and have the "green form".

So, no idea why the crem would be charging you. Also, not everyone uses a crem anyway.

6 weeks here and still waiting for a date for SIL funeral to take place!

Agreed - my auntie was 5 weeks after she died. Way too long. Sorry for your loss op

I work in the funeral trade and the most simplistic answer as to why the wait is so long at the moment is due to the sheer number of January deaths. It has been particularly high even by normal winter months

Again - others are welcome to request expedition. So it's not different treatment, we're just taking them up on the offer. And the thing I'm worried about isn't objection but rather this being used as yet another reason to irrationally hate Jews and Muslims. We get enough hate as it is and don't need further misinformation spread about us.

And @TheWordWomanIsTaken I think you're misunderstanding what the ruling was - she was refusing to ever take religion into consideration and the ruling says it shouldn't be a blanket rule to never consider religion when deciding priority. It basically didn't change anything as she's still free to not prioritise people for religious reasons.

"Case analysis
BBC's religious affairs producer Callum May

This case will not set a precedent for coroners across the UK.

Each coroner has discretion over the order in which bodies are released.

In Mary Hassell's case, the High Court decided she was acting unlawfully by refusing to ever consider religion as a reason to prioritise the release of a body."

Anyway, I'm done with this conversation. You've made your point and I've made mine, that others also have a right to request expedition.

It would be incredibly distressing for a Jewish person to have a delayed burial as it is considered a commandment to have a quick burial - although of course we accept postmortem delays. Exactly as Rockingroll says, the community has it's own infrastructure in place for a quick burial and there is no personalisation apart from the eulogy. We have wonderful volunteers who prepare bodies for burial in a religious way and there are no choices to be made - everyone is buried in the same white shroud, the coffin is the same, the service is the same. You're given a time slot and you appreciate it's short notice so some people may not be able to come but everyone rallies round and makes it happen. We then have various mourning rituals for the first 7 and 30 days and longer until the stone setting ceremony 9-12 months later where the grave stone is put in place, which is a chance for everyone to gather again and remember the person who died. There are often memorial prayers at the family home for the first 1-7 days where people share more personal reflections and anyone who couldn't be at the funeral can come to show their support. I found it a relief not having to plan every detail of the funeral. I would have found it so hard to be suspended for weeks waiting to move on so really appreciate how difficult this must be for you.

I'm in Ireland and the funeral is usually about 3 days after death. Can't imagine how difficult the limbo is. My aunt died in England (suddenly) and the wait was 6 weeks. So very hard for the immediate family. It's not right.

My aunt passed on New Years Day. Funeral is on Monday. It's an awful long time to wait.

My condolences OP x

It is absolutely disgraceful to be held in limbo for so long for something as important but still such a common part of civilised society as a funeral.

I don’t think other countries have this issue. How are we going so wrong with basic services such as this? Same with health care, social care and most other government organised services.

It does seem to be only us from conversations I’ve had with friends and family living in other countries and what I have experienced and seen firsthand myself, and has been the same for decades.

My mother's funeral took over a month - but we had a family plot and she was the first, which meant it took longer because they had to dig deeper. But the hole was so huge to look down it sort of put us off using it in future - though we did for Dad, as he went, well, six years later.
It's true that the longer it's left, the more of a wrench it is because for some time close by you do feel that they are still present, but after that it really feels like they are gone - and the funeral represents a second goodbye, one you really don't want.

We got around this the second time by observing that that a funeral by this point is more a chance for the extended family to meet up, something that doesn't happen too often, and chat about stuff, reconnect. For instance, at my mother's funeral, it was silently assumed my Dad would be next to go - in fact it was a much-loved cousin in her early 60s, quite unexpectedly due to a diabetic attack one morning, and within two months. So our mother's funeral had allowed us all to meet her one last time, including her own daughter. We weren't to know that, of course but if Mum had held on for a bit longer, none of that would have happened - well, the death would have presumably, but not the meet up with my cousin, she'd have gone by then too.

So for Dad's funeral and wake at nearby pub, we made it more for the benefit of everyone else, and we sat at the back of the Church in case we broke down, as before.

I'm sorry for your loss.

30 years ago when my grandmother died, the funeral was 4 days later.

15 months ago we waited 16 days for my DM's - and that was fairly quick.

There is a shortage of spaces at the crem, that's it. It's nothing to do with culture, or tradition, it's lack of availability.

I'm in Scotland too. From what I recall we bought the plot from the Council and yes they did supply the diggers. But I see no reason why an approved digger list couldn't be expanded outside Council employees. As I say, perhaps ones provided by undertakers.

I understand what you are saying about requiring a room to carry out the service. But that doesn't really need to be a specific room. An example would be local function suites, for the less religious or less concerned with appearances. They could be used as service rooms.

It does sound like a major lack of capacity Nationwide, solutions should be looked into.

Why do you think Ireland manage to do it so much quicker?

that's it

No. That's partly it.

It's also due to the delay in getting the death certificate. As described by many pp.

Humdingerydoo

I can absolutely assure you I have not misunderstood the ruling and I absolutely know that the policies were changed after it was delivered.

You missed out this bit of the BBC analysis:

The chief coroner for England and Wales has been asked to give advice to Ms Hassell, and for her to consult Muslim and Jewish communities, before drafting a new policy.

Anyway, I'm also done in this conversation with you - you seem to take offence at any post where it is shown that the administration required for religious burials to take place is prioritised.

I'm sure that most people are sympathetic to the need for some groups to bury quickly - I know I am.

I'm just pointing out that this is facilitated where it can be, as it should be.

So long

Apologies if this is an offensive question, it isn't meant that way. With Jews, are the bodies prepared in the same way as what would be considered common among British undertakers? By that I mean the body made presentable and viewed prior.

*medical certificate

The death certificate is after the med cert

I seem to be in the minority but I don’t understand the rush for a quick funeral, unless it’s for religious reasons. I need time to come to terms with the death first. I prefer the thought of the person being here “with us” for a bit longer rather than buried or in an urn.

Not in my experience.

When was your experience? In which country? Multiple pps have posted here about the recent legal changes re medical examinor sign-off

In Bristol there are only 2 crematoria. The population is half a million. There's aways someone departing this world. That's why it takes so long.

The extra checks just came in recently in England. In Scotland they have been around for several years. This coincides with getting rid of the cremation forms. Now the certificates are reviewed at random. Should only add about 24-48 hours to the process though. I think the delays got worse during COVID and a lot of things just haven't gone back to normal. In Scotland with the new checks there were never these delays initially