To send them home? (trigger warning grooming gangs)

[DarkAndConfusingTimes]

The Rape and Grooming scandal is blowing up on twitter/social media and the extent of the scandal is actually mind boggling. Apparently up to 250,000 girls may have been affected 😱

This initially shocked me but when I thought of it, although I’m based in a rural area I know of two girls who have been caught up in it - one of whom in my class at school was raped in a park aged around thirteen and another family friends daughter found naked in a room with a group of adult men at the age of 14 and was blamed for leading them all on. Those living in towns/cities must see so much more of this?!

I’ve also heard today that Pakistan is willing to take back criminals convicted in the Uk of these crimes (UK-Pakistan Prisoner treaty agreement) and has been for a number of years but we’re not sending them back. I know not all perpetrators are Pakistani and not all Pakistani men are capable of such evil (and I work with plenty of decent Pakistani men), but of those who are convicted and born there why on earth are they still here in the UK if we can remove them as a danger from our society and their home country is willing to take them?

In have two daughters and I’m honestly terrified for their future given this significant threat to young girls in this country. It seems like no one cares enough to rock the boat.

YABU - No they should remain here and we should deal with it
YANBU - They should be sent back

we already have regulations about repatriating non-british prisoners on their release. So all we have to do is jail all the perpetrators and then either release them back into their community as usual (British ones) and follow the regulations we created for non-British ones.

No need to start a witch hunt or anything.

What are you debating? The British justice system is dealing with British citizens yet you think they should be sent away?

There is no debate.

This isn't a debate though. Any asking for sources is ignored and you don't come back to any of the points multiple people have put to you.

You just keep saying we need to talk about this but don't actually want to talk.

Do you have a link to where Blair and Brown said that victims of CSA should be ignored?

The way this has all been handled is almost as scary as the crimes themselves.

Im half Indian. And YEARS before the grooming scandal broke my dad took me to the Sikh temple where talks on Muslim grooming gangs were being held. Literally YEARS before it it all came out. The police were told but did nothing. We believe Sikh girls were the first targeted.

I remember being told they would pick out girls with low esteem, buy them gifts, get them drunk/blackmail them with compromising photos, isolate them etc.

In a multi cultural society there has to be a level of transparency and a willingness to call a spade a spade.

As always with these kind of posts, a bunch of rational people attempt to explain that the majority of perpetrators are British born and therefore have nowhere to be ‘sent back’ to, while others continue to argue ‘send them back’ regardless. Those pesky annoying facts eh? getting in the way of your narrative. How inconvenient they are.

I want to know why the Muslim community is silent on this matter. There is a problem and it needs to be addressed from within.

There is absolutely a connection with Islam and the grooming gangs. White girls are slags and kafir to some Muslim men.

Re Gordon Brown/ Tony Blair BBC Verify fact checked this and found that this never happened https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g2g7qgl1eo

The pertinent issue is that all alleged crimes should be investigated and all suspects and accused dealt with in the same way.

Whilst this will be unpopular, there also had to be some focus on parental responsibility and why and how young teenagers are out until the early hours. There is debate after debate on here about teenagers hanging about in the park towards dark. This is a good reason why they shouldn't be.

Prison

And you know who wasn’t being taken to these talks? Young, vulnerable girls in care without a single person in the world giving a damn about them.

It will happen time and time again unless we have some honest conversations.

For years we weren’t allowed to even call them Pakistani or Muslim gangs.

There was some fake memo circulating on twitter a few days ago

enough with the victim blaming it makes me sick!

This.
I watched Channel 4 The Fake Grooming gang scandal and a huge amount of damage was done by rumours spread on FB , Twitter et al.
The police had been investigating for nearly a year and all the right wing interference, slandering that went on could have undermined the investigation.

@DarkAndConfusingTimes you still haven't made any comments about the fact that the vast majority of these men are British citizens and were born here so there's nowhere to send them.

Why are the white community silent on it? Far more white men abuse than those from ethnic minorities. It obviously needs to be addressed from within.

You seem to think that misogyny is something only brown skinned men think. Yet one in four women will be abused in the UK and one in three will be sexually assaulted. All girls are slags according to some.

When was the last time you went on a rally?

Muslim Council has made several statements

Or do you mean individual Muslims or British-Pakistani citizens?

Bang goes the Good Friday agreement!

What I do not understand and this goes both for the rape gangs and also for the adults who groom boys for county line gangs. Why not give them hefty sentences and strip them of their assets including social housing? Build more prisons if necessary. Make the consequences of the crime as horrific as the actions that they have shown.

UK is far too soft touch on these crimes and too scared of some within the community who want to call policing, racism. This is why they have been allowed to flourish pretty much unchecked.

Maybe think about expanding your news sources?

I live in a city and have worked in this area, and I've seen far far more 'historical' child sex abuse cases where someone has as an adult come forward about their uncle or family friend or old bosses (people who typically hired kids under the table and then sexually groomed their 'favourites') who attacked them as a child than I do grooming gangs.

I find it's much more of an issue of people having fled the country so they're out of jurisdiction and we can't do anything. It can be very difficult to support victims in that situation. It also means it's out of our control entirely - if we have uncle pedo in our prisons or under our sexual offenders register and more cases come up, we can deal with it; if we've sent them wherever, there is basically fuck and all we can do.

And as a mixed race naturalised British citizen, I'm used to people thinking I should toe the line far more than most Brits. It's still uncomfortable thinking of situations I've seen in my work where people have been attacked, fought back and gone beyond what the court rules as 'reasonable self defence' (which varies widely), and knowing a significant minority of Brits think I should be deported from the country I've spent my whole adult life in if I ended up in that situation. That leaves a lot of people quite vulnerable.

Who would you fight for if your countries of nationality had a war? That’s your nationality.

Nationality is a legal definition that gives recognition, rights and responsibilities - it has never been about personal feelings. Plenty of immigrants would fight for the UK who can't afford to become citizens and conscientious objectors aren't stateless.

I’m talking specifically about the grooming gangs.

Not going to engage with the whataboutery. It is derailing and I’m beginning to think it is intentional.

I agree with both. Send immigrant law breakers back to their country, and don't take away the passport of a British born girl who was also groomer.

You still haven't acknowledged that you were wrong to associate immigrants with grooming gangs. Why?

I see a lot of "british-born" and some "UK citizenship".

Which is it - UK citizenship (which isn't necessarily british-born; can be naturalisation at any age from 1yr - 99yrs) or british-born (in which case, what happens to the non british-born uk citizen who commits the crime?)?