To think that they could roll out mounjaro in less than 12 years?

[caffelattetogo]

I thought this was 12 months when I read it first - is it me or does 12 years seem like a long time to prescribe for all eligible patients? Particularly as we are told so many expensive medical problems are caused by obesity.

www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/national/uk-today/24823250.nhs-mounjaro---will-eligible/

The thing is, it doesn’t matter why people get fat. If it’s medical, depression, food addiction, greed.. it doesn’t matter. If these drugs work, and they are available for a low cost, and the person knows the risks and side effects then let them crack on.

I'm on HRT Have been for over a decade. I haven’t ‘cheated at menopause’ because I have no hot flushes, no loss of bone density, no anxiety. I know the medical risks of taking HRT long term and I’m happy to take them.

How many hours a week do you work and volunteer out of interest?! Do your kids do many activities outside the home?

Because seriously, I never have time just to myself to do things like go to the gym (if the gym wasn't a ridiculous amount of money). I cook from fresh because that is where I get enjoyment, it's my zen zone. But it is bloody hard when you have 40 minutes between finishing work and having to get sons out to training.

But that's not fair on all the women who suffered through menopause with no help before. Why should they suffer but you get to take a shortcut? ;) ;)

(please read with heavy sarcasm!)

50years ago is only the 70s.
People still lived to be quite old

From news reports and the nhs this is very much a growing issue that wasn’t such a big one before. Hence the research into medication such as mountjaro.

Im sure there were, however,some obese people then just not as many as now and definitely not in the numbers in children.

So what’s changed as pp unthread said it was biology, has that really changed in 50 years?

Life has changed. I outlined some of it above. Meat is cheap. More processed food.

And I know how long ago 50 years was. Like I say, I would probably be dead or dying now 50 years ago.

You’re absolutely right. I’ll order some vaginal dryness on Temu right now so that I can even things up

So not biology then, ( for some at least )
That’s just what I was questioning

I noted up thread that the foods available now and the use of cars etc is very different from pre 70s and could be a reason for the change.

But what ever the reason, do you think people shouldn't be allowed to use it for weight? Do you think the same about previous weight loss drugs, or just this one?

For those of us interested in the research, there are clear, undeniable links to societal levels of obesity and the UPF in our food environment. The higher UPF, the higher the obesity rates. This isn't about people driving instead of walking to the shops, this is about edible, food-like substances that drive hunger, reduce satiety, and have addictive properties on every single shelf in those shops.

It's easier to point the finger of blame at individuals, though...

@SavingTheBestTillLast regarding what's changed in the last 50 years.

The most pertinent to me is that now our biological faults are diagnosed and treated.

My mum killed herself when she was 46 due to undiagnosed and untreated depression, possibly a symptom of her PCOS, depression is a known symptom.

Her mum dropped dead at 60 suddenly of a heart attack, she had had a number of strokes over her lifetime, the first being in her early 30s. Heart disease and circulation issues are also symptoms of PCOS, Diabetes and Insulin resistance.

Her mum died in her 50s, cause unknown.

All struggled with their weight from being teenagers.

My mum was very careful to cook healthy, from scratch meals and limit snacks, my dad and brothers were healthy weight, if not a bit on the skinny side all their lives but from age 10 when puberty began I was always struggling, I was in weight watchers by the time I was 11. It was only when I was trying to conceive that doctors finally agreed to run tests and they showed high testosterone, cysts on my ovaries, insulin resistance. Even once diagnosed they wouldn't actually treat, just told me to lose weight. Losing weight pre-WLI for me meant no carbs other than those in green veg, no fruit, no bread, no pasta, no root vegetables and restricting calories to under 1000 a day. Anything more and any carbs then I did not lose weight. I tried everything, it was miserable, I would be so hungry constantly and feel weak, my hair would fall out, but even increasing to 1200 calories a day resulted in a gain.

I did lose enough weight through that diet to get regular periods and conceive, was diagnosed with Gestational Diabetes and put on insulin and metformin, and ended up losing a couple of stone while pregnant, but as soon as DD was born the GP told me I no longer needed diabetes treatment as it was solved by birth of placenta and discharged me. Not one of the GPs I saw after that over the years would do anything other than tell me I was fat and suggest I eat less and move more.

Till last year when I diagnosed myself with Diabetes, got proof by buying myself a continuous Glucose Monitor and presented at A&E with glucose levels so high the app was pinging me with messages to seek immediate medical advice.

So i guess from my family history and anecdotal evidence, what's changed is that fat women with hormonal problems used to die younger and not clutter up the world with fat older women.

I know nothing about previous weight loss drugs and next to nothing about this one.
I’m hearing about it and learning lots on MN
If you read my past posts you’ll see I have simply questioned use, especially whether it’s likely to be long term.
Questionned nhs funded tummy tucks
Questionned the rise in obesity and its reasons.

I have no idea if it’s a good thing, some say it is, some on here question it.
Im still very much on the fence especially if it’s used without regular support in other areas……eg mental health, exercise….whatever is deemed relevant by the user and their health professional.

Tbh I’m just interested

Agree there was a thread ( last week I think ) that mentioned a documentary about how addictive UPF foods are.
I really should watch that

Maybe UPF manufacturers should be more regulated and even taxed, like the sugar tax. It might take some potentially ‘ dangerous’ foods and / or ingredients off the shelves

Yes, there is a lot of work to be done to get UPF out of our food system.

Do you not think if it was that easy, there would be no fat people?

Yes, 12 years is ridiculous for what is a comparatively cheap drug.

Why the worry of NHS funded tummy tucks if you don't worry about those for people using slimming world etc?

Also, a very quick Internet search on "tummy tuck nhs" will reveal that basically no one gets them on the NHS. It's a private paid-for cosmetic procedure.

I think there's a lot of truth in that. And I have already mentioned that I have seen documentaries about the general public in the 40s and 50s which include plenty of fat people.

It's a bit of a myth that 'nobody got fat'. It's a myth that won't die, despite the number of us with fat family members who were alive (and fat) at a time when, supposedly, nobody was fat.

My grandmother was fat. Working class, born in the 1920s, only ever ate home-cooked because that's all there was, worked in a factory, on her feet all day, whilst raising three kids, didn't drive until she was in her 50s and yet she was still fat. And wasn't the only one in the village, either.

Even the fictional films and TV programmes don't all bear out the 'nobody was fat' theory if you look beyond Hollywood.

I was born in the early 70s and I certainly don't recognise this 'fat free' world that apparently existed.

It's up the manufacturers to create enough to satisfy demand at the moment.

The patent for Mounjaro expires in 2036 (12 years time!!) - at that point there will be generics and more of them. There are likely to have been a dozen GLP1 agonists by then that work better though

Fat ancestors in my family, and i saw photos of an ex boyfriend's family from the 1900s-1930s..they were almost all fat. He and his parents were overweight as well.

I hate these comments (the original one - why can't people just eat homemade food?). I get this from a very judgemental, and skinny, family member whose husband does all the cooking.

Not everyone is able to cook. Some people were never taught, and / or work 2 or 3 jobs and don't have the energy to make meals from scratch.

Some people are disabled and don't have the time or energy to cook, even if they desperately want to. I do my best to eat good food - today I had a prepackaged salad and cooked chicken breast for lunch. But sometimes you want the comfort of a warm meal - especially when you are feeling very low and are in pain.

A lot of people don't seem to understand that other's circumstances vary from theirs, and we can't all do the same thing.

I have no idea what you’re talking about re slimming world.
I don’t even know what that is……some sort of diet group 🤷‍♀️?
Id question things like tummy tucks for everyone if it meant the nhs couldn’t afford life saving surgery or drugs for others.
If it’s deemed a mental health issue then maybe that’s another issue, saving lives is key imo.

Thanks
I did ask that question upthread
I should have googled, 🥴

Slimming world is a very well known slimming group.

The NHS doesn't give out tummy tucks to anyone who wants one. They only do them in very exceptional circumstances so don't worry, they won't be giving them out to everyone losing weight on mounjaro. If people want them they can go private, as they do at the moment.

I think a fundamental life skill should be to either learn, via the internet or good old fashioned cookbooks, how to feed yourself healthily. It is both healthier and cheaper.

My DS’s friend was on his own from Boxing Day so DS and another friend went round and they shopped and cooked a full Christmas dinner from scratch. If 3 pretty clueless 20 yr olds can do it I’m sure that most people are capable.
They did FaceTime me to check on cooking times and prep but they produced a meal most people would be proud of.
DS can make chicken nuggets from scratch and has been cooking healthy meals at uni, he does succumb to fast food after a night out, UberEats is too easy and Dominoes bend over backwards for the student trade.

I cook from scratch most evenings. Even when I worked full time and had the school run to contend with I cooked. It can be a combination of preparing the night before, slow cooking, pasta and rice meals that do t take hours. We are not talking about a full roast dinner daily. I had a rule when I was working that it couldn’t take more than 30mins prep.

DH on the other hand can warm things ups up and do the basics. I’ve always found cooking relaxing and my wind down time after work. I use the time in the kitchen to pre prep the following days meal or do paperwork and other life stuff like filling the washing machine, going through the post etc so once dinner is over I can put my feet up.