To believe that some people stay broke because they don’t want to make sacrifices?

[ForSharpBrickKoala]

It’s hard to save money but isn’t it true that a lot of people could improve their financial situation if they made different choices? AIBU to think it’s not always about the system?

"Going by mumsnet we shouldn't be going for that coffee once a week with a friend, we should just stay at home and have tea and toast."
well yes. that's exactly what I did when I was broke. Had friends round for coffee instead of spending 10 x the price at a coffee shop.
Common sense

We’re broke at the moment. But that’s because the sacrifice we made was financial, in order that we didn’t have to send our DCs to nursery after my maternity leave. They’ve both been at home with me until they started preschool. We won’t be broke forever and the time we’ve had with them has been infinitely precious. Not every decision is about having more money.

I said this to my sister years ago its about choices we make.
She was going on about how skint she is because the kids need this that and the other.
I said it was a choice to have them i choose to have none she then evil eyed me and said well i can say the same about your size eat less and work out.
I replied with very true right back at you kept your legs closed save a ton of money its a choice.
She had a point and i took that point and worked with it its a choice 16 months later i lost 3 stone.
She still moaning how skint she is she went on to have 2 more kids.
As you can tell i hardly have contact with her now.

You see plenty of private school kids with safety pins holding their trainers together. Do you? I don't think that's true. I think you imagined it then wrote it down as though it were real.

I guess broke can mean different things to different people. I’m referring more to people who struggle financially but still some have degree of choice in how they spend - like living pay check to pay check but prioritising non-essentials over savings.

I wonder how much of that view is because of the media? It suits the rich bastards who own the press or social media, for us to have a target other than them to frown upon

Well, I guess in one sense, yes. I could have opted not to have children or have opted for a better father for them.

But 10 years ago, I found myself as a single parent with the other parent refusing to pay any support and shared care was limited to 1 day per week (not my choice). I had taken a career stepdown to be the parent on low paid school friendly hours and earned the grand sum of £490 per month. It's hard being the sole earner and taking home that amount. Even after applying for UC, I ended up in (relative) poverty and even meeting friends for coffee meant saving up. I regularly went without dinner and opted for toast so that the kids could eat (I cooked from scratch).

Things are better now the kids are older. I have had a career change after retraining and am not stuck on school friendly hours.

Could I have made better choices on my £490? No, not really. It was bloody hard and I relied on family support for unexpected costs. I didn't go to the hairdresser. I bought second hand clothes. Even retraining cost me money I didn't really have but it was the route out.

Yes, to some extent. I have 2 members of staff who earn the same, and receive the same in UC as their situations are identical. One has savings and runs a car, the other doesn't but it always down to her last penny come payday. She spends everything she gets on completely unnecessary things, eats out loads, many beauty treatments yet always complains she's skint. She could easily save 100s a month but can't seem to see that she fritters it away.

Obviously many people are living hand to mouth and living very basic lives, but not everyone who claims to be broke

Yes, it's not always "the system", but it increasingly is.
Those with assets (own their own home, have investments, have savings etc) are increasingly better off than those without. Your salary is now less of a source of wealth, probably because of those huge housing costs.

There's a good TED post about why poor people make poor financial decisions. It's too do wuth living in the moment and not feeling confident about the future

@ForSharpBrickKoala

What’s your personal experience with poverty? Have you formed your opinion from experience or observation?

This is a poor persons attitude.

no one gets rich from “saving”

generational wealth is the most powerful route to wealth you can have

Do you not see that that £1400 might be the safety net they need if they get evicted from their home and need a rental deposit? You act like 1400 isn't worth bothering for but it might be the difference between going into debt when the car breaks down, or having the money ready and it not becoming a crisis?

That 1400 becomes 2800, then 4,200 in just 3 years. That £4,200 in a bank account paying 4% interest will give £15 a month interest, so now that money is growing, and if the energy bill goes up by £15 a month it's something they can manage to absorb while still saving.

This is where financial security comes from? It starts small

SOME broke people could improve their situation by managing their money better, but not all.

I know what I'm talking about here. I spent my entire adolescence in a family where my DM found budgeting a continual skint struggle. We were seriously, seriously skint anyway, but my arse of a father spent a fifth of the money that hit the bank account on cigarettes.

That money would have made a massive material difference to life for my DM and me. We'd still have been skint though. Just less grindingly so.

Could have sacrificed my self worth and mental health and stayed in a marriage I was deeply unhappy with but least I'd have saved half on the bills eh?
Tetchy today tbf as my rent has gone up 10% (which is currently all I can afford to put into my savings). I have 2 masters degrees but come from a single parent council estate family. Definitely should have made different choices in life

The older I get the more I think that people are far more limited in choices by a combination of genetics and upbringing then we make allowances for .

We’ve always been broke and that has partly been by choice. My boys are all very musical and lessons, exams, orchestras and all that goes with it have cost me what could have been very good savings. Should I have restricted them to one instrument each or told them to take a ball to the park with their friends, perhaps but it’s a wonderful gift to have and whist none of them have decided to go into music as a career, there’s no doubt that it looks good on a CV and they have all got good jobs in other fields so, thankfully, they won’t need a house deposit from me.

I’d say that depends on the area you live in. Where we live - not so much.

Not true.
It depends how much you earn.

If you earn a lot, you can save a lot. Generational wealth makes a massive difference, but it's not the only way.

Yeah I would have more money if I didn't have expensive tastes. I do spend too much

Do you know whether the person who has this theory has any personal experience with poverty, or they’ve just seen a few poor people and decided that that must be the reason?

Agree, some people definitely do as they are too busy spending the little money they have buying box fresh trainers, hair extensions, fillers, fake nails, all the latest fashion trends etc in attempt to keep up with the jones ( who probably also have no money) and try and give the appearance of wealth

Totally agree.

Friend 1 complained she was broke. I asked if she thought about selling one of her cars given how much money they'd save on running it + have the money from selling it as well. They run 2 cars for a 2 adult household both working from home and live in an increasingly pedestrianised small city where driving is difficult and parking next to impossible. No they couldn't possibly give up a car.

Friend 2 complained she was broke. Renting a 3 storey house for £700/month just her. Asked her if she'd considered taking in a lodger since the landlord had no problem with it and she'd still have a whole floor to herself. No she couldn't possibly.

Friend 3 complained she was broke. Asked her if she'd considered selling her iPhone (worth over £1k) and just keeping the SIM card and sticking it in an older smartphone she had. No she couldn't possibly.

Lots of people choosing to be broke and complaining about it.

If you don’t have much money life is more expensive and very much stressful.
So you have a car because you live rurally and shit public transport, you can’t afford to pay insurance all at once so get charged extra to pay monthly. Your car maybe older and cost more to maintain .You can’t afford to buy a full tank of petrol so make extra trips to get it weekly. The only bank accounts/ credit cards/ loans you can get are at a massive apr as your credit score might be low.You fall behind with gas and electric and need prepay meters. Your family can’t afford to help you if you have an emergency with no money spare to cover it.

Really hard up ppl have a very difficult life, and it’s not necessarily because they don’t work hard or full time, as someone said it can be difficult to increase your income if you already work 40 hours have no childcare to do extra, maybe not getting the maintenance you should. You just try your hardest.

I think some of it is psychological.

I used to be one of those people who had an ASOS basket full of clothes, ready to hit “buy” on payday. Always had a decent income, always spent it. Money burns a hole in my pocket, and there’s a lovely instant gratification from spending it.

I am better now, by necessity rather than choice. I get that shopping fix on the occasional Vinted buy. But I’ve still never cracked being able to save for what I see as no reason.

I can save for things - house deposit, wedding, holiday etc. But otherwise, my savings accounts run empty and my shopping baskets would run full if they could!