Parents V Teachers

[shoogalypeg]

Whilst I do have some sympathy for teachers in this current climate I can’t help but feel that if you can’t handle the heat then get out of the kitchen, which they’re doing in droves and this leaves mostly hardened, jaded individuals who have no business working with children.

I guess this leads onto a really important question:

What can parents do to improve things that doesn’t involve ignoring unprofessional behaviour from teachers?

YABU - cut teachers some slack/parents are powerless to change the system
YANBU - as a parent I’m worried AND feel I have a part to play

(if neither of the above options fit then please elaborate below)

@TheWonderhorse
So 3 in 3 years? Hardly a huge issue then and certainly not something a teacher would have time to deal with!
I taught for 20 years, primary and secondary and during that time the only response I saw to any traumatic events/ abuse etc was withdrawal not poor behaviour.
Seeing how defensive you are and how unwilling you are to listen to anyone else’s viewpoint I can only imagine how a conversation home would go!

Defensive how? I haven't got anything I need to defend myself from. I suggested a system I think would work better than the current one and provide some meaningful feedback. That's all.

As for "how the conversation would go," what are you even talking about? I don't need to have a conversation about my own children, but others might about theirs. I don't think that's a bad thing. I don't understand your aggressive response to someone so simple and so benign. If I were to expand out from your communication to me then I would say you'd be talking to parents having already decided they're shit. I don't think that helps. I am also inclined to believe you wouldn't be like this outside this forum though and are venting at me for fun.

That schools are under-resourced and underfunded is not the fault of parents. I'm actively trying to ease the shortfall by being active with the PTA. By all means think what you like about my motives, but I'm not the problem.

3 in 3 years is a home conversation of, "you've made a mistake - learn from it - move on". You do not need to waste teachers time with that.

@TheWonderhorse
The normal response when someone is clueless about how impractical a suggestion they have made is to admit that they are wrong and say something like ‘oh I hadn’t thought of that’ You haven’t done that, instead you’ve shown absolutely no empathy for teachers or their workload. Despite a few of us telling you that there simply isn’t enough time in the day to sit there writing comments about every behaviour incident. I can only imagine how you would act towards a teacher if you didn’t agree with their opinion! Teachers are leaving in droves, morale is shit! People suggesting that they should be doing more work is going to get people’s backs up! It’s admirable that you want to support the school and are on the PTA etc but thinking a bit of PTA fundraising is going to help the staffing budget is a bit like a 5 year old offering their parents their pocket money to pay the mortgage! There’s no way any amount of PTA funding can raise anywhere near the necessary shortfall! The best way you can support your children’s school is by not expecting them to increase their workload, especially when your child’s behaviour clearly isn’t even an issue in the first place!

Most schools do this. Have you spoken to the school and suggested it?

Because I disagree that it would increase workload. I'm being told most schools do it by some people, and that it isn't possible by others.

Oh and I was explaining about the PTA to show that I do actually give a shit enough to do what I can.

My child's behaviour not being an issue shows that I was putting forward ideas to help teachers, not myself.

But again, I'm being called all sorts.

that I was putting forward ideas to help teachers,

And how many actual teachers on this thread have explained to you @TheWonderhorse - politely (and far more respectfully than you deserve), why you are wrong?

You are not a teacher, and you demonstrate with each post that you have little knowledge of what the work is like.

Other people are telling me that most schools already do what I suggest. So I can't be that wrong.

Why don't I deserve respect? I'm being labelled as the problem for suggesting something that apparently is already in place in many other schools according to PP.

You can pick and choose which sentences you reply to but avoid the bigger picture all you like. I haven't said anything controversial or rude. It's in fact so uncontroversial that it's in place in schools.

I am not a teacher, no. But the hostility I'm getting here for making a suggestion is batshit.

@TheWonderhorse

‘Because I disagree that it would increase workload. I'm being told most schools do it by some people, and that it isn't possible by others.’

You are starting to irritate me now. Surely you have the basic intelligence and ability to understand that this will vary depending on the program being used, the setting and the number of students involved? It isn’t possible on any of the ones I’ve used and completely unacceptable for teachers to be expected to increase their workload. I haven’t seen anyone on here tell you otherwise. As you’ve been told a few times now, the average teacher encounters 150-200 students PER DAY! The increase in workload that you are suggesting is huge.
Teachers already put in amongst the most unpaid hours as it is and this sort of shitty attitude is a huge factor in the numbers leaving the profession.

‘My child's behaviour not being an issue shows that I was putting forward ideas to help teachers, not myself.
But again, I'm being called all sorts.’

So the situation is irrelevant to you and as you’ve demonstrated you know absolutely nothing about teaching so why are you even bothering if it’s not to troll and rile people? I don’t see any teachers on here suggesting how your job can be improved, probably because they aren’t arrogant enough to think that they can offer advice on something they have no idea about! Apparently on MN everyone and is dog is an expert on teaching because they helped their child download a worksheet during lockdown, I mean that’s clearly all that’s involved in teaching. These lazy teachers with too many holidays only working 9-3, they wouldn’t cope in the real world etc. You can claim this isn’t what you think as much as you like but it’s entirely how you are coming across. I would stop now because you’re making yourself look ridiculous! If it’s so easy then there are thousands of places on teacher training courses, you’d be welcomed with open arms!

@TheWonderhorse

@LittleBigHead makes valid points.

The only batshit thing I can see here is repeatedly making ridiculous suggestions and arguing when you’re being given valid reasons why your suggestions won’t work. Even more batshit that you are trying to make suggestions about a job you know fuck all
about!

Right. It seems you're angry at me for things other people think. I can't do anything about that.

I am seeing that teachers have a lot more disdain for parents generally than I thought. It's been quite eye-opening to be honest.

If my customers had a polite suggestion which might make my job easier, even if it was wrong, then I wouldn't think them arrogant. It's just an idea and not intended to do anything but help. If you don't want help from parents then fine, but remember you're posting on a parent forum about your problems. People are quite likely to respond in an effort to be constructive.

It clearly does work, because it's used in other schools.

@TheWonderhorse I think what you're suggesting does happen in many schools. We have categories for negative behaviour which I cluse things like "low level disruption" or "mobile phone use" or "lack of work". The positive rewards have categories too, like you describe. It doesn't take any longer to allocate the category really, once you've selected it as a negative.
However I wouldn't want the teacher to have to write something every time, that would be time consuming.

That does sound like something much more useful than the system our school uses. Ours gives categories for positive behaviour but not negative, which is the wrong way around in my view.

We have the option to write extra information in positive and negative. The positive comments go home, the negatives are used for internal tracking as we know there would be extra email traffic generated by parents nitpicking over an account of an event.
Apologies if I was rude earlier, I didn't quite understand what you were suggesting.

What system does the school use?

My son does have ADHD. A teacher said to him " can't you do anything " She was shocked I called her out on it.
Oh and behaviour wise he is fine.
Some teachers are unprofessional.

Ah okay, so parents don't see the negatives? That's on purpose so parents don't overreact? Oh that's a shame. I totally appreciate some parents would pick at it all, but for others it's information we would really like. We use Class Charts. I suppose the software takes away the ability to communicate to the individual parent. You have to treat everyone the same, whereas in a conversation you could get a feel for what you can say.

No need to apologise, honestly. I'm a hardened AIBU dweller and I'm grateful for your insight. Thank you for debunking my idea in a way that makes sense 🙂

The parents don't see any extra notes, but they do see the category if that makes sense.
I've no experience with Class Charts, you'd have thought there would be a way for it to do this if it can for the positives.

Yes that does make sense. I wish we had that. What software do you use? If you don't mind me asking.

Arbor
Have previously used SIMS and Edulink to do effectively the same thing.

We have Edulink too, but they use that for distributing reports not general day to day stuff. I might pop them an email.

Thank you!

Lobby the government for change. That's the only way to bring about meaingful, long-lasting change.

I’m not remotely angry 😂 I’m calling you out on your bullshit.
I don’t have any issue with parents who let teachers do their jobs, show respect and actually accept what they are told. Unfortunately, respectful parents like this are decreasing in numbers. There’s another thread on here about why teachers are leaving the profession and the behaviour of parents features highly on the list of reasons. Some of the things teachers have had to put up with are outrageous. I don’t believe teachers have ‘distain’ for parents at all. They are just exasperated by the way they are spoken to and treated by parents. They can’t turn round and tell them to fuck off so you are going to find them venting on here and understandably with little tolerance to being told how to do their jobs by clueless individuals.
It’s admirable that you would happily take on board suggestions from customers about ways to improve your business but I doubt you’d feel the same if you had this day in day out and if they wouldn’t accept your response as to why it wouldn’t work.
This simply doesn’t happen in other jobs to the extent that it does in teaching. I’ve been in my new role for 6 months and not once has a customer been rude to me so far or made a suggestion as to how I could do my job properly. I am treated with respect, something that never happened when I was teaching.

What bullshit are you calling me out on exactly?

You absolutely sound angry, ranting at me about loads of things that I haven't done, and thoughts I don't believe.

What I was advocating for happens in lots of schools, and can be done.