Sister-in-Law didn’t invite my mother in

[ThatRubyMoose]

I genuinely want people to be honest; I’m interested in what people think.

About four years ago my brother’s partner moved in with him; she has her own business and works from home. Up until then my mother used to go round and clean for my brother (yes I know). My mother also gets a few freebies from her employer so she would leave these in the house.

When his partner moved in, my mother naturally stopped this out of respect for his partner and not to invade her privacy. However, SiL was more than happy to see my mum. She told her to text her when she was going to drop stuff round.

So for four years two or three times a month, Mum sends a text and Sister-in-Law will stop work, make a coffee, elevenses, or lunch depending on what she is doing and they will have a chat. On the back of this, SiL might find out something Mum likes, so they will go to garden centre or stately home together.

So in four years there has been a handful of times when SiL hasn’t been available, either because she will be out, on a zoom etc. and told Mum to leave stuff in porch. All good, no issue.

On Monday evening SiL texts to say she wasn’t available on Tuesday and just leave stuff in porch. Absolutely no issue.

When Mum arrived there were people in the house and a couple of kids running in the hall so my mum knocked on the door a couple of times when finally SiL opens it and seems surprised Mum is there asking her didn’t she get the text asking her to leave the stuff in the porch.

SiL was with her family and didn’t invite my mum in to meet them. As SiL knows my mum is not intrusive and would not have overstayed her welcome. My mum is so upset but we have stopped her ringing Bro.

So essentially my mum was asked to leave stuff in porch but knocked door anyway - would you have done this?

SiL answered but didn’t invite her in. Would you have done this?

I don’t think anyone is in the wrong in all honesty. I understand why your mum might have felt hurt in that moment, but there could be lots of reasons she didn’t invite your mum in which don’t equal any bad feelings on her part. If your mum wants to know why, she could just say “oh I hope you didn’t think I was intruding the other day, did you have a nice time with your family?” To which SIL will most likely explain without anyone getting upset

This seems so minor, I'm not sure why you posted it - especially because, really, what's your goal? Are you hoping that we'll urge you to swoop in and chastise someone? It's momentary, and it's over. No one did anything really wrong, but anyone who felt like apologizing could do so.

Bloody hell - am really surprised by these initial responses!

I think SIL is pretty rude. If your DM is the type to drop in, say hello, I don’t know what the problem is with inviting her in for a quick cup of tea.

i think most people with self awareness would then pop in briefly to say hello and then leave.

If she wanted privacy for her family visit, surely it would’ve been more polite to say I’m not around Thursday - why don’t you bring it on Friday and we can have a coffee

Available just means accessible and so SIL was of course available. She could, in fact, be accessed, she was home. She just wanted her MIL to courier her gift around and leave silently.

SIL was certainly free, available and accessible to talk to her MIL for a moment or two, and we know this because she did.

So, again, unless there is a backstory, more to this for example MIL refusing to rearrange to more suitable times or otherwise being bothersome, SIL's rudeness cannot be justified.

That the SIl was rude is not actually under discussion. She was.

The only question is, did she have a good reason to be rude?

Yes your sil is rude, your mum isn't a stranger to her or your brother. A quick hello and come and say hi to my mum wouldn't have hurt. You can't keep people in boxes forever and not have them cross over to other areas of your life. I do find the British tend to be a bit socially awkward when it comes to this sort of thing.

Available just means accessible and so SIL was of course available.

No, available in this case means "free to chat"

SIL had other guests and was therefore not available

If she's on a Zoom call she's accessible in the house but it's understood she's not available

This is the same

Dear God. SIL asked MIL to leave the freebies in the porch (as she has done before!) because she couldn't see her that day. Yes, SIL does normally appreciate and welcome her MIL and they do things together including having days out, but on this occasion SIL gave MIL forewarning that she wouldn't be available to see her and MIL should have respected that. It's this simple. 🙄

I agree with the first half, but must say that in Scotland, where I grew up, you would have been absolutely torn to shreds by other family members if you treated a family member like this. I remember one Saturday afternoon, when I was about 16, my Uncle Tommy took it into his head to cycle over to see us, without phoning or telling anyone he was coming. I was home and he was most apologetic at turning up unannounced and then he tried to leave as my mum was out and it was really my mum he was coming to visit, and he didn't want to intrude.

I told him not to dare leave, as my mum would be really upset with me, basically dragged him in and made him a cup of tea and got him some biscuits and chatted to him till my mum came home. When he apologised for intruding to my mum said Don't be daft, you're family.

So maybe they're weird about inviting family in, or rude to family in some parts of the UK, but I can't say I encountered that growing up in Scotland.

I think everyone on here questioning MIL's motives is a bit much. On the surface it sounds like a perfectly normal MIL/DIL relationship to me to pop in or go out a few times a month etc, spend a bit of time over a cuppa (or not if SIL is busy and that's fine too), there's nothing wrong with that type of relationship, and if it was like that it would be rude to not invite her inside.

I think it is odd that you SIL wouldn't invite your mum in to meet her family given the opportunity, but then I think it is INCREDIBLY odd that in 4 years none of you have ever met each other and almost exist in a separate universe, and you don't think anything of it??

It actually sounds to me like MIL and DIL have quite the superficial relationship which is based on MIL giving them gifts (what gifts??), but it extends no further than that as far as DIL is concerned? MIL obviously thinks it is based on mutual respect and understanding and DIL has firmly put her back in her place. Does MIL only visit when she has gifts?

If MIL is so upset, why would "we" not let her tell your brother about this, why are you influencing this decision at all, as it doesn't sound like you know SIL or have a close relationship with your brother? So why would she not tell him what happened?

So many questions...

However, she was actually available and accessible and we know this because she did indeed speak rudely to her MIL.

No near to Dear God, it's not that dramatic.

There's no question SIL was rude, that's settled. The only question is whether she had reason to be rude.

Right. The only thing I do wonder is if MIL just announces she is coming and doesn't allow SIl to reschedule, if she is actually imposing on SIL rather than it being a mutual choice.

That's the only real reason I can think of for SIl choosing to be so deliberately rude.

Bloody hell, we don't even KNOW what SIL said but apparently she now "spoke rudely"?

Opening the door and going "Oh thanks Barbara, I'm in the middle of something right now but it was lovely of you to bring this round. I'll see you same time next week and we can catch up." Isn't rude. And it's not being available or accessible

I don’t think it’s wrong for SIL to want to spend time with her own family. Her MIL already knew she was unavailable so why did she knock? Your SIL asserted a boundary and the MIL tried to step over it. The last thing I’d want if say, my sister and the kids had come over for a chat or to discuss a problem, is the MIL showing up uninvited.

Actually, we do know what she said. She "opens it and seems surprised Mum is there asking her didn’t she get the text asking her to leave the stuff in the porch."

But did someone say she spoke rudely? SIL was rude, obviously, that can't be argued, and was in fact available and accessible in order to be rude. I must have missed someone saying she spoke rudely.

Ooops, I see it was me who said it :D Well what I meant was her words were rude. She might have been quite polite in the way she said her rude words though.

It's not dramatic enough to earn a Bloody hell is it? Can't help but hear Ron Weasley when someone says that, these days.

Your mother was not rude.
Your SIL was not rude to ask for the XX to be left on the porch.
We don't know the converstaion.
Your DM might have said that she was driving past that morning enroute to XX and it would be convenient etc. even though SIL was busy.
We don't know exactly why SIL has hidden her family from her firend/MIL. That is the most baffling??
Could be someone having Cancer treatment, or anything.
I can see why SIL was caught off guard but I can also see that she hurt your mother. It was probably not intentional but your SIL hurt her.
I would be proud to introduce my MIL to my family and vis-a-vis.
Sometime in the next few months. MIL should express a interest in meeting her DIL's family and ask her son to arrange for them to have afternoon tea with her when next they are about. She should ask her son to get back, frankly, to her about whether they wish to accept any freebies in future.

You mother needs to be extra sensitive for a while and see how it settles but I hope she gets an apology..

She was available though, and we know that because she answered the door and expressed surprise at the MIL not just couriering the stuff around and silently leaving.

Really, the only thing we need to know is if MIL will allow SIL to reschedule these visits to suit SIL or if MIL just insists on the times she sets.

It may be settled in your mind that SIL was rude, but I think MIL was rude for knocking on her door, twice, when she knew she had company. All MIL had to do was what she was asked to do. God knows why MIL would want to risk losing a perfectly pleasant relationship she's had with SIL for four years by mentioning it to her son. OP needs to tell her mother to calm down, grow up and get over it.

No, it wasn't rude, and cannot be considered rude to knock on a family member's door unless they have specifically told you to stay away. Instead, SIL wanted her to be a silent courier, drop her goodies, then vanish without a word. MIL didn't follow that script. Unexpected, but of course not rude.

Calm down? You mean stop feeling upset? That doesn't usually work does it saying "Have you tried not feeling that way?" Grow up and get over it? You mean, be rude to her mum so as to make her feel worse? I can't imagine that would help the situation at all.

I dare say the mum will get over it in time and yes she should not phone her son, it will only add fuel to the fire.

Interesting you say that. I also grew up in Scotland with Scottish parents. SIL would be considered incredibly rude for this.

is it an English thing to keep all friends, family and acquaintances separate?

MIL is family too.

There’s no way on earth you’d leave people standing on the doorstep in Scotland. I remember neighbours popping round to drop something off when we had visitors. They’d always be invited in, would say hello. They’d always politely leave after a few minutes, but it would’ve been rude for either side not to come and say hello.

I think your mum was pretty rude. She knew your SiL was going to be busy. When she got there she realised your SiL had guests, so it was clear what the being busy meant.

Your mum decided to interrupt that. Once she did, inviting her in would have been polite to her but rude to your SiL’s family who were there, by arrangement, to see SiL. LittleBigHead’s suggestions for how it could have gone are reasonable, but not guaranteed. Your SiL might not think your mum is as unintrusive as you think she is. Especially since she knocked knowing your SiL had said she’d be unavailable.

That's a vague outline of what SIL said. It's not whay she said or presumably all she said...

And YOU literally said she spoke rudely!

She wasn't even rude. MIL was by overstepping the boundary that had been set for that day

Oh just seen your edit

And it warranted it from me.

cannot be considered rude to knock on a family member's door unless they have specifically told you to stay away

It can be considered rude if you've been told to LEAVE THE ITEM IN THE PORCH!

Which she was

She was asked to leave the item because SIL wasn't available

She wasn't available because she had other guests. Being in the house doesn't mean being available. Being able to open the door and give a quick comment doesn't mean you're available. Being family doesn't mean being available

Right, I have been wondering if it is an English thing. My husband grew up in London and would never ever have refused family entrance - but he was raised by irish parents and hung around mainly with Irish ex pats.

Might also be a social class thing. Working class people are generally much kinder, friendlier, more welcoming and generous than social climbing middle classes, and I say that as someone who moved around diferent social classes and countries for many years.

She knocked numerous times so SIL had no choice but to open the door AFTER being told Shevwas NOT available. That is incredibly rude.

Why are you screaming in all caps? How bizzarely triggered you must be.

Nope, can never ever be considered rude to knock on a family member's door unless they have told you to stay away. And that's that :)

And yep she physically materially observably and provably was, in fact, available. And we know this because she spoke to the MIL and sent her packing.

And no matter how much shouting you do, these facts won't change :)

The only reason the SIL could have for being rude to her MIL - and she was irrefutably rude - is if there is a backstory we don't know about.