Feel like crying! What is it with references??

[LavenderFields7]

Been a stay-at-home mum for 10 years, decided to try and return to work - no luck with paid job positions due to zero ability to provide references. Fine. I will do 6 months free voluntary work - nowhere will take me without 2 references 😭 A charity shop rang me today to say they can’t accept my application offering 3 full days free work a week for 6 months because I can’t provide professional references. They didn’t even ask what qualifications I’ve got (hint, I’m ridiculously overqualified for till work). This is the 5th volunteer role I’ve been rejected for. AIBU? Is this normal for volunteer jobs?? Why don’t they make it easier 😢

This isn't always true - I had time off working for the nhs to raise my children for 8 years by which time my previous boss had left and most of my colleagues so I went to HR for a reference and was told that employee records are only kept for 5 years and therefore couldn't provide me with a reference - I had worked there for 12 years prior to me leaving

I found the same issue when I was looking to do volunteer work while a SAHM.

I signed up to volunteer with a food bank and they insisted on two references. They could be personal ones, but they had rules about the jobs those people could have. It was like a passport application. And the reference form they sent out wasn't just "write a nice paragraph about this person and why they'd be good for us". It was like a job application in itself, it listed individual skills a volunteer would need and asked the reference to write paragraphs about how I'd meet them!

Utterly ridiculous, and I ended up giving up and just going back to paid work (I was only out of work for 3 years so could just about scrounge up two professional references).

The only suggestion I have is that things like scouts seem to not require references to volunteer, so that might be an option.

Just make one up and get a friend to do it. Or create a new email address and so your own.

Can you get personal references?

Sorry you are having a hard time - but I don’t think it’s unreasonable for charities to require references, you can be working with cash, vulnerable people and /or be the face of the charity.

Managing volunteers well is hugely skilled and time consuming work so they need to put the time into finding the right people.

Usually personal references will suffice - anyone who you have babysat for or similar? Anything where you have had a position of trust (pta etc?)

hope it works out

Also @TwirlyPineapple scouts round here require DBS, references and an interview / welcome conversation-at the end of the day you are looking after other people’s children

This
It’s a stupid system so play it to get what you need. I’ve been a referee for friends kids to help them get into work experience or voluntary work - sometimes people in your situation just need a break!

good luck!

When I had a career beak my old place of
employment couldn’t provide me with a reference as it had been to long since I worked there. Luckily I had volunteered at my children’s school for several years, so they provided me with references. I didn’t need a reference to
volunteer at the school, but I did need to have a DBS.

Are you ok?

No it's an entirely different skillset, it's completely incomparable. You could be a great rocket scientist and be terrible at the customer service and people relations skills needed for a customer facing role.

I am a qualified vet, it doesn't mean I'd be overqualified to work in Costa - I don't have the first clue about coffee or making grande whatever their names is.

I know a very smart developer who has worked on some of the core services we all rely on today, but he wouldn't last five minutes in a charity shop because he's the most supercilious person you could meet.

Rubbish. I had 7 years as a SAHM.

I'm still reasonably intelligent, well organised, able to learn new stuff quickly. As I'm sure the OP is.

Met plenty of ppl who have worked places for years and been crap at their Jobs!

More than ok and thriving in my new job, sweetheart.
Let me ask you how your hatred is going

I asked someone I had worked for 7 years earlier, and he was kind enough to oblige, it’s really difficult

If you are struggling, find someone who can give you a personal reference as other have said.
When I did get work, I worked for agencies, they again are terrible to get a reference from, and now employers are kind enough to accept evidence from the tax records that I have., but you need to be able to work to show this.

I am again in a redundancy situation, it’s a never ending nightmare. Every industry I enter are making efficiencies..letting staff go, while maintaining Executive's massive wages and BONUSES, and paying shareholders dividends, while people like me can go to the devil !

OOoo I think that must have touched a nerve…

I manage volunteers. We don’t require professional references - two references from people who know you well personally but aren’t family are fine. It’s very unusual to specify professional references for a voluntary role.

I've volunteered working with children and vulnerable adults in museums and now have a casual job that involves the same. All roles have wanted references because of safeguarding. I would email any charity that would work logistically - have a look at the volunteering databases for your area - and explain your situation up front and say what you can offer in terms of referees (when I started, I asked a teacher friend to provide a character reference, for example).

Your skills, qualifications and experience are irrelevant when it comes to meeting the safeguarding requirements, although I agree that insisting on two professional references that could be nothing to do with your volunteering field doesn't seem a good way of meeting them (my "professional" contacts from my years as a freelance journalist had mostly never met me in person and would have had no idea of my suitability to work with children, for example - luckily no-one has ever suggested I ask them for my museum stuff).

When my son started applying for jobs involving working with children, he asked a family friend for whom he had babysat for a reference and that was acceptable.

On the upside, all the organisations I've volunteered for have been happy to provide references after a certain time - it is seen as one of the benefits they can offer volunteers.

That’s a great idea, thank you so much! I already have a PhD so it felt a bit overkill getting more qualifications, but I hadn’t thought of a short community college type course. Will give it a go!

Ds needed two references for his graduate job he used a manager from his part time job that he had left the year before and also a personal reference from his dissertation tutor.

my friends dd needed 2 references she used her work and I gave her a personal reference.

I agree that get a professional friend to give you a reference

I gave my friend a reference when she volunteered to work in a charity shop, it was a personal reference, how long I'd known her and her being of good character.

She'd owned her own, open all hours type corner shop and sold it, she couldn't give herself a reference.

It also strikes me that we advise people who are very socially isolated to volunteer. The need for multiple references is going to be a massive barrier for many of these people too.

I think some volunteering situations are so overzealous it puts people off and feel for the Op. our local village library is like this, I know retired teachers and university professors who will not volunteer because they want references and make it like a real job application. I used to volunteer at places gave up because of lack of time , now I have time I am put off by the red tape if references and some of the officialness.

I have this exact same problem. I cannot get a volunteer role in my town. I do not have any friends to ask and I have not worked for some years due to my health. I am very isolated and lonely, I wanted to do some work in a shop, just to get out and meet people but they all want references so I cannot

Sign on as unemployed. You robsbly won't get benefits but it might help you find a job. You do seem to have a negative approach. Hopefully they will give you advice re finding references.

I do really get that this can be a barrier and it is stressful. But so many of these roles are actually very responsible (keys, locking up tills, dealing with anyone who walks in, supporting others) or involve children or vulnerable adults. It isn't just pointless red tape and you need an understanding of safeguarding to do many of these jobs anyway. The other aspect is that some venues have lots of people applying to volunteer and it does cost time and money to train and manage them - so yes they use a job-style application procedure, of course they do.

For anyone in this position, I agree a course is a good idea. Or try getting involved in a local community event - community gardening or walking groups or event organising - and check first that the leaders will provide a reference after x months. And check what the places you want to volunteer at need - my recent (paid) role wanted references from my two current/recent volunteering roles that involved children, from official email addresses, but they only needed the standard one-liner, for example.

I suspect the larger the organisation you want to volunteer for the more likely they are to be able to advise/help with the process because they will have staff specifically employed to recruit and train volunteers - but that does mean it will feel like an application process! I know the large museum I vol for would advise a suitable candidate on what was needed and how to get it.

Get a trusted friend to do you a reference. Someone who's been a minister or teacher or Dr or whatever. In the past I've done character references for friends in the same situation as you.