To think they call us Karen because they fear us

[InformEducateEntertain]

I absolutely hate the term Karen. It's pejorative and deeply unpleasant.

Middle aged women (of whom I am one and to whom the term is most generally applied) are bloody amazing. Putting us down for our don't give a f**k badass attitude and willingness to fight back strikes me as lazy categorisation.

I'd go as far to say that those who use it are scared by the knowledge that looking the menopause in the eye has given us the courage to have a voice at last.

AIBU?

Absolutely.

It is.
The "I want to speak to a manager because the change you handed me is dirty" type
Someone who complains about trivial shit, basically.

Oh my gosh I’ve been trying to figure out what she means about Karen being racist towards black women!

Thank you all for explaining.

Honestly, I wouldn’t give her any more attention.

She just wants to be racist and unchallenged.

So if somebody behaves like a 'Karen' to a white person and then to a black person. Aren't they being rude in equal measure, so it cannot be considered racist surely. Unless you are saying people are only ever 'Karens' to black people?

Unless you are saying people are only ever 'Karens' to black people?

You literally have not comprehended one thing from our side of the argument, have you? That is exactly what we have been saying throughout the entire thread. “Karen” is a term that has been MISappropriated. As in, taken from a community and used incorrectly. The only real “behaving like a Karen” is through the weaponisation of whiteness and feigned victimhood towards black people.

GretchenWienersHair I still don't think ARealitycheck will get it . She would rather continue to argue nonsense.

And as I told you pages back. If you wish to take credit for an insult from a black person to a white person, crack on. The rest of us would consider one ethnicity targetting another ethnicity as racist, but you be you. The rest of us will carry on regardless.

Who is “the rest of us”? White people? Because there have been plenty on this thread telling you you’re talking shit. If you don’t understand what racism is, and see it in black and white (excuse the pun) then that is on you. Don’t complain when people are telling you you’re racist if you refuse to understand what racism actually entails.

I'd suggest you are the one being racist. My example of a person behaving 'Karen' like (awkward demanding unreasonable) to more than one race is in no way racist. It just means that person is rude.

What you appear to want is the right for only black people to use the term karen against white people. Surely you can follow the common sense thinking, and realise that behaviour in itself is racist.

And no, when I say the rest of us. I mean normal sensible thinking people. Hence why I used the term 'you be you' which was directed at you alone, the same would apply to anyone of the same thinking no matter ethnicity.

It’s a real shame for actual Karens, must be bloody annoying having your name be used as a derogatory general insult.
I know a Karen, she’s so lovely.

No. It’s not.

You sound ridiculous.

I think the tissue is that the Karen thing means different things on both sides of the pond. In the US it is linked to a certain type of middle aged white woman who is racist, and in the UK it's a certain type of middle aged woman who is rude, demanding and unreasonable. One of these types has a certain amount of privilege over another group of people, the other isn't linked to privilege but rudeness and demanding entitled behaviour which isn't linked to race or class.

Which is fine. What isn’t fine, though, is the scores of white women here telling us that the first (original) meaning from across the pond is completely non-existent here because apparently we (Black Brits) don’t experience racism. For a lot of Black British people, we have closer cultural affiliation to Black Americans that white Brits, so the meaning of “Karen” has never changed for us. To tell us we’re making things up and negate our experiences is a special type of racism in itself.

True, I definitely agree with this.

Why would you have an afinity with people from a completely different continent, with totally different education, health system etc? Surely for most Black Brits this was their country of birth. Why the lack of integration if what you say is true.

I'd suggest like in this case in point, you may well consider it cultural appropriation, but as this is Britain and the view from the majority of the population seems to suggest your interpretation of the 'Karen' slur is out of step with this Country. Most seeing it as a person behaving in an entitled way. Thus it is not being said as a racial insult.

Lack of integration?

Oh Lordy…

“Blacks”, “lack of integration” and lord knows what is in the most recently “deleted by MNHQ for breaking talk guidelines” comment. Yet we’re “seeing racism where there isn’t any”. Ok, @ARealitycheck . Do you, boo.

I cannot believe what I am reading from ARealitycheck. It is just so blatant.

Blatant and not as intelligent as they like to believe they are

I hope a few more shall acknowledge this

I acknowledge it. That poster has been racist in language and content. They have also persistently targetted posters who have said they are black for their comments, ignoring opposing views from others.

OK - I don't think you can be real. This must surely be a spoof account to drop as many racist tropes as possible while claiming that people are seeing racism where it doesn't exist.

But just in case...

Integration into a society or a country is something that people from outside that country or society do (or don't do). There is no question of British people being 'integrated' into Britain or 'not integrated' into Britain. British people who hold minority opinions (let's say British people who are Republican) are not failing to integrate. British people who identify closely with others with similar characteristics internationally (e.g. LGBT+ people who identify with LGBT+ communities elsewhere) are not failing to integrate.

The very concept is illogical. Britain is made up of its people. You can't fail to integrate with something that you are already inherently a part of.

Saying Black Britons are not integrated is a classic racist trope that is premised on the idea of Black Britons not being fully British or fully part of Britain.

Which is fine. What isn’t fine, though, is the scores of white women here telling us that the first (original) meaning from across the pond is completely non-existent here because apparently we (Black Brits) don’t experience racism. For a lot of Black British people, we have closer cultural affiliation to Black Americans that white Brits, so the meaning of “Karen” has never changed for us. To tell us we’re making things up and negate our experiences is a special type of racism in itself.

The problem is if my white kids call me a "bit of a Karen" they don't mean racist.
They mean a middle aged woman who actually complains when they get bad service such as Chips missing from a MacDonalds order.

well take it up with the people using Karen to shut you up

be that your children or some stranger who is sexist towards you

the issues there is the sexism not that Karen is used by people who are having to deal with a particular type of racist behaviour