To feel everyone is anti trans?

[Kitjo]

I'm well aware of current US views led by Trump - but are these views generally held/supported in the UK? Of course I understand opinions on NHS gender reassignment funding, as well as controversies over trans women in sport. Needless to say I'm fully aware of concerns over women's safety issues. Are there any sympathisers or supporters out there? What about trans masculine folk who are surely no threat to women's safety or sport? None of these people would choose such a hard life, socially, financially, physically, mentally, emotionally... am I alone in thinking a bit of kindness and compassion towards the trans community might be appreciated for the massive personal struggles they have to face? I am open minded to hearing and understanding your views.

In my nhs career, I have met a few trans patients a year for decades. We accept their names, pronouns etc. no big deal at all.

Did you place men who identified as trans on women’s wards? Was sacrificing the privacy safety and dignity of the women on those wards also ‘no big deal’? Did you record them as female undermining sex based statistics including future epidemiological research? Was that also ‘no big deal’? Did you force others who recognised that sex matter to also go along with this man’s delusion and theft of female language for fear of disciplining/loss of job?

If I hadn't cared, in ten years time my beautiful daughter would be dealing with long term health issues caused by 'gender affirming surgery'.

If it doesn't impact you that's great, but it affects some of us, and our loved ones, very deeply.

But the thing is, in that case, everyone was wrong. Sex by deception is wrong, stabbing someone is wrong. Filming sex acts without permission is wrong.

So, why is it wrong to point out that trans person was wrong for not being upfront about being male? I don't think anyone was saying it was okay that they were brutally attacked for it, were they?

Trans people can do bad things too.

As well as pretty much all of the above, even if it were possible to change sex, the legal falsification of birth certificates is absolutely bonkers.

UK BCs will state whether the baby is either a Boy or a Girl. This means that, if it were intended to be a current document for your whole life, rather than simply a record of the circumstances of your actual birth, everybody would need a new BC on their 18th birthday, when they are no longer a girl or boy, but now a woman or a man.

What about if you move to a different town of your birth? Or your parents change occupations? Or they die? Surely this should all be updated as well - so future generations doing genealogy research will see an apparently heartbreaking BC clearly stating that the person's mother and father were deceased at the time of their birth, when in fact they lived until they were both 105 and the BC has just been 'updated' to reflect this when the holder is 80.

Same with the trans Guardian journalist who went through the courts seeking to be named as the 'father' of the baby she'd been pregnant with and given birth to.

Once we start deliberately falsifying factual legal documents and rewrite history, mass book-burnings can't be far behind.

What about your intolerance for the safety, dignity and privacy of females?

Not everyone is anti trans, a few of my friends are very pro. I really object to being called a cis woman. I'm just a woman thank you. I don't believe in it, I think it's a mental health issue and needs to be dealt in that way not pretend a man or woman can be in the wrong body, it's body dysmorphia and they need help to learn to be happy in the body they were born with. I don't go around shouting my opinion as it's really nothing to do with me what people do with their own bodies. I do object to people telling my children it is OK though and normal. I tell my children to be tolerant of others but you don't have to agree with everything people do. A lot of these young kids coming out as trans and non binary and whatever other made up words are just exposed too much and it's social contagion and the in thing at the moment. I don't want my kids exposed to nonsense like that if that makes me a bigot or anti trans then fine.

I don’t believe people who were born male should be allowed to use women’s spaces - on a sports team, female toilets, female hospital wards, female prisons. It’s up to them what names they choose to call themselves and what clothes they wear.

@ChessorBuckaroo everyone here has been absolutely lovely. I have no idea what you think you have been reading but it has been an absolutely fair minded and thoughtful debate.

and the case you refer to was sexual assault. Didn’t excuse what happened afterwards which was abhorrent but doesn’t negate that there were 2 (3 including the videoing) crimes. We should absolutely not gloss over that and we should be able to discuss it without being shut down.

I'm not anti-trans but I believe that many are victims with mental heath illness. Last year I was surprised to see a poster in my GP reception offering help to those who were not ok with their decision to transition.

Dud you watch the fantastic series I May Destroy You?

The issue of consent in many different contexts was explored… and in one memorable scene the trans character tells a date, at the earliest opportunity, that they are trans. Because that is the basis of consent. The relationship flourished, so was a positive representation of a trans relationship.

Most people I know do see this as an issue of consent.

Whilst also, of course, condemning stabbing people under any circumstances.

Yes. I could not fathom how institutions whose ONE job it was to guard against this fell head over heels into it, and capitulated with a sneering and vicious contempt for those who couldn't or wouldn't. Trust has completely collapsed. I was forced out of my default liberal complacency and nothing will ever bring it back. I can't be the only person feeling deeply alienated and isolated now, and hyper vigilant for the next threat.

“Just getting on with their lives”

😄

They’re not though are they. They are seeking to redefine how the human race is classified, with the resulting impact on rights that go with those current classifications. And without so much as a by-your-leave (#NODEBATE!)

There are a few really decent transexual men I've seen on X who are campaigning for the protection of women's rights and although they have been transexual for decades they are called transphobic by the TRAs because they don't believe that their body dysphoria is more important than women's rights, and the TRAs only allow for one opinion. The decent transexuals who mean no harm and want to live in peace and not destroy rights are also victims of this utter madness.

You mean you don’t leave your echo chamber?

I'm pro women personally.

Also think trans is nonsense 🙄 I don't believe in the ideology. Homophobic regressive based on outdated stereotypes. Harmful to children and women's rights.

Tbf, I’m on here and Reddit and there isn’t a big amount of difference in hatred. Some of the things people comment on here are awful. But then I only follow gardening and hobby subreddits.

If you follow "gardening and hobby subreddits" you're not really getting a picture of all the grim misogyny in that male dominated, porn soaked site. So not really qualified to pronounce on it.

I think part of the problem is that social media fuels this idea that you have to be pro or against something with absolutely no nuance.

For example. I don't care if a trans women uses the women's toilets. I don't get the hyperbole over this. I've heard all the arguments and I think they're ridiculous. You don't actually pee in front of anyone.

On the other hand, I don't think trans women should be competing in women's sports. It's unfair and in some sports it's outright dangerous.

So the anti trans folk probably think I'm an awful human being for point one, and the pro trans folk probably think I'm an awful human being for point two.

The lack of nuance in modern society worries me. We are becoming more and more divided over the most absurd issues.

A male in the ladies, a safe intimate single sex space, IS invading it. What else are they doing? Why do you think we have male and female separate toilets? For the fun of it?

This absolutely 💯

👏👏👏👏

As a other poster said I don’t care if people
are trans . What I do care about is that now they are more visible in society more representation, everyone else is expected to get on board with with needs and demands- just like that. No consideration for how we ourselves have been brought up and under what social norms.’ Am I concerned that my teenage daughter could be in a loo with someone with male genitalia- yes I am!!!

This is so true. One of these transsexuals (who had been so for years) was sued for transphobia by a transactivist - as far as I could tell pretty much for telling the truth. So much for 'being kind' - of course the weaponised kindness is only ever supposed to go one way. It's about power and control really, definitely not kindness. You couldn't make it up.

@Squizzersontherun the thing is, there are genuinely trans people like your poor DC, and there are those who are using it to bully others re: pronouns. Some of these kids are not dysphoric, they just identify because they think they don't conform to gender stereotypes enough. It's tragic.

If someone gets your pronouns wrong, what's the worst that can happen? The adult thing to do is correct them and move on. Teachers should not fear being taken to court because of a pronoun mistake. Why can't tolerance go both ways?

You sound no better than people 60 years ago who used to think that all gay people were paedophiles.

Are you aware of how homophobic much trans rights activism is? They literally deny that people are exclusively same sex attracted.

Because children are not 'born in the wrong body', that is why the Bishop is being ripped apart!

No other group has managed the get the definition of woman changed, get us called 'cervix havers', 'bleeders', 'menstruators', 'birthing person', not gays. ONLY trans. This, shows the ENORMOUS POWER trans women have.