Elon Musk and Racism

[raincoatwarmcoatlongcoat]

Inspired by the other long running thread. I keep reading that he tweets and retweets racist comments. Can anyone link any or all of them please? I see tweets over illegal immigration, as opposed to immigration, but not racist?

So instead of opinions please can people post the actual words used or retweeted? Or anything he said in interviews, word for word?

Thanks!

Do we have evidence that 'not wanting to appear racist' is still a problem when investigating crimes like the grooming gangs? I know it was in the past.

I didn't say a single thing about you. I didn't even mention you in my response to the post by Vannymcvan, which also made no mention of you.

So, not sure why you are accusing me of undermining you or making an (sic) hominem arguments.

But your reaction to what I said is interesting.

But there are sharia councils and actually if you are plucked from a remote village in Pakistan and don't speak English and have a limited education are you going to be fully aware that what's happening to you, isn't actually legal in the UK?

Eg sharia marriages and divorces and female rights.

Unfortunately we have allowed a two tier system to operate here which might mean the derogation of some women and girls.

The law should be upheld and promoted in school that absolutely nothing comes before the laws of this land, nothing.

I'm not a fan of America but I do like pledging allegiance to the flag.

I also think we need to follow some European countries and ban the full burka here.

I think that will only be solved in a new enquiry.

Will it? Because I don't see how an inquiry looking into crimes from 15 years ago which is what people seem to be calling for, in order to decide whether Starmer should remain prime minster and other people should be sacked, will solve the question of whether grooming gangs are currently operating and not being dealt with properly because of their race at all.

Don't you ever look at Iran, Syria, Afghanistan, UAE, Egypt etc. and think "hmm, maybe not a good idea"?

And don't say "it can never happen here", because they really are famous last words.

How would it happen in the UK? What do you mean by "it"?

There are many groups of men. If YOU go straight to muslim grooming gangs that is on you. I actually have 'men who say they are women' at the forefront of my mind, so maybe you need to reflect on your assumptions.

Any full investigation should be pinpointing what the groups of men have in common. And we should be able to risk assess accordingly.

In terms of muslim men, are any Imams coming out to condemn any of the men in their communities and ostractising them? See also, the cover ups in the church, the Labour party and their relationship with PIE and the SNP and the seedy shadows of the man who was involved in starting PIE. It is all related and we really need to get to the bottom of these networks. These people are mainly still there in the background.

I want to know exactly why the police were so invested in protecting so many groups of men. I want to know why the care homes were so invested in letting men take the girls. And boys to be fair. And how this protection has been brought forward into protecting another high profile group of men, currently the ones who say they are women.

There are so many ways that children are being endangered, doing town by town inquiries would take forever. It is all an institutional problem that will never be sorted until it is weeded out of the whole system, if ever.

You maybe need to look at the history of Iran and what happened to the Lefties there. They'd tell you themselves only they are no longer here.

Well I suppose if Reform UK PLC were to become the government and go power mad, Farage and Co. might attempt to suppress us lefties. I don't think they'd murder us, though tbf.

Oh yeah, gosh you’re so right. We’re so at risk of being forced to wear burquahs and getting flogged here. Blimey, the racism and scaremongering from some people is off the scale.

There are many groups of men. If YOU go straight to muslim grooming gangs that is on you. I actually have 'men who say they are women' at the forefront of my mind, so maybe you need to reflect on your assumptions.

@AlisonDonut I reflected on my assumptions and I decided that because you had jumped in the middle of a conversation about Muslim grooming gangs and Muslim attitudes to women it was entirely reasonable to think that you might be referring to Muslim men when talking about 'these men'. The first half of your post was also talking about child sex abuse and things that happened with those Muslim men and grooming gangs.

I don't think that's on me at all.

A very reasonable assumption @noblegiraffe as she does just seem to want to talk about Muslim/asian men and has been doing for ages. If she has suddenly changed her narrative to now be talking about trans men she should have made that far more obvious.

she was talking about a “ring of protection “ been drawn around groups of men who have committed sex abuse, in a conversation discussing the Asian grooming gangs sex abuse and whether or not there should be an enquiry. I think it’s very disingenuous for her to try and pretend she nkw wasn’t talking about Muslim men and try and present that as some sort of “gotcha” moment to nobelgiraffe, hinting she is jumping to (racist) assumptions.

i also must have missed the news stories about groups of trans men committing child sex abuse and having rings of protection drawn around them. When did that happen? Shocking. I assume their must have been some big cases if she is so concerned about this.

1 in 4 people in the world are Islamic. It is also the fastest growing religion in the world. It's naive to think that the UK and perhaps other parts of Europe won't be significantly inhabited by Islamic people in however many years. Where there are problems with integration then these issues, such as the rape gangs, will only increase.

Do people think countries don't change? Their economies, political positions, allies, demographics just remain static forever? Read history.

It's ironic that those who are the most hostile to Christianity are the most tolerant to another patriarchal, women's rights denying religion. That's without mentioning those adherents who are violent and would seek to follow down the path of countries like Iran and worse.

Let's see what happens in Syria, but I'm not holding my breath.

Have I?

I just want to talk about Muslim men? And have done so for ages? I'm not sure I ever typed the word Muslim until today.

I've been talking about men who say they are women [not trans men as that is women who say they are men] for donkeys years. Just because you don't engage in those discussions you are seeing what you want to see.

All those countries are Muslim-majority, by quite a large amount. Some of them have always been theocratic to varying degrees; some have been relatively secular at times and become more religion-dominated at other times. None, to my knowledge, has ever been a true liberal democracy.

The UK has been a democracy for a century; and has not been a theocracy for over three centuries. Though the latter must be qualified by saying that we do have an official state church; that one part of the UK was embroiled in serious religious conflict involving terrorism and near-civil war until the 90s; and that some of the liberal secular reforms that we now take for granted are of very recent origin (e.g. homosexuality was only decriminalized in the 1960s, and equal age of consent and marriage equality are of much more recent origin than that). If there are religious intrusions into taw and government, they are far more likely to come from conservative Christians than from Muslims. Muslims are around 5% of the population, so even if a quarter want Sharia law, that's a tiny proportion of the population. Although the Christian Right have far less power in the UK than the USA, there are a lot more Jim McAllisters and Sammy Wilsons and Jacob Rees Moggses and Ann Widdecombes in positions of power than there are right-wing Muslims.

There is some risk that the Christian Right and Muslim Right and right-wing of smaller religions might collaborate on some socially conservative issues, and the secular do need to guard against that. But that doesn't mean that there's the slightest risk that we're all going to be turned into Iran or Afghanistan!

I am talking about on this thread. What you talk about on either other threads or off MN is irrelevant. The direct conversation you were partaking in at the time of your post was about Muslim groups of men and child abuse. I ask you again, where are the cases of groups of Trans men committing child abuse and being protected? It is so obvious what you were talking about and you don’t even have the guts to admit it.

Trans men are females.

I don't think you have any idea what has been going on. Males are routinely protected as groups, we call them 'sacred castes' and the system always, always protects them over girls. And kids in general. It is endemic. And institutional.

Which is why I didn't mention any specific types of men and stated why I think a full enquiry into why groups of men always seem to be protected.

My bad, I meant trans women (aka men)

Focus on Muslim grooming gangs and you are missing a far wider picture of abuse, cover-ups and failings.

That’s what NobelGiraffe said ages ago which you are now agreeing with. Maybe it’s what you meant the whole time 🤷‍♀️. But surely you realise when the conversation was very much centred on a cover up about Muslim/asian grooming gangs and you talk about a “ring of protection around these men” people will also think you are talking about Muslim/asian men.

if you really meant trans women. Or all men you should have been clearer.

so I’m very glad you now agree there is no need to focus on Muslim/asian men.

And yet only about 15 years ago nobody could have believed that men would be permitted to access women's single sex spaces and yet here we are.

I was born in the 70s. Quite a bit has changed on the geopolitical map since then.

Yes I said 'groups of men'.

One issue with one of the 'groups of men' is why paedophiles and men with humumgous levels of child rape aren't even jailed. Why? Who signed off on the lax 'punishment' of these men?

No. You said “these groups of men”. Which comes across very differently in the context of the previous posts and general tone of the thread.

Remember this entire thread is about racism. Not sexism or feminism or the patriarchy.

Other men presumably. They run the show, they can do what they want.