Son has just told us he is non binary

[Chipshopninja]

13 years old

Wants us to use they/them

He came out as Bi a a couple of years ago and I was fine with that but this has really hit me hard

I'm terrified that this is going to lead to hormones and surgery.

Don't know why I'm posting tbh but feeling crappy because I didn't handle it well. I cried.

I can't call him my son anymore

He's my only child

Has anyone else been through this?

Sorry quoted myself instead of you - but my answer is in the comment below

This is kind of what I was getting at - what does it feel like to KNOW you are male or female if that makes sense? I know the stereotypes and I guess that’s what I mean. I like a lot of things that are traditionally male orientated (I played with transformers and sticklebricks as a kid, I don’t bother with make up & nice hair/clothes, I love watching football, gambling/fruit machines, I’ve always felt more comfortable chatting with men that I don’t know than women, etc - but is that purely down to how I was brought up (very male heavy environment) or is it something deeper?)

my point I was very crudely trying to make is how does any of us truly know our gender? If we are in agreement that sex and gender are not the same thing (which I don’t think they are) then it’s got to be confusing for teenagers to navigate it all! Is gender just about fitting a stereotype? Or is it more?

Honestly - it makes my head hurt just to think about it. I stay as she/her because society sees me as a woman. And it’s easier to just conform. I don’t know if I’m explaining it properly!

You are saying you would probably not be on mumsnet if you were a man and this is proof or an example that you have a female gender identity. 😳

I think for me, knowing that you're a man / woman is also about it not feeling wrong to be constantly identified that way or be living as that gender everyday - even if you don't conform to typical gender stereotypes (as in you don't really notice your gender because it's right if that makes sense).

I've never had the experience of being trans or non-binary, but people describe the experience of feeling in the wrong body / gender, and I guess it's hard to imagine if you've never really had to consciously think about your gender in that way because it just feels natural.

But agree it's hugely complicated and I definitely wouldn't know how to approach the topic with a teenage child.

No one knows what it feels likes to be male or female. You can only know what it feels like to be you. That's why being female or male is nothing to do with how you feel inside it's a material biological fact. Woman is the word for an adult human female so nothing to do with how you feel inside but a material biological fact.

What i mean is that pretty much everything I do relates to my identity as a woman, because that is how I operate in the world.

Anyway we obviously won't agree and will just go round in circles 😅 so I'll leave it there.

I only got involved because i genuinely find it very confusing when people say that their gender/sex whatever you want to call it does not impact how they relate to the world, or that they have no concept of their identity as a man / woman outside of their anatomy. Your identity as a woman has never impacted you in anyway, or shaped anything about how you think of yourself or relate to other people around you? I can't imagine what that would be like

Man/woman outside of their anatomy ??😬

He's 13 and a well adjusted happy healthy child who is just looking for a way to make sense of his place in the world. No need to change or do anything, just keep on loving him. He may or may not feel the same when he is older but no harm was ever done by waiting it out.

If this is what our children have to contend with no wonder they are confused.

Just taking the word gender out of it for a second - you must have ideas about your identity as a person? And the fact that you're a woman will surely come in to that in some way? Are you a mother, daughter, sister, wife? And do those categories have meaning for you, and wider social meanings, that are historically and culturally related to ideas about women? There's so much meaning and history behind all of these words and concepts that feeds into how we think about ourselves.

Any goodnight and apologies to OP for this rabbit hole on your thread 😅

The school would feel my wrath . That’s your kid you deserve to know what’s going on in his life. Honestly I’m 40 and the world’s a joke . Full of brain dead sheep following the next ridiculous fade. I wish you luck , i doubt he’s serious. Just hope for the best and prepare for the worst.

If I am a mother, daughter, sister or wife it’s because I am biologically female. So how does a biological man who identifies as female gender get to experience being a mother etc.
You are kind of saying that identity is wrapped up in your experience of your biology.
The opposite of the trans gender trend.

Spot on there . Nail clearly hit on the head.

I would be upset at the school though. Your son was able to tell you so think the school are being a bit absurd. I could maybe understand if your child is from a cultural or religious background that is against it, perhaps that's why the have the policy?

I'm saying that our identities are relational, cultural and social (as I think I've made clear I think that trans women are women)

In sport are trans women actual women?

No- I've decided to be a transphobe when it comes to sport just to make things interesting.

I really am going to bed now and not engaging anymore because this is so way off the thread topic. And arguing on the internet is pointless - can't believe i got sucked into it. So when I don't reply it's not because I think you've won the argument and somehow managed to change my mind😅

Schools shouldn’t even be entertaining it or using different pronouns it’s just fuelling this nonsense.

My view is it's usually down to either:

• Attention seeking/following trends
• Mental health issues
• Being confused or ashamed of their sexuality

Your outlook regarding fairness in women’s sport is very 2022. Thankfully most people believe in fairness and safety for women in sport nowadays.

I don't see what the issue is it's just a pronoun, I changed my name when I was a young un & no-one minded that. It's not like they're having a full sex change they're experimenting & I think we have to go with it as parents. If not I'd definitely not be ignoring it, I'd be talking about it & trying to understand at the very least.

So sorry your heartfelt post got ignored. There are countless parents like you, beside themselves with worry as young people get caught up in this ideology. Adults know that the young change their minds and that the brain doesn't reach full maturity until 25 (I think). Cass has clearly evidenced that puberty blockers drugs are untested and the brutal surgery done in the name of sex change is experimental with countless problems and negative consequences.

These young people are being gaslit into giving up their future good physical (and often mental) health, their fertility. Their rage when they reach maturity and realise all that they've given up will be immense. I hope you have support in real life as your child navigates this. They never stop being our children, even as they negotiate adulthood.

I’m surprised school have gone along with it without telling you. My child has become non binary but I found out as the school phoned for my permission for them to change their name on the system so that other than for official exams, their name is their new chosen name and pronouns are now they/them.

We haven’t fought it either. Decided to more you push against it the more they fight. So we just went with ‘yea, whatever makes you happy’ and we get to remember to use their new name and pronouns. It’s very hard though when you named you child and in your mind the they/them pronouns ass plural.

I even went so far as to buy some non binary flagged gifts for Xmas this year and a couple of personalised items with the new name on.

Hard to say if it will last or if it’s a phase. My child has a friendship group of similar friends and most of their friends have had their pronouns and names changed for a while. Some have gone through many names. I get lost as to if they have new friends or the same friends with new names.

And as for surgery. I don’t believe that non binary means they want to chop of bits or add bits. Mine has still said they are my son/daughter (not specifying for this post) and that they are still a sister/brother despite those terms being gendered.

Is your child also neurodivergent? Mine is and I suspect their friends are (mostly un diagnosed the friends but mine has an ASD diagnosis). A friend of mine who’s DH is a child psychiatrist specialising in gender identity says that most of these children who chose non binary or gender fluid identities are ND. Struggling with fitting in and general identity as a ND person can be hard and confusing.

What’s confused members of our family is that they’ve assumed that my DC is bisexual or gay. However I’ve had to explain that we haven’t even discussed sexuality and that is a completely different subject to gender identity. My DC hasn’t had any romantic relationships as of yet despite being an older teen and could end up being a sexual or one of the many other sexuality labels offered these days and we will embrace that when it comes up.

I had crushes on boys at school when I was 9. This was the 80s, so no social media.