To think asking permission to take off a blazer is utterly ridiculous?

[ShowJumpSally]

My child's school has just moved into a new trust. Clearly it's one of those trusts as the latest email announces how children will be placed in internal exclusion or be suspended if they dare to wear a coat in the building or take their blazer off without asking permission.

Schools consistently moan about funding, there's a teaching retention crisis, teachers are overworked and leaving in their hoards, TAs are underpaid and in short supply, children's mental health is worse than ever, but somehow there's time and money to dish out internal exclusions if child gets hot and dares takes their blazer off without asking?

Aibu to say schools should try focussing their time, attention and money on the real issues instead of nonsense made up ones?
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She's often client-facing negotiating sales i.e. formal meetings.

Agree with this.

One of my friends worked in a well renowned private school - their uniform was not strictly enforced - but these pupil did fantastically well, were involved and interested in their education - the school paid no attention to reinforcing the uniform rules - they saw it as a harmless way for the pupils to express their teenage rebellion - my friend, is a bit of a traditionalist but even she could see the merit in it.

👏

Who said anything about punishing people for not being able to read, or organise an essay? These things are to be taught, and this can be done in engaging ways, using scaffolding for essays etc. Interestingly, dyslexia is most prevalent in English-speaking countries, which have a complex phonic code which needs to be explicitly taught - I recall being told that a Gujurati speaker could not be dyslexic when I was an English second language teacher, which I found quite illuminating. Dyslexia seems to have diminished somewhat by teaching phonics rather than whole-word reading strategies. The Dyslexia Association used to recommend teaching phonics to dyslexic DC.
The other difficulty schools have is that the school cannot be organised around the needs of a minority.

There is a correlation between schools with strong discipline and outcomes, because the school runs smoothly and students know what is expected as all teachers use the same discipline code and they are consistently backed up by the SLT. This means students can be taught and can learn in a safe environment without disruption.

@Grammarnut yes but how many children from those schools can't cope with that environment and end up leaving and being home schooled (or essentially left without a decent education).......

Selective mutism means the teacher will say, in appropriate circumstances, NM you need to take off your blazer?

@Grammarnut how would the teacher know if the child with selective mutism is too hot and wants to take off their blazer though?

Yeah, ok. And how are they going to ‘teach’ that exactly? Perhaps by starting with - you always have your blazer with you?

Ah, the whataboutery! Our school works with SEN kids and their families to ensure they have a positive school experience. This included adaptation around uniform.

@Liddlemoreaction - @phthia said THEY themselves would rather teach that, not that they expect school to teach it.

Teachers are psychic obvs 😂

@Grammarnut but you can have strong discipline without the rule you must ask to take your blazer off. Or are you saying all schools that don't have this one particular rule are chaotic and undisciplined?

The only argument I can see here (in general on this thread) is 'we must have rules to keep things in order'. Well yes we must, no one is disputing that but not a single person has been able to justify why 'ask permission to take your blazer off' is a necessary rule to have in order to ensure discipline and good behaviour.

@Liddlemoreaction so if a school can function perfectly fine with adaptions to the uniform - why the need for a uniform?

"Really not my job to be imaginative as to blue hair and arses hanging out. My job is to teach. Let me teach. What people are not understanding is just how difficult that can be - and how rules, however ridiculous you might find them, are needed to help us get the bloody teaching done."

The rules a good teacher focuses on are the rules for successful social interaction and coexisting.

Children who never wore uniform and were dressed by their parents from little will have a more sensible individual style. They will be drawn less to the extremes as soon as they are out of school.
The fact that almost all boys wear black tracksuits after school is direct consequence of having to wear uniform at school. It's actually really sad to see children who have zero expression through the clothes they pick to wear.

It truly isn't. One of my granddaughters is freezing all the time. The other boiling. This is not normal, healthy or necessary. M
Keeping a blazer on is not 'discipline'. It's bullying.
Would you do it at work? Remain boiling when you could take a layer off but you company won't allow it?

No need to strictly enforce putting on and taking off of jumpers, blazers etc. Workplaces that have a uniform also tend to have a uniform jacket that can be worn as necessary. They don't need to get supervisor's permission.

Nor do you need woven in badges rather than sewn on, or a gym kit and games kit that have school logos, or all the other little things that are subtle ways of ensuring only the "right kind of child" attends the school.

Men still wear suits in some jobs, but you don't see many senior professional women in suits nowadays.

"Yoou always have your blazer with you" is different from "you always wear your blazer unless you have sought and obtained permission to take it off".

Dyslexia tends to come with associated problems, difficulty in organising themself and their things as well as organising essays, difficulty in decoding and following complex instructions, etc.

Re behaviour:
https://open.substack.com/pub/fillingthepail/p/why-behaviour-matters?r=d980q&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=true
It's Greg Ashman, who is particularly against school shaming over behaviour codes.

Dyslexia seems to have diminished somewhat by teaching phonics rather than whole-word reading strategies.

This is not the case. There is a wealth of evidence out there showing how in particular synthetic phonics are detrimental as a learning method to dyslexic children. One short example: Why Phonics Doesn’t Work for Dyslexic Students | by Kathy Kamibayashi | Medium

Nor has dyslexia in any way diminished. It is common - prevalent even. Reports also suggest that schools are failing to refer for diagnosis perhaps as high a number as 80%. Schools 'failing to diagnose at least 80% of dyslexic pupils' - BBC News This is compounded by the fact that few diagnostic charities are available, their resources are limited and far too stretched, and it costs parents somewhere in the region of £600 to obtain a written diagnosis. A full dyspraxia screening and medical diagnosis (the two often go hand-in-hand, sometimes alongside ASD), costs just shy of £1000.

With this in mind, particularly in the less well-funded LEAs, a good many children who badly need support are falling through the net as a result of underfunding and under-resourcing. Our local schools, for one, are unable to refer children for dyslexia screening - parents must organise this themselves and there are too few organisations offering this service. Many parents simply cannot afford these sums and some are more able than others to advocate for their children. This is a national scandal.

Meanwhile, schools are concerning themselves with blazers.

" How do you honestly expect 1200 kids in one space to not become Lord of the Flies without rules?"

Sensible rules- fine. Taking your blazer off in 30 degrees centigrade is hardly going to lead to loss of civilisation.

If several students have asked to take off their blazers and the windows have been opened it isn't rocket science to make the suggestion. And rules cannot be individually targetted. Everyone is there to learn.
The blazer rule will be part of a raft of rules leading to a disciplined school where all teachers use the same code and all teachers are supported in using that code. Behaviour is important. Non-teachers don't seem to grasp how disruptive requests to go to the toilet, have a drink etc can be, and are routinely used by students to disrupt a lesson.

@Grammarnut but it's hardly disruptive for a child to quietly remove their blazer and hang it on their chair while the teacher is teaching.
The teacher doesn't even need to stop talking.