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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Cancel Culture, is it over?

133 replies

B0xes · 12/01/2025 11:56

AIBU to think that the vibe has shifted? I think it has, something about Trudeau standing down seems to confirm this.

But I know there are still people (often those trying to engage in it) who say it never even was a thing. Was it?

Maybe it's still in full force. But it feels like something has changed. Does it take a while for everyone to realise?

OP posts:
HellsBalls · 12/01/2025 13:37

HellsBalls · 12/01/2025 13:26

Cancel would be to silence Kier and Nigel. Musk is not doing that. He is campaigning against them. It’s different things.
If Musk banned Farage from X, then that is being cancelled.

Also to add, berating people by calling them racists when discussing black knife crime statistics, or the Pakistani pedos, or the amount of immigration, is also cancel culture.
I’m glad it seems to be over.

AlisonDonut · 12/01/2025 13:44

B0xes · 12/01/2025 11:56

AIBU to think that the vibe has shifted? I think it has, something about Trudeau standing down seems to confirm this.

But I know there are still people (often those trying to engage in it) who say it never even was a thing. Was it?

Maybe it's still in full force. But it feels like something has changed. Does it take a while for everyone to realise?

He hasn't stood down. He has said he intends to stand down.

He has prorogued parliament which means nobody can do anything to stop him until I think it is April. He did this to avoid a vote of no confidence.

I don't think we have seen the last of him yet.

allcatnofiller · 12/01/2025 14:29

HellsBalls · 12/01/2025 13:26

Cancel would be to silence Kier and Nigel. Musk is not doing that. He is campaigning against them. It’s different things.
If Musk banned Farage from X, then that is being cancelled.

I think cancel culture is also just a form of campaigning against someone. The difference is that Elon owns twitter and controls it's algorithm. He has the power to ban someone from twitter. Apart from Zuckerberg, no one else has that kind of power although of course if there is huge public support, the pressure is quite persuasive. Don't get me wrong I think cancel culture can be very cruel and over reactive. My point is social media will always 'campaign' intensely against people deserving or not. Nothing has changed.

ThDanielDay · 12/01/2025 14:40

So with the decade long cancel culture war, which famous or powerful people have been cancelled?

spannasaurus · 12/01/2025 14:46

ThDanielDay · 12/01/2025 14:40

So with the decade long cancel culture war, which famous or powerful people have been cancelled?

Gillian Phillip
Louise Distras
Graham Lineham
amongst others

Ponoka7 · 12/01/2025 15:41

HappyPanda613 · 12/01/2025 12:31

I have been very disappointed in the gender critical movement, though I won’t go to bat against them here because I understand this place is a bit of a gender critical fortress. All I’ll say is that, it sort of shattered the illusion I had that bigotry was exclusively the realm of white men.

Look up the definition of bigotry and then reread what you think is a bigoted post. You'll find very very few bigoted posters. Only those who don't want rights lost by biological women when there isn't any need to have those rights lost. Sex matters.

Compash · 12/01/2025 15:45

ilovesooty · 12/01/2025 12:51

I don't think so. To clarify - I don't think the thread is a joke.

Edited

The winking emoji tipped me off...

😉

Compash · 12/01/2025 15:47

spannasaurus · 12/01/2025 14:46

Gillian Phillip
Louise Distras
Graham Lineham
amongst others

And they've been trying like hell to cancel J K Rowling, but the lady's not for cancelling...

✊

LittleMyLittle · 12/01/2025 15:50

ThDanielDay · 12/01/2025 14:40

So with the decade long cancel culture war, which famous or powerful people have been cancelled?

Famous and powerful people usually aren't the primary targets and this is, I think, a huge reason why it's such a problem.

Moderately well-known people are more vulnerable because they are in the public eye but lack a lot of the fame and power which insulates them. Someone like Jesse Singal is going to be far worse affected by libel and dox attempts than an A-list celebrity who can afford the best legal protection.

But most of the targets of these kind of campaigns are simply everyday people, and an enormous percentage are from socially disadvantaged groups. Many are women, or working class, or from minority ethnic groups or religions. They tend to get hit with much more force and vitriol than well-known white men - horrific slurs, threats of SA, and other verbal abuse that is very specific to that which makes them socially vulnerable.

The people driving these harassment campaigns are usually cowards and bullies. They primarily go after vulnerable people they think they can intimidate into capitulation. From my observations, they also tend to go after people for the written word rather than people who are more physically dangerous, and protect white men who say all the right things.

I'm young and female, and I refuse to have much of an online presence (even one where I don't speak on controversial topics) because the risk to my offline identity and safety just isn't worth it.

TheKeatingFive · 12/01/2025 15:59

HappyPanda613 · 12/01/2025 12:31

I have been very disappointed in the gender critical movement, though I won’t go to bat against them here because I understand this place is a bit of a gender critical fortress. All I’ll say is that, it sort of shattered the illusion I had that bigotry was exclusively the realm of white men.

Why on earth do you think women who say that material reality matters are 'bigoted'? Seems an extraordinary position to take.

biscuitandcake · 12/01/2025 17:51

2020: "This celebrity is racist" "I don't think its racist" "Denying racism is racism. You are a racist . Anyway the most important thing is drawing attention to the issue, not whether what I am specifically saying is true"

2025: "Jess Phillips is a rape genocide apologist" "Thats not fair" "I can't believe you don't care about grooming gangs. This is just another example of how sick the left is, you would cover it all up if you could. At least Elon is drawing attention to the issue even if he is talking nonsense just to be decisive"

I could give lots of other examples...

What has happened is the US election etc has persuaded a new group of people that they are now in charge of the drama triangle. This is mostly online based. For people who just generally care about policies/making thigs better who gets to be in charge of castigating others isn't the most important thing.

biscuitandcake · 12/01/2025 17:58

Oh, just to avoid doubt. Racism is a serious and very real problem, as is black people being disproportionately targetted/killed by police especially in America. It was really important to have a discussion about that. What happened was the discussion quickly became hijacked (partly as a result of people's real anger) byt people who just enjoyed discord/winning arguments or actively wanted to derail discussions. The grooming scandal was also very serious and its very important to be able to discuss it.... oh, you know where I am going with this.
But, either way if expressing an opinion on e.g. Twitter instantly leads to death and rape threats on Twitter and that is allowed, then no-one really has free speech on Twitter.

B0xes · 12/01/2025 18:25

tailinthejam · 12/01/2025 12:14

I have what can only be described as a complete lack of interest in the topic.

So what on earth did you bother coming into a thread to declare this for? You've posted a couple of times to tell us this, it's weird behaviour

OP posts:
B0xes · 12/01/2025 18:27

Maddy70 · 12/01/2025 12:54

Literally no idea what you're talking about

Maybe need a separate thread on debanking then

OP posts:
B0xes · 12/01/2025 18:41

biscuitandcake · 12/01/2025 17:51

2020: "This celebrity is racist" "I don't think its racist" "Denying racism is racism. You are a racist . Anyway the most important thing is drawing attention to the issue, not whether what I am specifically saying is true"

2025: "Jess Phillips is a rape genocide apologist" "Thats not fair" "I can't believe you don't care about grooming gangs. This is just another example of how sick the left is, you would cover it all up if you could. At least Elon is drawing attention to the issue even if he is talking nonsense just to be decisive"

I could give lots of other examples...

What has happened is the US election etc has persuaded a new group of people that they are now in charge of the drama triangle. This is mostly online based. For people who just generally care about policies/making thigs better who gets to be in charge of castigating others isn't the most important thing.

I disagree. Plenty of people are opting out of academia because of the culture there. These are absolutely thoughtful, intelligent people who care. What this leaves are many sadists who believe they are on the right side of history to shape our policies going forward. I think parallel competing institutions will rise around them - I certainly hope they will.

OP posts:
biscuitandcake · 12/01/2025 18:56

B0xes · 12/01/2025 18:41

I disagree. Plenty of people are opting out of academia because of the culture there. These are absolutely thoughtful, intelligent people who care. What this leaves are many sadists who believe they are on the right side of history to shape our policies going forward. I think parallel competing institutions will rise around them - I certainly hope they will.

Yes,

But Musk also believes he is on the right side of history. The way you have been describing the issue around "cancel culture" also shows you see yourself on the side of "good" versus "woke". And that what is happening now is the REAL right side of history (that coincidentally happens to be all the things you support) is gaining ground now at last. The world is more complicated than that. And now I shall retire and cry my liberal tears.

OneLemonDog · 12/01/2025 19:02

Equating Trudeau's response to the "Freedom Convoy" to cancel culture is nuts.

OneLemonDog · 12/01/2025 19:22

The Freedom Convoy was a prolonged and illegal protest, that resulted in billions of dollars of damage to Canada's economy - damage that worsened with each passing day that it was allowed to persist. They also, essentially, harassed a whole city for weeks on end.

There was a reluctance to disburse the convoy by force due to the perceived risk of violence. Notwithstanding that trucks themselves could be used as weapons, a small portion of the "protestors" were stockiping guns, ammunition and other combat gear.

Much of the convoy was funded by groups from outside of Canada (mainly in the US). Cutting off access to their bank accounts put a stop to that, and forced a peaceful end to the process.

Even though a section of the public were sympathetic to the convoys concerns, few in Canada supported their actions.

During the same period in the UK, the Conservatives were passing laws to restrict the right to protest - but I never saw anyone call that "cancel culture".

And you can absolutely guarantee that if Just Stop Oil somehow occupied London for a period of weeks, whilst also blockacading the channel tunnel, costing the economy billions, and some within their ranks were amassing a weapons, all while being funded by donations coming from outside of the UK, the sort of British people who were critical of Trudeau's response to the convoy wouldn't be whinging about "cancel culture" if the government stepped in.

B0xes · 12/01/2025 19:25

biscuitandcake · 12/01/2025 18:56

Yes,

But Musk also believes he is on the right side of history. The way you have been describing the issue around "cancel culture" also shows you see yourself on the side of "good" versus "woke". And that what is happening now is the REAL right side of history (that coincidentally happens to be all the things you support) is gaining ground now at last. The world is more complicated than that. And now I shall retire and cry my liberal tears.

Hmm I suppose you're right. I don't actually want the counter forces to become hegemonic but I have been so psychologically wounded by one side of this I would be lying if I didn't feel full of fury and vegance. I hope this feeling wears off before I get sucked too far off into it. However, when you talk of things being more "complicated than that", I fear they might not be. There is no truth, there is no 'right side', just warring factions of which one must pick one. The friend enemy distinction is all that really matters when that's what those with power believe.

OP posts:
tailinthejam · 12/01/2025 19:41

B0xes · 12/01/2025 18:25

So what on earth did you bother coming into a thread to declare this for? You've posted a couple of times to tell us this, it's weird behaviour

It's a free country so I can post on whatever threads I like. My first post was asking you to explain what you were talking about, which is not weird behaviour at all. You didn't. Not to my satisfaction, anyway.

hth

PureGypsyGold · 12/01/2025 20:06

biscuitandcake · 12/01/2025 17:58

Oh, just to avoid doubt. Racism is a serious and very real problem, as is black people being disproportionately targetted/killed by police especially in America. It was really important to have a discussion about that. What happened was the discussion quickly became hijacked (partly as a result of people's real anger) byt people who just enjoyed discord/winning arguments or actively wanted to derail discussions. The grooming scandal was also very serious and its very important to be able to discuss it.... oh, you know where I am going with this.
But, either way if expressing an opinion on e.g. Twitter instantly leads to death and rape threats on Twitter and that is allowed, then no-one really has free speech on Twitter.

Of course they have free speech. As do the people giving them death threats.

To be cancelled would be to just be kicked off twitter for saying things people don't want you to say.

PureGypsyGold · 12/01/2025 20:10

Compash · 12/01/2025 15:47

And they've been trying like hell to cancel J K Rowling, but the lady's not for cancelling...

✊

Really? I don't know anyone who has a positive opinion of her.

Livinginaclock · 12/01/2025 20:18

PureGypsyGold · 12/01/2025 20:10

Really? I don't know anyone who has a positive opinion of her.

What do those people think she did wrong?

B0xes · 12/01/2025 20:31

tailinthejam · 12/01/2025 19:41

It's a free country so I can post on whatever threads I like. My first post was asking you to explain what you were talking about, which is not weird behaviour at all. You didn't. Not to my satisfaction, anyway.

hth

OK. It's a bit unfair that you are asking me to explain something to you that you have also declared a complete disinterest in. That's rude and insulting.

OP posts:
Lambington · 12/01/2025 20:34

No - it was never a thing. Just a fabricated nonsense concocted by the right wing press which they have now got bored with as it no longer serves them. Just like " political correctness" and "health and safety gone mad" before it.