to think some people think WFH should be a constant nose to the grindstone?

[Yodeloo]

I think some jobs are like that definitely. Heavy workload, helplines etc

Some people think all WFH should be like this and get horrified because someone hung some washing out or helped out a family member for a short time. Plenty of jobs have flexibility and it is about getting the job done not just being present in front of the computer non stop.

I get all my life admin done throughout the day around work. I do an exercise class most mornings and then start work later on the days I WFH. I will meet up with friends, work on my side business. Nobody cares at my work. All targets are met consistently.

Is it jealousy that people get so upset?

You've described jobs that probably do have fixed hours and so staff WFH should actually be working and available during contracted hours. So I would actually agree with customer call centres and Government departments returning to the office full-time because there has been a clear nosedive in productivity / quality of service. But there are so many jobs that are nothing like the ones you mention where I think WFH is fine.

Fixed and strict working hours work for some people. MN is full of people fainting at the idea of being asked to speak with a manager a 4:58 when they are leaving at 5.And fair enough, the leave the office, they leave work behind.

For some of us, it's the worst work environment, and we much prefer not being on a clock, and treat "overtime" as just... working hours. If you work 3 or 4 hours on a Sunday, then that's what it is. But then if I want to take a 2 hours swim class midday, I can.

Many companies NEED workers who are not on a 9 to 6 schedule, because clients and requirements cannot physically be limited between these times.

You seem to have very little imagination when it comes to people's working lives.

Millions of us work from home (or for ourselves) and never have to answer a phone or deal with members of the public. We set our own hours and as long as our work gets done by the deadline, we can choose to do it at 2am or 2pm, or from a coffee shop, or from a sun lounger.

The days of people having to be "present" 9-5 are rapidly disappearing.

Many companies NEED workers who are not on a 9 to 6 schedule, because clients and requirements cannot physically be limited between these times.

Yep, and that's precisely why so many can have that time during the day to go to the gym, or for coffee, or to a school play - because they were logged on at 7am or know they won't log off until 10pm that evening.

The lack of imagination on these threads amuses me - everyone works different jobs and we all have different environments. If someone is pissed off because don't have the flexibility to disappear off to yoga at 11am on a Wednesday, maybe they should look into changing jobs rather than seething at those who are lucky enough to have that option.

I have no idea. I've never worked from home before.

That is fine but then you say - I don't know what people are doing that they can go to the gym or see friends.

Everybody's job is different. You are glued to the laptop all day but plenty of people don't need to be.

I think there's a difference there are some people who are saying they go to a gym class, do the school run, go shopping etc because their hours are flexible, and they work at different times to do a ft week. Other people do all those things because their job when wfh only ever takes 2 or 3 hours a day.
If everyone is happy and the work is done as expected, with then it's not unreasonable. I'd definitely be happy if I got paid for ft and only had 2 hours work a day! I'm surprised at the volume of posters that have those type of jobs but then I don't have much insight into how other industries work, (I'm learning from lots of similar threads!) so maybe it's more common than I first thought.

In the same way lots of people might expect me to be unproductive if I'm listening to the radio and chatting and yet that is quite normal for me, even on a really busy day

Yes, bu millions of us do have to do all those things and it's crystal clear they aren't bloody well doing them efficiently.

Your personal WFH schedule obviously works like a well oiled machine for all concerned according to you, but can you consider for a moment that there are others for whom it does not?

The poster you were quoting gave you loads of examples of government departments where productivity has dropped off a cliff edge and you've just ignored it and accused them of lacking imagination. I think you are the one who is lacking imagination here. The world of WFH doesn't begin and end with your company and your position in it.

It should not be too much for us to expect that public sector employers in particular who are working from home should actually serve the public within a reasonably time frame, as they are paid to do.

You seem to be arguing against a point I never actually made

Of course if you have a job that requires you to be present at your desk or phone for nine hours a day, then that's what you should do - nobody is saying otherwise. But it gets very boring when every WFH thread inevitably descends into people seething because other posters have more flexibility than them.

The fact that some people in other industries take the piss isn't my problem, frankly. I work for myself and set my own hours and level of work. I don't commit to hours I don't want to do and regularly schedule breaks in the middle of the day to see friends, come home and do chores or go for lunch and coffee.

However I then have days where I don't finish until 9.30pm having started at 6am. I have days where I barely have time to go for a wee because I'm so flat-out with bookings. It's swings and roundabouts.

The fact that I had enough time yesterday to meet a friend for coffee mid-way through the day doesn't mean I don't do my job or that my clients are somehow missing out. It just means that I'm lucky enough to be able to schedule breaks in my day sometimes and I take full advantage of that.

there are not that many jobs where you can work 2 or 3 hours a day while being paid full time.

Flexibility is one thing, but long term and on a daily basis, it's not a safe job!

I have a permanent contract so mine is safe.

OK, right. You do realise that permanent contracts can be terminated on notice, right? And that people on permanent contracts can be made redundant?

I mean, it does sound from what you say that your employer has no problem paying you for the work you do in the way you want to do it. And so you are no doubt absolutely correct that your job is not at risk. But just be aware that it’s not your contract that is keeping you safe, it is your value to the business.

I have set hours in my WFH contract but the general consensus is not to abide by rigid times but to ensure the work gets done efficiently and to deadline. Meaning sometimes I will have a 2-3 hour break in the afternoon and pick it back up on an evening or nighttime because that’s when my brain is at its best.

Thing is most people find it evens itself out.

I’m full time and Sometimes i work 2 hours a day. For the last 2 weeks it’s been more like 10 hours. Luckily my workplace isn’t time obsessed and measures on output not how long we’re at our desks

Some solicitors i recently had to deal with took over 2 years to deal with an issue they said usually took 6 months. I've no idea if they were working in an office or wfh....(or even working at all, half the time!)

that wasn't a dig, just replying to the poster who felt many jobs only need you for a couple of hours a day that these jobs are rare !

Sounds like you haven't seen the details in my contract.

Passport waiting times are at their lowest since 2020 according to this site, https://www.passportwaitingtime.co.uk/ , lots of government departments have had the number of agents cut or directed people to online services, and it's always been a nightmare to get through to certain customer service teams since the invention of the call centre.

I honestly think some people are misremembering a halcyon time when you could just call a company and speak to the relevant person immediately - that hasnt been the case for years and it's certainly not due to a recent rise in people working from home.

I got a passport in less than a week, in December

The delays on phone lines since covid are unlikely to be caused by wfh - more likely that a percentage of the workforce was made redundant after being furloughed and the company has since stuck with a reduced service, with a continuous message that "we are experiencing unusually high call volumes" 🙄

Everyone has different values, some people are happy to 'cheat' their trusted employer and that's fine if that's you. others who may actually feel loyalty, or passion for there work will be working all the hours they should (and some). Each to their own.

I got mine in 3 days and DS in 8 days, in November. The second one was delayed because they wanted extra paperwork, which was sent with the first. Over the phone at 8am a helpful woman copied over the paperwork and said no need to send it in; I heard a child so I'm pretty sure she was WFH. Medical exemption replacement quick and helpful, minor dog woof during the call (spaniel, for those who need to know).

Compare with my bank, who wouldn't sort out a security block on my card for 24 hours, and who I could barely hear on the phone in 5 different calls due to the many other adults talking around them. Of any role, if customer service have what they feel is a suitable space to work at home, they are easiest to monitor and I would think all parties benefit from it.

How is it cheating when I have already completed all the work I can upto a point and I am waiting for the next piece of work to come in?

You can be loyal to an employer and go to an exercise class in work time.

Or they want to make work work for them and have found a way to do so while still meeting their targets and doing their job well.

I can enjoy my job, do it well, get excellent appraisals every year and still exercise and do the laundry in “work hours”.

Well I've never known a job where you wait for another job to come in, and go to the gym while you wait - unless you are self employed? Surely there's always work to do?