To think they call us Karen because they fear us

[InformEducateEntertain]

I absolutely hate the term Karen. It's pejorative and deeply unpleasant.

Middle aged women (of whom I am one and to whom the term is most generally applied) are bloody amazing. Putting us down for our don't give a f**k badass attitude and willingness to fight back strikes me as lazy categorisation.

I'd go as far to say that those who use it are scared by the knowledge that looking the menopause in the eye has given us the courage to have a voice at last.

AIBU?

Well where I live in Yorkshire the police would respond to it like any other call.

But what’s your point? White women shouldn’t report black men raping them because it’s unfair?

Why do you think the rest of the world is like the worst states of the US?

@Bababear987 sadly that’s not true. As I said previously, you only have to look at YouTube, watch tiktok, listen to teenagers talk, to know that women get called a “Karen” for having the audacity to be middle aged and doing something like sending back a burger when they ordered a pizza .

Given there’s only a few documented instances of this happening that’s set off a global trend sticking the boot into other women, it’s a wonder that a term isnt coined for violent men that ALL men are subjected to

Why are you talking about white women with such disdain? You may love on Planet White Women Are Evil And Are All Racist but in the real world white women are oppressed by ALL men. Even the black ones

I've no idea I wasnt there, were you? Or is this something you've randomly found online and decided to be personally offended by?

Are you getting outraged and angry at the wrong person by any chance?

I'm a middle-aged woman too and I also hate the Karen thing. However, I don't think that blanket statements claiming that middle-aged women are bloody amazing amd kick-ass really do us any favours tbh. We are variously great, mediocre and crappy people, just like any other section of the population. And no, I don't think it's because they fear us, it's because they think we are past it, irrelevant because no longer of mating age (unlike middle-aged men).

Bababear987 · Today 15:01

Being a middle aged woman isnt what gets you called a Karen. Being a middle aged c u next Tuesday is.

This just isn't true though. Also, you are allowed to use swear words on MN.

Exactly!
The term was coined to describe middle aged women who were unpleasant, and has now been extended to include middle aged women full stop.
It’s sexist and ageist.

Some young men are rapists. Imagine if someone posted a picture of a group of young men sitting down in a restaurant with the caption “mind out ladies, the rapists are here”. That would be, quite rightly, completely unacceptable.

So why is it OK to do that to middle aged women?

Except that really isn’t true. I’ve just been and watched 3 ‘Karen’ compilations on YouTube with massive view counts

1. Every single clip was of someone acting in an entirely unacceptable way to either strangers or waiting staff.
2. of the 64 clips, 23 we’re ‘male karens’. Can’t see any evidence to suggest gender has anything to do with it

what is a common factor is being older than 40ish and seeming to believe you have to right to speak to someone as if they’re an inferior life form.

the fact there may be social media users who also don’t get this - and then label people Karen’s just for existing - just shows they’re stupid. If there’s one thing the internet isn’t short of, it’s stupidity.

I think this highlights a good point. The incidents are those that have gone viral.

However - if you engage with people outside of your demographic (within the UK) about this topic. You will find MANY victims of this behaviour.

Especially within the workplace.

@Bababear987 that poster was just trying to show you that the term has now been extended in social media to include all middle aged women. So your assertion that you’ll never be called a Karen, because you’ll never behave badly, is fundamentally floored. Times have changed, and now people will call a group of middle aged women “Karens”. This is offensive and demonstrates prejudice, which is something we’re trying to get rid of surely?

"Problem is some women in that age bracket seem to take out all their pent of rage at people who dont deserve it or people they think are beneath them, that's what a Karen is. If you are routinely called this then you need to take a look at yourself, I suspect what you consider assertive is more just plain attitude and rudeness."

@Bababear987 you have just neatly described my neighbour who has that pent up rage and vents it at people considered down the pecking order. I've observed my neighbour reducing a girl in the local supermarket to tears, demanding to speak to her boss for no good reason. Disgusting behaviour and fairly regular too according to staff in the village shop and from what I've seen on the local FB. No one has ever called him Karen.

But the whole Karen thing was a social media construct, so you can’t say some people are using the term correctly, and some aren’t. The whole point is that it’s open to interpretation. And however it may have started, it’s now being widely used as a derogatory term for all middle aged women. And that is wrong.

Women of colour are women…

But not generally called Karens.

Why?

They wouldn't be wrong if they did call him a Karen though, would they? Men do get called Karens. Perhaps we should be more proactive in calling out men, too.

Exactly.
Funnily enough. I was seated at my local cafe a few hours ago. The server brought my mocha in a takeaway cup - when I was obviously not taking away.

I called her back and asked for a cup and saucer. She rectified it and I thanked her.

No drama. No fuss.

Like you said - what is coined being a “Karen” is the unnecessary belittling behaviour and drama.

'Middle aged women' are not an homogeneous mass.

So get that idea out of your head.

This is a thread about the term Karen which originated from white women using thier whiteness to get black men in trouble.

No one is saying white women shouldn't call the cops if they've been raped. I'm not even sure why you are connecting the use of Karen to black men being rapists?

Do you honestly think that's what the term is used for?

If a white woman calls the cops on a " suspicious black man" versus a black man on a " suspicious white woman " the responses are typically different.

This Yorkshire?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/oct/07/west-yorkshire-police-trainee-anugrah-abraham-bullying-racism-death-inquest

https://www.policeconduct.gov.uk/our-work/learning/directed-investigation-racist-and-misogynistic-messages-west-yorkshire-police

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4glzgn4eqwo

I haven't read all the responses.

On one hand, I think Karen along with other stereotypical terms are generally harmful and best avoided.

However, I do think it needs to be understood that the actual cultural use of the term Karen is not an umbrella term for middle aged women; it's used to describe a more specific person.

I do think that making everything all about yourself and assuming that the term applies to you is unecessary.

I'm also just as uncomfortable and eyerolling at your dubbing of "middle aged women" as one homogenous group; while not as insulting, it still does generalise and erase the fact that "middle aged woman" is a hugely, hugely broad category of people, many of whom will have completely different experiences and outlooks on life.

In my opinion it is a horrid term that has no meaning. People, both men and women use it in order to attempt to shut someone up when they don't agree with something they have done or said. I judge people who use the term 'Karen' as in my opinion they don't have the intelligence to be able to express themselves well and lack critical thinking.

Goodness, you aren't really this obtuse are you?
The women were "called out" for being together, being of a certain age, and having a certain haircut. It's quite clear no one has done anything specific or that's what the caption would have said.

@Fencehedge perhaps we should stop using a perfectly innocuous name to describe a set of unpleasant personality traits and behaviours…

Can you share some of these videos?

I've yet to see someone get called a Karen for politely sending back food they didn't order.

Is just the modern version of fish wife isn’t it?

I’m sure they have been. But in general it could be seen as risky to be abusive towards a non-white woman, because of racism laws. But luckily (for the kind of people who use the term Karen in a derogatory way) there is no protection in law for middle aged white women. They can call us what they like, and if we complain, they feel vindicated!