Am I a far right extremist?

[Isitme245]

I had a conversation with my best friend of 25 years the other day and she called me a far right extremist and how my views are scary, dangerous and 'nazi coded'
I was really shocked as I didn't think any of what I said was bad. I'm not a particularly avid supporter of any political party and very much keep opinions to myself. She's very supportive of labour and anti trump and always has been. Usually when she asks me my opinions I just don't want to get into it but I did the other night and now I feel bad.

Here's the breakdown:

• she sent me an article and told me that Nigel Farage is going to ban abortion eventually if he wins an election. I read the article and pointed out he only suggested lowering the abortion cut off date to 22 weeks (not 24 as it is now). I told her it wasn't the end of the world and it's reasonable if you read his reasons. I also made the point that men shouldn't really be getting involved in abortion law but that what he said wasn't the end of the world.

• she asked me about immigration and I said that it's great but that we should be prioritising skilled immigrants and have stronger immigration laws. She also asked about asylum seekers and hotels and I said that we should have stronger laws about monitoring people and collecting documentation when people arrive.

• she sent me and asked about Elon Musk's Nazi salute and I said I didn't interpret it that way

• I said that immigrants who rape or murder should be deported.

To me this feels really reasonable and not over the top but she really attacked me for it? Now I feel really awkward and uncomfortable talking to her. Is this far right??

I agree with all your points. They are entirely reasonable and I would bet they're shared by the vast majority of Brits, some more quietly than others.

You are not far right, but anyone on the left will consider you to be so.

I agree with every point you've made. One thing I have noticed is that Labour voters are generally very liberal until you disagree with them, or dare to vote for anyone other than Labour.

@Sleepysleepycoffeecoffee "You are not far right, but anyone on the left will consider you to be so."

I'm on the left and I don't. Because I understand what words mean.

At some point our politicians realised that material reality is not as exciting as beliefs and its easier to manipulate feelings than it is to deal with facts.

Make people afraid.
Encourage division through lies.
Blame whatever bogeyman you have at hand, immigrants, religions, minorities, feminists, gay people, the Woke (left wing Illuminati). Proclaim to be their Saviour.

I think your views are only slightly right, and you were questioning some of the points she raised.
A couple of posts mention that due to the negative reaction you should keep your views yourself - I have a real issue with that view as it really only applies to people who are viewed to be more right. Everyone has a right to their view and people should not be silenced

The people he referred to as far right were, the anti-vaxers are conspiracy theorists. As the judge who investigated the complaint against Khan noted “some participants in the protest outside PQT were expressing conspiracy theories which are associated with far-Right political views”.

Nobody was silenced, although the complaint sought to silence Khan.

Just admit you were misinformed by Gbeebies or whatever, and move on. Or better still, stop being so gullible and check things out yourself rather than repeating shyte you've been fed.

"Tory assembly member Peter Fortune said: “If you disagree with the Mayor, he’s going to paint you as far-Right. His assembly colleague Andrew Boff said: “If you disagree with him on Ulez, you get called a Nazi.”

You're doing their work for them.

Seems I’ve hit a nerve.

It is an interesting analysis but I have an alternative one.

You use turn of phrase “I watched Elons speech live” and that is exactly what you were being led to do - watch it, not listen to it. Who has been been discussing what he said? Not many, everyone has been talking about the “Nazi Salute”,

Heres why it wasn’t a “Nazi Salute” although I think it was deliberate..

The salute has been used for centuries in different situations, some of which you will have to search for yourself as I can’t say. It was a popular depiction of a Roman greeting shown most notably in Romantic art, it has widely been seen as a greeting in various situations, all of which predate the Nazis. Of course most people now associate it with Hitler and the Nazi party (although of course it was also (and probably predating the Nazi use) used by Mussolini.

Therefore, in order to be a “Nazi Salute” one must establish intention (although several countries - maybe understandably don’t draw that distinction. So did Musk intend to use that gesture as a Nazi Salute or greeting? I don’t think so. I think his intention was to make some people leap to the conclusion he was doing a Nazi Salute.

Why do I draw that distinction? Is it important?

I have found very little, if any, evidence of Musk aligning with Nazi ideology specifically. I don’t think he shares many actual far right views.

So why would he want people to think he was doing a Nazi Salute? You only have to look at his general MO, His way of gaining power is to divide and conquer. Every time he weighs in anywhere, sets up opportunities for discussion he very quickly facilitates a binary situation, he sparks arguments he knows will get the increasingly polarised masses shouting at each other.

So that seems a lot of effort to go to. Why? Firstly I think this fuels him he feeds off the arguments he causes - he gets a dopamine hit out of it that enables him to keep moving. Secondly divide and conquer. You watched his speech, did you listen to it? He did his “Nszi Salute” just before he told everyone his purpose was to plant flags (inc on Mars). For anyone listening rather than frothing about a hand gesture, This man was stating his intention to create an empire not just on Earth, there was no celebration of the current- he was interested in the future- he’s going to use Trump to pave the way, I’m not saying Trump will get assassinated on the steps of the senate, but I suspect this will happen metaphorically.

I would just look at her baffled and say 'why are you trying to categorise my views along a single left-right dimension when political ideology is clearly a multi dimensional space?' At least it might shut her up.

If you are genuinely interested in where you stand, then his website allows you to categorise your views according to both social and fiscal left-right https://www.politicalcompass.org/ I was bottom left quadrant on this but would not be a million miles away from some of your positions, though would emphasize other issues more, related to inequalities. I deliberately haven't bothered to examine the hand gestures of an attention seeking oligarch. His power comes via massive Internet presence and so refusing to engage seems like one way to resist, though he does worry me (aarg, I'm discussing him online!)

There are other websites that use three political dimensions. Three should be enough to take the wind out of her rather tribal sails...

Exactly right, I agree. Woe betide anyone who Disagrees with what a person who labels themselves Left Wing says. Why, such people must be FASCISTS!!

It reminds me of certain people who call me an INFIDEL, for being an atheist.

Very very similar thought processes. Or logic, if you will.

Yeah, I can't abide stupid people who repeat demonstrable lies, then vote to make their lives and everyone else's worse.

Polite conversation -
don’t talk money, sex, politics or religion! It’s difficult to know which way the conversation will go - mostly badly!

A good way to cope with people pushing their view is:
Are you venting frustration about politics ?
Trying to educate me about your view?
Are you wanting my opinion?

A person close to me rants on and on - when there’s a pause I ask -
what are you looking for from me?

A lot of time I say, I don’t know enough about this but I think there’s complexity here….

on the abortion I might say .. I know a parent of a child born at 24 weeks…. Maybe Nigel does as well. Or, 24 weeks, that’s very far gone, that would have to be an extreme exception as its SIX months pregnant. Maybe if screening has determined child won’t survive full term and birth, but otherwise an “unwanted” pregnancy at 6 months is problematic. NHS means no bills to pay to progress birth to adoption. These days, tests available at boots detect pregnancy very very early. Men are not incapable of having rational thoughts about this.

I hold similar views to yourself op.
Let her call you whatever she wants. Far right and other names like that have lost all impact.
They are meaningless…if anything they simply mean ‘I disagree with you’.

Wow, you want some gel for your aching muscles after that leap?

Elon salute - creepy Elon salute - creepy Creepy Elon Salute

Going off on a tangent. I find this salute to be really creepy. Even if he isn’t a secret Nazi it’s a very fascist and domineering kind of salute.
Like he sees himself as some sort of God for being rich.

Quite severe and intentional this salute isn’t it ? The straightness of his arm and rigidity.

Elon has denied it’s a Nazi salute but it does look distinctly the same.

Even if Elon claims it’s not Nazi, he still hasn’t acknowledged it’s not appropriate to repeatedly do a hand guesture similar.

He doesn’t say “the holocaust was a stain on humanity and I’d never support such Nazi ideology and it wasn’t my intention”

Instead he says something about how it’s not always about anti semitism and uses his denial to make an attack on people who he thinks are too defensive and too sensitive and not deserving of credibility regarding anti semitism.

Even if it was originally a Roman salute, the fact the Nazis took it on and commited genocide should takeover that fact and mean it’s left in history.

It was a nazi salute I'm not sure how else it could be interpreted. He is a very dangerous person. But both he and Trump have extremely large egos so I'm sure they will fall out soon.
But I don't know why you posted. You must know your views are right wing.
Some people will disagree with you and some won't.

See my post at 13:11

A still of Macron waving, you say?

https://x.com/Basil_TGMD/status/1882930215082655866

Reading between the lines, this was a coversation about NF, who you support and your friend recognises what a racist, self-interested grifter he is. I would say anyone who supports Reform UK, and Farage in particular, is far right.

Lots of people knocking out nazi salutes wouldn't be entirely politically aligned with the Nazi party. They do it because it's shocking. Musk deployed it in the same fashion.

I don't know how you could interpret Musk's Nazi salute as anything else. If it walks like a Nazi, talks like a Nazi, endorses Nazis, pardons Nazis...... it's probably a Nazi. This is Musk who has publicly endorsed Tommy Robinson. I mean if you dont think it's a Nazi salute, what could it possibly be? Bear in mind he has not come out publicly to say that it wasn't.

Nowadays, it seems immigration is the only shibboleth that matters: anything short of 'open borders; all are welcome' seems to mark you down as 'right-wing' to some extent. I can't help thinking this is assisted by a mighty helping of virtue-signalling.

No it doesn't. It's a lie that is being pushed by GB News and other right whingers. The reality is very different. Last year we had a GE where immigration was consistently recorded as being in the top 5 concerns of voters. All the parties talked about it. Only a tiny minority of people want Open borders.

I don't think I would call you extreme right wing but not sure how you interpreted the salute as anything else! With regards to abortion, I discussed this once with someone who was very pro choice and its about drawing a line. If you move it to 22 weeks, someone else will come along, and try to move it to 20 weeks etc. I remember also reading that late abortions almost never happen and are often related to serious medical issues for mother/foetus. So the argument used by Farage is emotionally manipulative.

Personally I get bored of both sides bashing each other. Care about the climate left wing looney. Worried about immigration right wing nut. All the people throwing these insults around are the problem, making society more and more divided.

I cannot understand why so many people are tying themselves up in knots trying to defend the salute.
As a supporter of the AfD, and Tommy Robinson, it is obvious where his allegiances lie, and then to carry out a gesture like that on the world stage,
it's frightening to be honest.

Moving the abortion limit is just the start. Given the chance pro lifers would move it to 22, and lower and lower until it is illegal and women have even less autonomy over their bodies than they already do.

For me being pro choice means trusting that a women who chooses to terminate her pregnancy at 24 weeks or further does so with the support of skilled medical staff and in absolutely tiny amounts of cases. And that is her choice.