Elderly parents won't write wills or funeral plans.

[Iaminthefly]

AIBU to be starting to get seriously stressed about it?

My parents are both mid 70s. I have been asking them for several years now to please sort out their wills and funeral plans. They keep saying they will but still haven't done it.

I am a lone parent of two young DC. No other real family support other than my parents. I have an older brother but given my DM still buys his food shopping it's doubtful how much help he would be.

I just really worried that I'm going to end up negotiating funerals and estates (niether of which I have any experience of) absolutely blind because they won't put anything in place. I also stress I'll make a complete balls up of it because I will be absolutely grief stricken.

I've asked and asked but they will not do it. Nobody likes facing their mortality but I'm starting to feel its quite selfish of them not to get it sorted out.

When my grandad died a few years ago, he hadn't sorted anything out beforehand and it was a huge headache for my mum. So much so, as soon as it was over she sent me a (slightly morbid) spreadsheet containing everything I'll need when she passes, from solicitor details and account numbers to funeral songs. I have never opened the spreadsheet but I'll be grateful for it when the time comes.

I know it's unlikely that both of your parents will pass at the same time but unlikely events do happen - my DH lost both maternal grandparents and his mum in a twelve month period. There were no wills and you wouldn't believe how long it took to unpick everything for probate.

Obviously you can't force your parents to do anything but I think it's pretty selfish that they won't even organise their wills.

I have just been through this @Iaminthefly and I really feel for you.
My parents early 80s and refused to do any estate planning. My father suffered a serious illness a few years back and was hospitalised for months. It really frightened him. Afterwards I forcefully told him he was selfish and it had to be sorted and that I didn’t want to be dealing with grief and managing his estate. . I found a local solicitor for him and my mum and took them there and they did wills and POA for health and finance. We have also done a spreadsheet together with all his accounts and information and contacts. I sat with him for two days to do this.

i just pushed it - and played on my upset but not sure how successful I would have been without his illness giving him a better perspective. Don’t give up tho- talk seriously with them about it x

Isn't it the case that the nearest relative is expected to step in as administrator/executor if there's no will? There must be scope for them to say no, but of course what a lot of of people do is to get a solicitor to do all the work. Expensive but best solution sometimes.

Re. your last para, I've had my fill of stubborn elderly people. It's a complete nightmare when they won't take care of basic business like wills and power of attorney. And my late father, my former boss, and my former MIL all desperately needed hearing aids and wouldn't wear them, and I spent about twenty years having to repeat myself over and over again, just because they wouldn't wear them. It was insanely stressful and extremely frustrating. And my dad created all manner of roadblocks in various things. I learn what pure despair was. It was incredibly wearing, and I really sympathise with the situation on your husband's side. I found that no amount of begging and pleading made any difference, although my dad did reluctantly agree to PoA in the end, in the nick of time, after much pleading and cajoling. Your ILs are potentially leaving an enormous mess for you to sort out, and it's so, so selfish. I have no respect for elderly people acting like this.

@FancyBiscuitsLevel · Today 08:54
OP - it is highly unlikely they will both die at the same time. So if they are married and one dies without a will, then simply put everything goes to the other one.

@Octavia64 · Today 09:15
Wills - again if they are married then when the first one dies it will all go to the second one. At which point the survivor may be more amenable to writing a will.

I've only read the first page of this thread so far and your comments highlight perfectly why people should educate themselves correctly about such matters and do the right thing in granting LPAs and making Wills.

You are both wrong in your comments above. Without a Will, all of the deceased's estate does NOT automatically go to the surviving spouse. The rules of intestacy apply, as follows:

If there are children
If the estate is valued at more than £322,000, the inheritance is divided between the partner and the children. If the estate is £322,000 or less then the children don’t inherit. The partner inherits:

• all the personal property and belongings of the person who has died
• the first £322,000 of the estate
• half of the remaining estate

The children will inherit the other half of the remaining estate. If the person who died had more than 1 child, this amount will be divided equally between them. This includes any child adopted by the person who died. It also includes any biological or adopted child the person had from other relationships. Jointly-owned property Couples may jointly own their home. There are two different ways of jointly owning a home. These are beneficial joint tenancies and tenancies in common. If the partners were beneficial joint tenants at the time of the death, when the first partner dies, the surviving partner will automatically inherit the other partner's share of the property. However, if the partners are tenants in common, the surviving partner does not automatically inherit the other person's share.

@Iaminthefly OP, you are not being unreasonable in wanting your parents to get their affairs in order, but as the rules of intestacy demonstrate, not so much for your sake, but for each of theirs. LPAs are essential whilst they're alive (they become void upon death) particularly given that they have separate finances - if one of them lost capacity to manage their affairs, it would be next to impossible for the other one (or anyone else) to access their accounts (i.e. their money!) without an LPA in place. Wills make the process of obtaining Probate and disbursing the deceased's estate in line with their wishes so much easier - would either of your parents like the idea that their spouse doesn't inherit everything from them because they didn't simply write a Will stating this? I think the next time you mention all this to your parents, you should do so on the basis of a) "This is the very last time I will raise this subject" and b) "Do you understand the difficulties that will be caused for you by (i) not having LPAs and (ii) not having Wills (then talk them through the consequences of both). Maybe once you bring it home to them that they will cause each other potential great hardship, they may think again. If you see any softening in their attitude, you might then like to suggest you set up an appointment with a solicitor for them to attend to write LPAs and Wills. If you get the same response as previously, leave it alone - as the old saying goes, "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink".

In Ireland it has recently been made on line only. Requires both parents to set up individual accounts. They both need e mail addresses, which only one of them has. They both need government system IDs which requires 2 forms of ID, with only their name on. All bills are in either my dad's name or both. The POA requires them to go to the solicitor, with the attorney, me, who does not live in Ireland. They then need to have their capacity confirmed by their GP. It is a fricking nightmare. So much easier in the UK.

I wouldn't dream of hassling my parents about funeral plans or their wills. I presume they will have done a Will but if not the money would be divided between me and my siblings which is fine. I organised mil funeral. It wasn't difficult. It doesn't seem very nice to pressure people like this.

Not true, the deceased persons name will be on the invoice, they’re not giving the money to the OP they’re giving it to the funeral director.

Also I don’t think mid 70s is “elderly”. They’re probably both hoping they have at least ten more years on this earth!

My DM had a will, my DF didn't, I didn't find much difference, I instructed a solicitor for both, neither were above IT threshold.

Lol. It's really not that simple.

But why. Not doing this means that you are choosing for your kids to have to make a whole bunch of decisions in a short space of time when they are grief stricken, and potentially having to pay thousands for it. It is a selfish thing to do and so easily avoided.

I can see that it’s really annoying but I wouldn’t get stressed about it.
How much money are we talking about? If it’s an expensive house and considerably savings you can pay someone to sort it. Yes it will cost a lot, but payment will come out of the estate.
If they only have a small amount then it’s relatively easy to do.

Not these days. I got several paper copies of Dad's death certificate but only really needed one. Tell Us Once service was very useful. Registrar notified HMRC, NHS, DSS, DVLA, council, probably others. Some financial institutions can access that database too. Others were happy to accept photo of certificate or saw it in branch and handed it back.

I am currently in the situation where my stepfather has died with no will or funeral plan and my DM is seriously ill in hospital and it seems overwhelming trying to sort everything out when the next of kin is incapacitated.
At least you'll be directly related to both 😔 but things do happen to complicate matters and it doesn't necessarily have to mean both die at the same time.
I can understand your concern OP but there's nothing you can do about it if they won't discuss or sort anything out.

I agree. LPAs and Wills are essential, but funeral plans are not. Someone can state in their Will if they wish to be cremated or buried (and include any other specific details if they wish) and then the next of kin can make the funeral plans with other family members and the chosen undertaker.

Will they be ten good years, though? That's when POA comes into its own.

I find the denial of death always interesting - we all die it is as simple as that, no cheat codes or get out clauses it comes for us all.

So why not make your wishes clear, setting out a will is very straightforward and easy and does make things simpler and quicker.

Having a funeral plan or money set aside or your wishes know is also a good idea.

having these doesn’t affect when you die or how you live at all. Talking about it doesn’t somehow make you more likely to die but sorting it out does make it easier for those left behind

Remember as well when thinking a solicitor may be expensive to administer the estate, if you are the one running round doing everything, sorting it all out and the other beneficiaries are doing SFA, that any solicitors charges come off the estate so a 4k bill is 1k each less for 4 people for example.

If you are the only child then without a will it will all go to you anyway? I wouldn't personally be concerned, it sounds like it will be the same result unless they wanted to leave something to the grandchildren.
My mum has a will but I don't think she has a funeral plan. She is in her 80s but there is no way I would ask her about getting one.

You can equally say pushing elderly parents to do something to suit you is selfish. Actually arranging the funeral, choosing music etc can be quite positive the last thing you do for your parents. These things aren't all black and white. My mother had no plans, I think she'd have loved her funeral particularly all her GC and their friends who all loved her when they sat talking about their memories of her in her garden with this going on late I to the night.

My mil left exact instructions including a total plonker to make a speech which was as awful as we expected and a minister who she regarded as a close friend conducting the service. I dont think she would have expected the extortionate invoice he submitted.

My DDad had paid for a funeral plan and when he died my DBro said he had the easiest job in the world as DDad had literally prepared for everything. All DBro had to do was choose a date and a venue for the wake.

@Hedgerow2 "As a pp said, unlikely they will die at the same time so at that point the remaining parent will automatically inherit everything. You can tackle that parent then about a will."
As a pp WRONGLY stated. The Rules of Intestacy apply - the surviving spouse does not "automatically inherit everything".

An LPA dies with the person who made it (the "donor") - it is void and of no use after death (only a Will is).

@user6432879631 "A Will would be ideal, but as they're married everything will pass to the surviving spouse." NO!!! This is the fourth time I've read this and I'm only a page-and-a-half into this thread. Will people PLEASE stop posting this - it's simply not true. The Rules of Intestacy apply and surviving spouses do not inherit everything without their deceased spouse having written a Will to this effect.