To think they call us Karen because they fear us

[InformEducateEntertain]

I absolutely hate the term Karen. It's pejorative and deeply unpleasant.

Middle aged women (of whom I am one and to whom the term is most generally applied) are bloody amazing. Putting us down for our don't give a f**k badass attitude and willingness to fight back strikes me as lazy categorisation.

I'd go as far to say that those who use it are scared by the knowledge that looking the menopause in the eye has given us the courage to have a voice at last.

AIBU?

Then you’ve never worked in hospitality. Arseholes across the board, gender irrelevant

In England its now used for any over 40 woman who isnt a smiley man pleaser at all times. Race irrelevant. Yay another insult for women to add to the list.

We don’t need a name. It’s up to us to stop using it and stop other using it

Somebody can be a “Karen” without being middle aged.

A “Karen” is someone who comes off as entitled and often acts like they deserve special treatment. They’re quick to complain or make a scene over small things, demanding to speak to a manager when things don’t go their way. It is also about being a busybody - always sticking their nose into situations that don’t involve them and trying to control how things go. Basically, it’s someone who expects the world to revolve around them and isn’t afraid to make a fuss to get what they want.

The “Karen” doesn’t need to be of a certain age, but there’s usually a typical demographic that act this way, thinking they’re above any rules and that they don’t apply to them.

I’m not sure what you’re getting at here, sorry.
You need a term for a behaviour (racism) that only refers to women?

Again, for those at the back

A Karen is someone whose name is Karen

Anything else is misogynistic shite used by thickos.

Just to let you know I kinda love you.

Thank you for listening.

It really means a great deal to feel heard especially in conversations like this.

It’s not just about the name though.

when talking about the history we need white women to speak out more about racism.

The fact is white women are able to call out racism in a way black women can’t. White women are listened to and respected more than black women.

No I personally don’t need to use a term because I do not have to deal with racism towards myself

if you have read the thread, I assume you have given your posts it’s a particular behaviour by racist women that isn’t explicit and is labelled so

I am not in a position to tell anyone how to label this behaviour, maybe you feel in a position to tell them. I personally don’t

Oh thank you I love you too Xx

There’s two issues in your post. First in claims of misuse of the term - as I say if that was the subject of a thread then it would be a different discussion.

The second is the actual need for a term in itself. And that is not something I regard as sexist because we are discussing a manifestation that is specific to women, leveraging aspects of womanhood. Having a specific term for that is important.

If the behaviour is specific to women, then yes.

Karen is Karen. It’s not about race or gender or social caste. Karen is a practice, not a label.

It’s not about misogyny when a male can be a Karen too.

It is misogyny. It is a tool for silencing women. I've been called a 'Karen" before by a group of teens in softplay who were basically trampling on tiny toddlers and barging past a pregnant mother. The staff did nothing. When I asked them to be more careful, their response was to gleefully called me a Karen.

You're wrong. It is a woman's name. The term is used against specifically women, to shut women up.

Fully agreed.

And I feel so sorry for those women who are actually called Karen and have had their name spoiled.

This. Except it's used against younger women than 40 sometimes.

THIS! The word is.... racist.

@Cherry8809 No, sorry

Karen is not a practice.
Karen is the name of women called. .....Karen

Ant other use just makes people look uneducated.

That's why, despite the hijacking of this thread, Mumsnet is quick to delete posts calling others by that name.

I feel so sorry for women who are actually called Karen.

Using someone’s name as a slur is indefensible.

Yep.

It’s interesting though, isn’t it, that you know exactly what type of person somebody is being referred to as if they’re called a Karen…

Petulant, entitled, argumentative…

Well actually, some people use it to describe racist white women. And some people use it purely if they don't like something someone has said. So no... there seems to be vast disagreement on this thread about what is meant by 'Karen'.

I agree that misuse of the term isn't a question asked initially. Honestly I had no idea of its origins to start with as I expect is the case for many on this thread. No one suspected misuse because the origins have been lost in appropriation. Thank you once again for explaining.

The specific construct is significant I agree but its gendered construct is also really dangerous in the patriarchy as the widespread incorrect and controlling use of the term shows. I do find the fact that there is no male equivalent (that I am aware of) troubling. The white tears label doesn't carry the same gender load, I wonder why it can't be used instead.

We all have separate perspectives, with no attempt to draw equivalence mine is I suppose informed by knowledge that after years of violent oppression and a famine in Ireland men and women found independence, promising equality to women. What followed for those betrayed women in terms of anti abortion laws, expectations of women etc was unbelievable. For many cumulating in the audacity to name the unmarried women homes after Mary Magdaline. It is well know that rape victims, minors and victims of child abuse were sent to those places which operated to blame them, free men and get rid of the evidence. Women also joined in and ran the ### homes as nuns. My mother and her friends grew up in fear of them, I know a woman who was picked up by the police and put in one in the 1980s! Yet another way to shut women up. Very effective. It changed them as people forever. Thankfully things are much better now but just because the men setting up this model had fought against cultural suppression didn't stop them being horrific to women. I see the same type of behaviour in the angry black woman label and all other use of Karen I have encountered, obviously on a more minor level. It is dangerous to gender condemning terms in my opinion and I am mistrustful of that. But you are of course free to value the definition, these things are very hard to articulate I agree and do need to be articulated. I hope everyone on this thread can agree that white women have a responsibility to black women not to join in their suppression and to work against it.

Well murder tends to be specific to men and they don’t get their own name but ok.

What behaviours that are specific to women are you thinking of?